We laughed out loud at hilarious photos in the Herald. I mean come on, could the picture in that story be more cloying? She's holding an infant's toy for crying out loud.
"No, no, no, you don't look sad enough. You have to look like you are about to burst into tears. Here, hold this toy. Perfect! Hold that pose".
The photo is the most sickening thing of the whole article. How contrived!
Not a helicopter parent here, but I can understand her concern.
On Thursday, first day of school, one of my assistants had her kid put on a different school bus in the afternoon than he was on in the morning, taking a completely different route and dropping him off three blocks away from where he got on the bus in the morning. The only way they found him was because the driver of the bus he was supposed to be on knew him from the previous year and knew which bus he was put on. He's in grade one. When other parents hear stories like this, it's no wonder they get nervous when it's their kid's turn to start riding the bus.
Again, I'm sure this stuff happened when we were kids, but it gets so sensationalized in our 'instant media' culture that it's no wonder parents get overprotective.
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Man, I was raised in the generation of no harm no foul, if its a bruise its cool, if its a cut girls loved it by wouldn't admit it. Where your dad taught you how to defend yourself, where you didn't wear bike helmets or wrap your kids in bubble wrap. Where a cast was a right of passage and a black eye was absolutely awesome.
Where you didn't swarm during a scrap, and kicking your opponent when he was down was the act of a sissy girl fighter.
I was raised in a generation where your parents didn't give you a ride to school unless there was a damn good reason, where whether it was 30 above or 30 below you walked to the damn bus, usually when it was dark and you used back alley's as a short cut. And you never ever held your parents hands when you crossed the streets, every kid had a folding knife, and you warned your buddy that it was going to hurt when you shot him with a bb or pellet gun.
We weren't precious, or honey or baby, we were hey you, and sit down and shut up or better yet ssssssh the adults are talking now.
When the age of 18 is when you were free whether you moved out or went away to university, and if you were going to stay home you paid rent and laundry service.
I was raised in a generation where you got a swat on the butt if you acted up, bad grades meant a major grounding and a act of disrespect got you hauled behind the hypothetical woodshed for a wailing.
We weren't our parents best friends in the whole wide world, they were the law and we existed at their suffereage, but no matter how bad times were, we always had clothes, good food, and the other necessitates.
Where we ran out the door in the summer and it wasn't "Call me pokey" or "Don't leave my sight" but "Be home when the sun comes down"
We had a social structure, we didn't beat up younger kids, and nerds were a target for a swirly or a red belly.
Our society is going through a period of softening, and it won't be long until our leaders are whimps, mamma's boys and sissy's that need their blankey.
Now if you'll excuse me, I'm off to the gym, followed by a meal of some meat product with even more meat product on the side and a beer with a milk chaser.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee
You know... I get what Captain is saying and I most definitely agree to SOME EXTENT... but just because you're over 40 and years ago you had to create your own shelter and hunt your own food at an early age doesn't mean that some of the parenting practices that have changed for a safer childhood are all bad.
My two cents:
1) Every generation says that the new generations are worse / sissified / lazier / etc.
2) Every person grows older, and every person faces society whether they're prepared for it or not. If your parent turned you into a walking vagina then yes, you'll face a walk-up call but yes, you can get over that too and contribute to society once you realize not everything bends to your beck and call and sometimes things just don't go your way. At the end of the day, if you can't adapt, and you can't handle the real world, you may suffer indeed, but helicopter parents or not it's still up to the individual in my opinion.
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CC's take on parenting wins.
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Man, I was raised in the generation of no harm no foul, if its a bruise its cool, if its a cut girls loved it by wouldn't admit it. Where your dad taught you how to defend yourself, where you didn't wear bike helmets or wrap your kids in bubble wrap. Where a cast was a right of passage and a black eye was absolutely awesome.
Where you didn't swarm during a scrap, and kicking your opponent when he was down was the act of a sissy girl fighter.
I was raised in a generation where your parents didn't give you a ride to school unless there was a damn good reason, where whether it was 30 above or 30 below you walked to the damn bus, usually when it was dark and you used back alley's as a short cut. And you never ever held your parents hands when you crossed the streets, every kid had a folding knife, and you warned your buddy that it was going to hurt when you shot him with a bb or pellet gun.
We weren't precious, or honey or baby, we were hey you, and sit down and shut up or better yet ssssssh the adults are talking now.
When the age of 18 is when you were free whether you moved out or went away to university, and if you were going to stay home you paid rent and laundry service.
