Bush takes large lead on Kerry: latest polls

[Cowperson]

Time management skills? Hmmmm, aren't you the rocket surgeon who brought up the PNAC two years ago?

Nope.

I said PNAC came up here on the off-topic board. I didn't say I brought it up.

The left wing peaceniks brought it into debate as evidence neo-cons had been planning war even before they were brought to power.

You know . . . your argument. A "secret" agenda that people didn't vote for and wouldn't have if they knew what was coming via Dick Cheney and the neo-cons pulling the strings on a President who had been outside the USA only twice in his lifetime and was obviously weak on foreign policy.

Two years AFTER an election? Seems YOU might be the one with the time management skill issue. Nice to bring up an election issue (as you put it) two years after the election.

Take it up with yourself. You're the guy arguing it.


So I guess you are saying that the obvious connection between the PNAC and the Bush Administration should be ignored because they are already in office? The corruption and the illegal dealings are okay because these guys are already in office and that makes them unproachable? Makes sense. More brillance from the bovine party!

Is there anywhere in this thread where I've remarked on PNAC's relevance one way or the other?

I presume the "corruption and illegal dealings" are something you were going to enlighten us about in excruciating detail before I rudely interrupted and asked if PNAC was what you were talking about. You know, in your post where you were talking about stuff going on in 1997, before the election.

You're sounding very much like the apologists that were rampant during the late 30's when the Nazi's were building up to their sweep across Europe. No harm in allowing a bunch of fanatics access to a strong military. Oh, and don't worry about those nasty Weapons of Mass Destruction that these looney tunes have access to, they wouldn't use them unless they really had to. .

You're comparing Cheney/Bush to the Nazi party of Germany?

Wait, what's that sound? Oh nothing, just the fanatical right goose stepping their way around the globe! Maybe you can find a web site or a link about the Nazi buildup and learn something on the subject. God knows we'd hate to have you turn to a book and read something that actually had some fact checking done on it (not like 95% of the web sites out there)

You're the only one in the world with facts checked? How's the megalomania going?

<-- using one of these makes it okay to be a condesending prick, right Cow?

Go right ahead. If you can't handle MiG's, don't fly in MiG Alley.

Cowperson

[Cowperson]

Adding to the original post, Democrats today say the Bush Bounce will fade and the election will tighten up once again.

http://abcnews.go.com/wire/Politics/...0905_1118.html

Also, American Muslim leaders say they're uncertain who they'll be endorsing:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,131522,00.html

Cowperson

[Looger]

simply amazing.

i read and re-read the article, couldn't find much at all aboot the electoral college setup!

the president is not voted by popular vote, i mean texas will be overwhelmingly in fovour of dubya i would think, and massachussets won't vote for the elephant, but where is the talk of the show-me-state, or illinois, or fifteen plus other states that could swing before the election?

as for the mudslinging, it will only get worse. the republicans are historically better at it but the democrats may show that rumsfeld-hussein handshake clip!

i am by the way pretty much sure that i would vote for neither of these guys as people.

bush left the slimiest trail since tricky dicky on his way up, and kerry has done what i consider slightly unpatriotic things in the past (though this is after doing some patriotic things that bush didn't do, like go to war in the first place!).

as for the actual election issues, i am not a big fan of the iraq invasion, due in large part to the issues summed up very nicely here:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5279743/

i may be a simple caveman but i do know this:
starting something like the iraq occupation and then changing direction in the middle of it (ie. right now) may be more disastrous to america than any other course of action. a democratic president might do some murky stuff there, and now is not the time for indecisive policy.

as for michael moore he is a perfect counter to rush limbaugh - both are technically wrong but loudmouthed.

i think bush is very wrong but america is right in the pit with him, better finish whatever you started...

[Displaced Flames fan]

Lanny....you are too much....the Bush administration is a 'fringe element' and is going down the same path as the Nazis?

I can't stop laughing at how junior-high you've become.

[CaramonLS]

Hey Dis what are your thoughts on Halliburton?

http://corpwatch.radicaldesigns.org/article.php?id=6008

Heres an interesting article...

[Looger]

not too much news there...

what sold it for me was before the war started, before shot one had been fired, the contracts were signed to rebuild what was still standing.

that is what's called malicious intent.

[BlackArcher101]

Americans are going to vote for Bush... the one who gave us this wonderful video clip? (458KB mov file)

Well, I guess if the liberals can get top vote in Canada, why not Bush in America.

Oh, and by all means Cowperson and Lanny... keep going. This is entertaining.

[Thunderball]

Originally posted by Looger@Sep 6 2004, 12:04 AM
not too much news there...

what sold it for me was before the war started, before shot one had been fired, the contracts were signed to rebuild what was still standing.

that is what's called malicious intent.

One man's malicious intent is another man's methodical and rational look at the outcome of what will most likely happen.

