CP Hostility Levels

[Phanuthier]

One of my roommates got drugged up and pimped out on Craigslist by another roommate. once. He found out on his daily Craigslist surfing.

[photon]

Originally Posted by Azure

I'm surprised this thread hasn't been closed yet.

Every 4-6 months there's a bout of navel gazing by any community, it's best to give it an outlet for a while, otherwise it spreads to every thread.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

One of my roommates got drugged up and pimped out on Craigslist by another roommate. once. He found out on his daily Craigslist surfing.

Did he get to keep his pimpin' money? I've heard that line of work is quite difficult.

[Regorium]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

I think this summer's hostility can be quite easily explained.

Last year people had high expectations especially after getting the free agent coup of the summer in Bouwmeester. They then had their expectations shattered, the supposed franchise defenseman traded, and nothing really positive to dwell on. Well actually the Flames became one of the best defensive teams in the league but that isn't really an accomplishment that your average fan would note.

So the psychological response is to turn against the team, to track down and isolate the problems. For many it became Sutter. For some it became specific players. It then becomes trendy to dump on the Flames and particularly Sutter and more and more people start piling on.

Now consider that his board is the nexus or meeting point for a wide variety of fans. Here you will find fans who were Flames addicts through the lean years of never making the playoffs. Some of them take the long view and things now are 100x better than the Coates era. You have casual fans some of whom take their opinions on the Flames from the water cooler or Eric Franics or Dowbiggen. You have everything in between. Some people hate the direction the Flames are going and have come up with that idea on their own. Some people are just repeating what some of the media is saying. Some people don't understand the cap implications of various moves that Sutter has made and try and evaluate it based on the old best player in the deal theory.

So you have a bunch of upset fans venting. Some intelligently, some not. And they are doing it on a forum that is also populated by some of the most knowledgeable Flames fans out there. Its an almost inevitable clash. Some fans wanted big changes no matter what they were. The Tanguay and Jokinen deals are bound to disappoint many because they don't represent anything we haven't seen before. Some fans can't comprehend how a team that didn't make any big changes might improve offensively.

What is different about this summer from the dark era is that more people care. And more casual fans care. From the Stanley Cup run expectations were permanently raised. People want heads to roll. People want fingers pointed. The answer that Sutter gave that the team merely needed to be retooled or tweaked is seen as folly even if it may be reality. Then the rhetoric intensifies. Sutter is an idiot. Battle lines are drawn. Expert posters who've seen that Sutter is no idiot become more defensive. Ridiculous arguments are heard for months and months straight without end from different people. It wears on everybody.

Interesting topic actually, there's a lot to be said about the psychology of certain types of Flames fans, Sutter's press conferences and moves, and why that has led to a big clash on the board this summer.

Apologies if this has been commented on in the past 15 pages and I will probably go back and read it but I just felt the need to respond.

This is exactly the type of post that creates an elevated tension level. You've labeled anyone that believes that Sutter isn't doing a good job as a sub-expert level poster. There are just as many expert posters that can argue the opposite side of the argument, yet you have already dismissed them as idiots, and their arguments "ridiculous".

I understand you were trying to be objective and look at the big picture, but your bias does show through, and that is part of what grates on a lot of people.

[Locke]

This whole infatuation with Lanny is hysterical. Its akin to Americans pining for the 'good old days' under George W.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by Locke

Did he get to keep his pimpin' money? I've heard that line of work is quite difficult.

His pimp took his working clothes until she gets her cut

[Flash Walken]

While I have noticed the hostility forum-wide to be increasing, I think the reasons are fairly obvious and have already been commented on in this thread.

One thing I do find funny though is how much mellower I have become as a poster since lurking and reading those intensely combative discussions.

My ignore list has also jumped by leaps and bounds in the last year, maybe that has something to do with it...

[Komskies]

CP = Skynet?

Bingo = Cyberdyne Systems?

[Azure]

Clearly it was the takeover by Ivrnet.

[Phanuthier]

Prepare for hostility tonight - I have to go to Wal-Mart tonight.

You posting tonight, pedro?

[Shazam]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

While I have noticed the hostility forum-wide to be increasing, I think the reasons are fairly obvious and have already been commented on in this thread.

One thing I do find funny though is how much mellower I have become as a poster since lurking and reading those intensely combative discussions.

My ignore list has also jumped by leaps and bounds in the last year, maybe that has something to do with it...