I was raised in a generation where you got a swat on the butt if you acted up, bad grades meant a major grounding and a act of disrespect got you hauled behind the hypothetical woodshed for a wailing.
We weren't our parents best friends in the whole wide world, they were the law and we existed at their suffereage, but no matter how bad times were, we always had clothes, good food, and the other necessitates.
Where we ran out the door in the summer and it wasn't "Call me pokey" or "Don't leave my sight" but "Be home when the sun comes down"
We had a social structure, we didn't beat up younger kids, and nerds were a target for a swirly or a red belly.
Our society is going through a period of softening, and it won't be long until our leaders are whimps, mamma's boys and sissy's that need their blankey.
Now if you'll excuse me, I'm off to the gym, followed by a meal of some meat product with even more meat product on the side and a beer with a milk chaser.
Whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger... except for brain damage kids!
I was raised in the 70's and 80's as well, and everything CC said is bang on to how I was raised. I am glad I was raised that way, even though I may have resented my parents sometimes. Overall I think it showed that my parents trusted me to do the right thing, not make stupid decisions, but if I did make some stupid choices I payed the price for them and learned from the mistakes. When you're told to go across an empty field to the willows on the other side to cut the branch (or switch as they used to be called) that's going to beat your butt by the time you get back you've learned your lesson. (for the record even though I cut many switches in my childhood I never actually got spanked with any of them, because usually I was bawling like a baby by the time I got back from just thinking about it. I did get a belt once though, which sucked)
There's nothing wrong with trying to protect your kids, and I get that the world has changed, and even if your own kid knows right from wrong and how to protect his/herself in most instances, the dangers usually come from others who don't. Because of the changes in the world since the 70's, I have mixed feelings on this issue. (and I think this is up for debate too; I'm not sure the world really has changed, I just think we hear about a lot more things now than ever before) I do however think things have gone overboard. With the so-called media sensationalizing every little thing, most parents are overly scared for their children, and unfortunately I think most of their fears are either unfounded, or completely overblown. Not to say there aren't dangers out there for kids, but I think it would be far better in most cases if the kids were taught how to handle things on their own instead of relying on a parent to always be there to deal with things that may arise. The parent isn't going to always be there, so the child will have to make their own choices, rightly or wrongly anyway. Better for them to at least have some self reliance when the time comes.
Another thing that was brought up in passing in this thread is that if you make the choice to parent your kids a certain way there will always be other parents who will look at you like you're a monster. I think this is as much a danger to kids as anything else out there, as there always seems to be a parent or two who think they know what's best for your child, and think they should probably make it their business, even though it clearly is not. Unfortunately if they feel strongly enough about it they can even get authorities involved in things, which only serves to undermine the parents and possibly make it harder for them to teach their kids what they need to know.
(I just want to clarify that these are just my observation/opinions based on what I have seen involving my friends who are parents. I used to be a parent, but haven't been since the 90's so I could be completely out of touch)
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I think we had the same parents, lol. I grew up in the 70's and 80's, and some of the stuff we did by today's standards would land our folks in jail for child endangerment nowadays..lol.
One day me and my buddy were building a 1 foot bmx jump in the back alley, using my dads circular saw, of course unsupervised, and we are 10 years old...lol.
My old man comes out, starts checking our work, and says... "Thats a pretty sissy jump." So he takes over the project, builds this thing up to about 3 feet so it could clear garbage cans and makes a matching landing ramp. So this masterpiece jump is completed, and we start jumping. It was awesome, half the kids in the neighbourhood are lining up to try it, without bike helmets of course. So my dad, gets it in his brain, that he wants a go. He gets on my Diamond Back Pacer 500, runs at the jump at mach 6, launches way past the landing ramp, and faceplants over the bars giving himself 2 degree face roadrash, and I found out years later, a severe concussion.
IT. WAS. AWESOME! It was like having Evil Kenevil for a dad. It was also educational as well, as that day I learned that crazy glue can be an excellent substitue for head stitches.
Kids and parents are too pussified now IMHO opinion. And most kids are waaaaay too spoiled. Our parents let us take our lumps, and I think we are better for it.
-We played guns, with replica guns.
-Trampolines didn't have safety nets, and roofs were the appropriate launching pads.
-Problems between kids were solved between kids, not in courts.
-Teachers could scold you, and call you a punk and you parents would back the teacher, not sue them.