Of course there were contracts given to companies before the bombs hit the ground, they had to have possessed some sort of plan... I mean they knew it was gonna happen, the UN stuff was a last ditch effort to make it 100% legit, rather than 95% legit.

And if I recall, Halliburton was given so many contracts because they were one of very few companies big enough to actually undertake the massive work needed out of all the companies of the nations who chose to help the US that bid. (of course Cheney's connections helped a lot... an awful lot... but there's no denying Halliburton is a huge company easily capable of the contracts it received)

As for this Bush = Hitler stuff... wow. Just wow. There's no hidden agenda, its widely published, its just nationalistic policy. When Canada does it, we call it Trudeaumania, when the US does it, its a preamble to Fascism?

Frankly they are both poor choices, but either one would be better than what we have sitting in office.

[TheCommodoreAfro]

Michael Moore is no Rush Limbauagh. Rush has never been on the cover of the Rolling Stone!

[Looger]

don't know aboot the bush=hitler stuff...

but this i know for sure - how it would look to me if contracts were signed on rebuilding a country i lived in, i mean give me a break.

those contracts are dripping with blood.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally posted by Looger@Sep 6 2004, 07:47 AM
don't know aboot the bush=hitler stuff...

but this i know for sure - how it would look to me if contracts were signed on rebuilding a country i lived in, i mean give me a break.

those contracts are dripping with blood.

Like they were planning on winning and what they were going to do after they won.

One mans dripping in blood is another mans plan for a post war rebuilding.

[transplant99]

Getting back to the original topic...

Looks like Kerry is reeling in some old names to rejuvenate a very stagnant campaign. Clearly he needs to do something before he slides into the vast wasteland of sitting ducks.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/09/06/...taff/index.html

[EddyBeers]

I would not count out Kerry just yet, there is a lot of time left. If the insurgents do as I expect them to, October could be a bloody month. If that happens, I am sure that the RNC will be replayed over and over again, what with this safer world and all. There is a lot of time for events to unfold and affect the race. Nice to see Kerry on message on the domestic front again this morning. If I was him I would stay on that, since he can not win the election fighting on the foreign front. Bush will not talk about the domestic front, so if I was Kerry I would focus on it and wait to see if something happens on the international scene.

[Lanny_MacDonald]

Originally posted by Displaced Flames fan@Sep 6 2004, 05:48 AM
Lanny....you are too much....the Bush administration is a 'fringe element' and is going down the same path as the Nazis?

I can't stop laughing at how junior-high you've become.

Neo-Cons are not the fringe element? WTF? On what planet? I can't believe how freakin' stupid you've become. Any group that promotes imperialism through military might is a fringe element IMO, and a damn dangerous one. If anyone thinks otherwise they are freakin idiots as well. In a world where a lot of nations already have nuclear weapons, and the weapons are available on the blackmarket as well, invasion of other countries to further your view of what is democracy is not a smart thing to do. All its going to take is one country to get an itchy trigger finger and this thing goes terribly wrong and the whole world pays for it.

I want to know what right the United States has to invade any country that did not provoke them? Iraq did NOT provoke the United States into this engagement. They may not have been complying to UN Weapons Sanctions like the US had wanted, but the other countries in the world seemed to be satisfied. If they were not satisfied they would be on the bandwagon and party of the so call coalition (just how many swimmers are there in this coalition anyways?). Of course some moron is going to toss out the Food-for-Oil conspiracy, but just like the WMD scare, where is the evidence? Where are the UN sanctions against these countries that committed these violations of international law? There aren't any because its another fabrication by the Americans to justify their war in Iraq to secure the oil fields and develop a base from which to control the region.

What right does the US have to tell anyone what they can and cannot do within their own borders? Since when does one of the most morally corrupt nations on the planet have the right to tell someone what is right and what is wrong? These morons don't have a grip on their own country and they are marching around the globe telling other nations what is right and what is wrong, under the guise of their own national security? And you people fall for it? As Tranny likes to say, Wow! I guess when the US decides to bend Canada over for the Alberta tar sands , through either economic pressure, political or military intervention, the tune will change quickly?

I don't know how more people do not see the startling similarities between components of the present US administration and the Nazi's in their infancy. The Nazi's of the mid thirties were a party that was considered on the extreme right (like Neo-Conservatives in today's world). They got elected using German pride as their primary platform, using the last war as a fear device and the strength of the German people as their mantra. They cast anyone who was not a Nazi an enemy of the country, just like the Republicans did at the RNC this past week. While some are going to say that this was electioneering it does not change that this is very strong language, similar language to that which was used 70 years ago. The Nazi's wanted Germany to become as great as she was prior to the Great War and were busy ramping up their military to levels equal that which the Kaiser had for WWI. The Nazi's were also bent on expanding their influence in the region and securing their national security as well, so they invaded countries that were "perceived threats" as well. They did so to expand their national reserves and to develop potential bases to launch further campaigns. They were expanding their political ideals, enforcing them on other countries against their will, through military might. The Nazi's had a plan and a list of nations they wanted to defeat. The Americans supposedly have a similar list, in attaining their goal of defeating terror. Now this is where the Americans have a huge advantage. They already have military bases around the world, and agreements to sustain these bases for the forseeable future, which makes their ability to launch attacks that much easier. There is no parallel here? Since when did the word "globalization" or term "global economy" give one nation the right to invade others to forward its own interests? The world sat back and let the Nazi's take their first steps toward a similar goal and they are doing the same for the US.