Oh god, if the Flames stink it up in October this forum will meltdown so fast the mods will all be alcoholics by the end of it.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by Regorium

Apologies if this has been commented on in the past 15 pages and I will probably go back and read it but I just felt the need to respond.

This is exactly the type of post that creates an elevated tension level. You've labeled anyone that believes that Sutter isn't doing a good job as a sub-expert level poster. There are just as many expert posters that can argue the opposite side of the argument, yet you have already dismissed them as idiots, and their arguments "ridiculous".

I understand you were trying to be objective and look at the big picture, but your bias does show through, and that is part of what grates on a lot of people.

Nope. I've labeled anyone who resorts to the argument, "Sutter is an idiot" to the sub-expert level poster. Anyone who dislikes Sutter moves and is an expert level fan is likely to debate the topic without suggesting that Sutter is an idiot.

If you want to see what I consider ridiculous arguments see my post later in this thread where I spell it out. The following arguments were included:

1) Sutter is an idiot
2) The Flames never give young players a chance to make the team
3) All Flames players over 30 are washed up and on a steep decline in terms of their career
4) Any Flame on a downward statistical trend will continue to go downward, even if there might have been extenuating circumstances surrounding it, namely injuries
5) The Flames should tank cause they clearly aren't a Stanley Cup contender.

Does that clarify things for you? I respect a good anti-Sutter argument. I have zero time or respect anymore for the types of arguments I've outlined above which are used by many of the non-expert level anti-Sutter crowd.

Sutter has made some of the best moves this franchise has made in the past 15 years. Anyone who thinks he is an idiot either has an extremely short memory, puts too much emphasis on his last 3 big moves or hasn't followed things very closely.

Some of this "idiot"'s trades include:

1) 2nd for Kiprusoff
2) Montador for Huselius
3) 2nd for Bourque
4) Saprykin + Gauthier for Langkow
5) Drafting Phaneuf
6) All the small moves that helped us get to the cup finals. Nieminen, Simon, Nilson.
7) 1st round pick for Mike Cammalleri
8) Leopold + two 2nd rounders for Alex Tanguay
9) 3rd round pick + rights to the UFA Leopold for Jay Bouwmeester

Some of this "idiot"'s free agent signings:
1) Martin "The Eliminator" Gelinas
2) Curtis Glencross
3) Roman Hamrlik
4) Jokinen@3 million
5) Tanguay@1.7 million
6) Bertuzzi
7) Nolan

Sorry but 3 trades no matter what you think of them do not destroy his entire body of work. Anyone who thinks he is an idiot is actually an idiot themself. Besides being the best GM we've had in the last 15-20 years he was also the best coach we've had in that timeframe IMO. It doesn't mean every move he makes is gold, but it certainly should garner enough respect to keep the word idiot out of the conversation. Those who resort to that term show their lack of understanding about his entire tenure here.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

Prepare for hostility tonight - I have to go to Wal-Mart tonight.

You posting tonight, pedro?

Walmart is THE place to go for fresh produce.

[FireFly]

I'm surprised there aren't more people surprised that the thread hasn't been closed yet.



This thread is FUN! Less fun now than it was before though.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by FireFly

I'm surprised there aren't more people surprised that the thread hasn't been closed yet.



This thread is FUN! Less fun now than it was before though.

I'll accept some responsibility for that.

[FanIn80]

I'm surprised that anyone thinks this thread should be locked. It's just a discussion afterall.

Well... minus the typical thanks-farming from the usual suspects, and the over-the-line posting of Lanny's PMs at the beginning.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Azure

Clearly it was the takeover by Ivrnet.

In conjunction with the saucer people, under the supervision of reverse vampires?

[Komskies]

Originally Posted by FanIn80

I'm surprised that anyone thinks this thread should be locked. It's just a discussion afterall.

Well... minus the typical thanks-farming from the usual suspects, and the over-the-line posting of Lanny's PMs at the beginning.

WTF? I don't understand your avatar. Are we living in crazy world now?

[VladtheImpaler]

FDW is clearly trying to make this thread more hostile by trying to start a Sutter discussion here. No, sir, I will not fall into cunningly laid trap.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by vladtheimpaler

fdw is clearly trying to make this thread more hostile by trying to start a sutter discussion here. no, sir, i will not fall into cunningly laid trap.

Dang I thought saying all fans who say Sutter is an idiot are idiots would've baited lots of people.