-I was taught to get over my fear of water by being thrown in the deep end of Canyon Meadows pool... by my mom...lol. (obviously she wouldn't let me drown, but it was a blunt lesson).
For years I resented my old man for roughing me up when I was acting out or did something bad. I realized many years later, that it made think about the consequences of my actions, before I disrepected an adult, or burned down the neighbours fence... whatever evil I was contemplating that day...lol. At 36 years old, even to this day I still call my boss sir, and address elders as Mr. and Mrs., not by first names, which was one of the prime lessons I learned. If it wasn't for a little hard justice by the old man, I honestly think I would have turned out a lot worse, and would definitely had not been a success story, and probably would have done some time, I was that out of control at times. In my moments of weakness now, it is still in the back of my mind... what would my dad think if I did this?
Its funny, because years later you can sit down with your old man over a beer and you can honestly laugh at it, and my old man for example laughed at some of the incredibly stupid things that I did, or better yet some of the plans that I thought I would get away with.
I didn't understand it at the time, and there was a long period of time when I didn't talk to him at all, in fact I joined the military to spite him.
But the one thing that he did tell me, and I've stated it before. He was never there to be my friend, he was my father first, he was there to make me a better and more respectable person. He was there to guide me, and put me on a path where I could succeed, and I would have the toughness to push through any situation instead of throwing my hands up and quitting.
His rules, and the way he handled me taught me that there were no shortcuts, to think about what I was doing and to do the right thing. To fight for what I believe in, and to be somewhat hard headed when I thought I was doing the right thing.
That's not to say that my old man was a sergeant Hartman character when I was growing up. There were lots of good memories. There were camping trips that were so terrible that we can laugh about it now. He taught me to play chess, he tried to help me with math, but at some point I realized that he was not a math natural. And while he kicked my a$$ over poor grades (The whole if you were ######ed I would be proud of your marks comment comes to mind) but he was also so proud when I got my degree even though we weren't talking at the time that he cried.
He was aggravating and stone faced, and somewhat forceful when I was growing up and he let me take risks and learn for myself when I was growing up. He was a man that you just didn't cross.
But now he's a great friend and a sounding board, and he still beats me up over some of the stupid things that I do.
But I wouldn't have it any other way.
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I don't think what CC said has been lost completely. It certainly isn't as 'normal' as it might have been back then, but many of the parents of kids I went to school with were that way. That may have been part of growing up in a small town though.
I think the key is to let a kid make his own choices, fall and learn to stand back up again. Many of the problems we're going to face in the future as a society will be the result of having kids grow up thinking they're entitled to something, or anything at all.
My personal opinion is that there are a lot of different ways to raise a child, but at the end of the day, that kid is going to walk out of the door at the age of 18, which means that it is an absolute necessity to make sure that when that day comes, he's ready to make it on his own.
Things like responsibility, honesty, integrity, a good attitude, and the understanding that you must work if you want to be successful is all taught from a very young age up.
And watching certain parents these days, even just 5 years removed from high school, man I wonder what is going on. Then again, I'm sure the generation before said that of my generation; so on and so forth.
I think some parents just have too much time on their hands. Flex work schedules and all that, they take their kids to school and come in to work at 9:30. At work the other day I had to cancel an early meeting cause parents were stuck in traffic taking 10 year old Johnny to school.
When I was in grade 1, my mom worked at 6am and my dad was a student again at UofC. Dad was either still sleeping from studying late the night before or off to an 8am class or exam. They didn't have time to worry about me. We got the neighbour's son who was a couple years older than me to give me a ride on his BMX to school. No helmets, just holding on for dear life! And I was fortunate to get that!
----
and of course George Carlin (NSFW obviously)
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Last edited by GirlySports; 09-04-2010 at 10:13 PM.
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Its funny, because years later you can sit down with your old man over a beer and you can honestly laugh at it, and my old man for example laughed at some of the incredibly stupid things that I did, or better yet some of the plans that I thought I would get away with.
I didn't understand it at the time, and there was a long period of time when I didn't talk to him at all, in fact I joined the military to spite him.
But the one thing that he did tell me, and I've stated it before. He was never there to be my friend, he was my father first, he was there to make me a better and more respectable person. He was there to guide me, and put me on a path where I could succeed, and I would have the toughness to push through any situation instead of throwing my hands up and quitting.
His rules, and the way he handled me taught me that there were no shortcuts, to think about what I was doing and to do the right thing. To fight for what I believe in, and to be somewhat hard headed when I thought I was doing the right thing.