Now, getting on to the "War Against Terror", why are the Americans not up in arms about what is going on in Russia with the Chechyns? Is this not as bad as what happened in New York? Is this not a gross display of terrorism that needs to be dealt with? What about ridding the world of dictators? What about what is going on in Sudan and the ruthless dictator there? Why are the Americans not all of this like a fat chick on a Smartie. This should be an easy battle for them as the Sudanese have no defense to speak of. The answers are easy. They don't achieve the goal of "accepting responsibility for America's unique role in preserving and extending an international order friendly to our security, our prosperity, and our principles." Seems like they want to force their way of life and doing things onto other nations. While most of you feel that a McDonalds on every corner is a good thing, the majority of the world does not, and they have every right to feel that way. The United States has no right to tell any nation how they should run their country and treat their people when the United States is a world leader in so many social problems in its own right.

All you young guys need to talk to your grand parents, if they are old enough to have seen the war. My father saw it and he's damn worried about where this world is headed. He says the similiarities are scary. That's from someone who lived it. But of course we know better, because we get to watch the news and hear the talking heads tell us exactly what the government has approved which information has been released. People tend to think that we are "free" and hear the truth from the media. What they forget is that all broadcasting agencies are regulated and gets much of their information from government sources. We get one side of the story, the side that the government wishes us to get. We are trained to turn our noses up at all others and call them propaganda. Seems to me the populous has bought into the mind control game that the war department needs to be successful. People talk about democracy, yet they refuse to use the most important responsibility of the concept, and that is to question. We are the government and we are the oversight. The minute we stop asking questions is the minute that corruption takes hold and the fringe takes advantage of this freedom. It happened in the past and will happen in the future. Our responsibility is to stop that by demanding evidence (nee proof) before allowing unilateral action to be taken by any nation.

(BTW... what is the difference between what the Nazi's did in Poland, the Soviets did in Czechslovakia or in Afghanistan? Or what about American actionsin Haiti, Panama, Nicaragua, etc.? I know these are junior high school questions, but please feel free to educate me as to what the difference is for one country versus another.)

[Displaced Flames fan]

CamaronLS...what's with the drive-by one liners regarding The Daily Show and Halliburton? Maybe illustrating a point would create some discussion.

Lanny....you need help.

[Displaced Flames fan]

Originally posted by EddyBeers@Sep 6 2004, 03:22 PM
Bush will not talk about the domestic front, so if I was Kerry I would focus on it and wait to see if something happens on the international scene.

He won't? That's what has been dominating his stump stop speeches. He has plenty to talk about too....12 straight months of job creation, a declining unemployment rate and record home ownership for those of us that he 'sold out' in the middle class.

I'm better off since Bush took office DESPITE losing a great job to 9-11. I'm not the only one.

You're swallowing the Kerry/Edwards lines. I'm living a different story than they are telling.

[Displaced Flames fan]

BTW...memo to everyone...if you disagree with Lanny you are a freaking idiot.

Oh wait, that's old news...it's been that way for 7 years.

[transplant99]

As Tranny likes to say, Wow! I guess when the US decides to bend Canada over for the Alberta tar sands , through either economic pressure, political or military intervention, the tune will change quickly

LOL....what???

[Displaced Flames fan]

Originally posted by transplant99@Sep 6 2004, 04:07 PM
As Tranny likes to say, Wow! I guess when the US decides to bend Canada over for the Alberta tar sands , through either economic pressure, political or military intervention, the tune will change quickly

LOL....what???

That's right Tranny...warn all you relatives and friends in Calgary....our theocratic, neonazi dictator is coming for Alberta oil reserves. Bombs will fall on Calgary!!! Take cover Calgarians.

[Lanny_MacDonald]

Wow Dis, you ARE a Republican. Can't debate sh*t. Can't backup your bluster. Typical. The door was wide open for you to try and defend the scumbags in office and you failed to even attempt to do it. Nice job. I would think that a guy like you should be able to backup your crap about how great a job your government is doing and how they are not treading all over international law. I thought you would easily be able to tell me how wrong I am in comparing what the Americans are doing in Iraq to what the Nazi's did in Poland and the Soviets did in Czech and Afghan. What's wrong big guy? Cat got your tongue?