That's not to say that my old man was a sergeant Hartman character when I was growing up. There were lots of good memories. There were camping trips that were so terrible that we can laugh about it now. He taught me to play chess, he tried to help me with math, but at some point I realized that he was not a math natural. And while he kicked my a$$ over poor grades (The whole if you were ######ed I would be proud of your marks comment comes to mind) but he was also so proud when I got my degree even though we weren't talking at the time that he cried.
He was aggravating and stone faced, and somewhat forceful when I was growing up and he let me take risks and learn for myself when I was growing up. He was a man that you just didn't cross.
But now he's a great friend and a sounding board, and he still beats me up over some of the stupid things that I do.
But I wouldn't have it any other way.
I didn't join the military in spite of my old man, but I went through a long period of non communication with my parents as well when I left home. It wasn't on good terms though, as me and my dad ended my home stay with a fist fight in the back yard. I decided it was time to stand my ground with him when I was 17, and it was probably the only time I was justified in fighting back. I would say I "won" the fight from a who beat up who perspective, but it damaged our relationship for years, and felt like the biggest loser ever for doing it. Even he admits, he was a little too hard with me to this day, but with my behavioral issues as a kid, he didn't know what else to do, as I couldn't be reasoned with. However leaving home that young and being forced to survive on my own, was the best thing that happened to me, and I look back on it now as a godsend. I didn't have time to live under my parents roof scheming up diabolicle plans on their dime, putting food on the table and paying rent was first and foremost, priorities changed.... fast.
When my sister died in 1995, my parents ended up taking full guardianship of her kids full time. Neither father was remotely capable of raising two children at the time, so at 55 (dad) and 48 (mom) they were once again full time parents to a 5 year old and 2 year old.... a massive responsibility for people that should be looking at retirement. I promised at that time I would bury the hatchet with my dad, and never bring up the stuff from the past. Only to support and help my folks any way I possibly could.
Well now, the old man is 70, my mom is 63. One kid is a musical prodigy attending Manhattan School of Music, and the other is going to be going to university next year. They raised the kids in a much more modern fashion than myself and my sister, with no corporal style punishments. They are good kids but a little too spoiled, and very useless in real world stuff, as they were waited on hand and foot, since my mom pretty much quit work to raise them. After all of that though, all I can say of my folks is that regardless of some bad decisions they made raising myself, the are super hero parents to do what they did, and give up 15 years of their retirement to make sure my neice and nephew turned out right. I can be a little envious at times, as a couple kids being raised by millionaire grand parents is a far cry ffrom what I had, but I wouldn't have my childhood any other way. In today's era, where kids control their parents, knowing how I was then, I would have exploited the crap out of them, and probably turned out to be some sort of criminal mastermind. Hard justice was what I needed, and thank god it wasn't frowned upon by society when I was a kid.
There really is no right or wrong way to do it as a parent in my opinion, you just have to adapt with the times, and go with the flow. But sometimes when I see some punk mouthing off his mom, or some little bitch snapping at her dad in front of me because the new convertible he just bought her is the wrong colour, I do think,"What is wrong with young people? If I had done that I would have been smacked in the mouth, and then be in more trouble for bleeding on the floor." Times have changed, I don't neccesarily think beating your kids is the answer, but young people nowadays are too coddled and have too much freedom. Things have swung too far the other way.
Now me and my dad are best pals. Like Captains dad, we look back at some of the things and laugh at how careless we were. I can curse without getting smacked on the back of the head. And I drive when we go places, as he begrudgingly admits his driving skills aren't where they were. I find my folks more often coming to me for advice on stuff now, which admittedly seems weird. With my dad, it is neat in his later years, seeing a more vulnerable side of this guy that seemed like this invincible superhero like guy in the past. One thing that is always there, is the jokes. In thick or thin humour is/was always the outlet, he is one of the funniest people I'll ever know.
The bad memories, I kept my vow of never bringing them up with him, and I think he is glad for it. He earned a free pass by making it right with his grand kids, and never once laid a finger on them. Now when he tells me he is proud of something I did, or that he loves me, it means a ton to me. Albeit that is always uber akward for both of us, and always ends in some dumb comment like "So is that a 351 or a 454 big block?" to re-man the situation and loofa off the suckiness. In return, I always tell my folks how amazing they are for what they did for their grand kids.
Last edited by pylon; 09-04-2010 at 11:15 PM.
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Is it at all possible that the over-protective parenting 'trend' is itself sensationalized and not true to life so that when we see one we think 'omg, another overprotective parent - what is the world coming to?' or on the other side of the coin making parents think it's normal and what is expected of them? (let's face it, flying in the face of the norm is a risk)
I'm 22 so I have no idea. I don't know a tonne of people who are parents of young children nor do I really pay attention when the TV is talking about anything parenting related.
Last edited by Flames0910; 09-04-2010 at 11:21 PM.
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Is it at all possible that the over-protective parenting 'trend' is itself sensationalized and not true to life so that when we see one we think 'omg, another overprotective parent - what is the world coming to?' or on the other side of the coin making parents think it's normal and what is expected of them? (let's face it, flying in the face of the norm is a risk)
I'm 22 so I have no idea. I don't know a tonne of people who are parents of young children nor do I really pay attention when the TV is talking about anything parenting related.
It's not sensationalized. When you start meeting parents of young kids at work and hear their phone calls and see the stress and worry in their voices while making sure their child is ok all the time, you'll understand.
The lady who sits beside me took last Friday off to take her kid to school on the first day, he's in Grade 3! 3!!!!! he's gone to school 2 years already. And now she has to work at 9 instead of 8 to make sure Junior is delivered to the front door every morning. Since I work closely with her, her starting at 9 instead of 8 is a real pain in the ass for me.
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Is it at all possible that the over-protective parenting 'trend' is itself sensationalized and not true to life so that when we see one we think 'omg, another overprotective parent - what is the world coming to?' or on the other side of the coin making parents think it's normal and what is expected of them? (let's face it, flying in the face of the norm is a risk)
I'm 22 so I have no idea. I don't know a tonne of people who are parents of young children nor do I really pay attention when the TV is talking about anything parenting related.
I think there's a truth to this; for every overprotective parent there's a parent that doesn't give their kid the attention they need. Finding the right balance is difficult. But the media and the public loves stories of bad parents. I do think there's a bit of irony (not real irony, the alanis morrisette kind) in the mother's overprotective intentions actually causing a situation that put her child in more danger; but the intent wasn't necessarily that awful.
People are in here complaining about all the over-protective parents "judging" and "competing" with them. But the reality is you're all judging them right back and competing about who is the least uptight.
Just let other people parent how they're going to parent.
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The lady who sits beside me took last Friday off to take her kid to school on the first day, he's in Grade 3! 3!!!!! he's gone to school 2 years already. And now she has to work at 9 instead of 8 to make sure Junior is delivered to the front door every morning. Since I work closely with her, her starting at 9 instead of 8 is a real pain in the ass for me.
So, basically you're saying that her schedule should revolve around you, and not her child? Come on now.
I don't think you should be criticizing the choices that parents are making in regards to their children, when you don't have children of your own.
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People are in here complaining about all the over-protective parents "judging" and "competing" with them. But the reality is you're all judging them right back and competing about who is the least uptight.
Just let other people parent how they're going to parent.
Pft...typical response from a mother...what do you know?
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It's not sensationalized. When you start meeting parents of young kids at work and hear their phone calls and see the stress and worry in their voices while making sure their child is ok all the time, you'll understand.
The lady who sits beside me took last Friday off to take her kid to school on the first day, he's in Grade 3! 3!!!!! he's gone to school 2 years already. And now she has to work at 9 instead of 8 to make sure Junior is delivered to the front door every morning. Since I work closely with her, her starting at 9 instead of 8 is a real pain in the ass for me.
Does she have to work an hour later each night?
If not did she agree to take a cut in pay in lieu of less time at work?
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Just let other people parent how they're going to parent.
Truer words have not been said.
Sure, there are some bad parents out there, and the kid may not turn out all that great. But you can't control that, criticize all you want, but they aren't gonna change.
And all parents have different styles of parenting, there's no one way that's good or right. Let them be.
So, basically you're saying that her schedule should revolve around you, and not her child? Come on now.
I don't think you should be criticizing the choices that parents are making in regards to their children, when you don't have children of your own.
Her schedule should not revolve around me but revolve around work and the office core hours which are 8:30 to 4:30. I nor anyone else is allowed to start later than 8:30... but she is allowed to start later cause of a kid. Is she going to do this when the kid is 15? Where's the line? Pre-school, that awkward halfday kindergarten or even grade 1 ok I understand... but not freakin grade 3!
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Last edited by GirlySports; 09-05-2010 at 12:48 AM.
