2010 Blue Jays Season Thread

[Flickered Flame]

Originally Posted by JayP

I don't think the Jays deal Bautista for the simple fact that he appears to be the ambassador for the organization relating to Latino players. From what I've read, he was consulted by AA before acquiring Escobar and then was the guy that the Jays designated to help Escobar make the transition. Bautista is fluently bilingual and that's actually a pretty rare asset for a Latino MLBer.

Considering the Jays are clearly making a strong move towards being more aggressive in bringing over young Latino prospects, I think that Bautista is a huge part of our future. Even if his on-field production drops off slightly he still brings value to the team in other ways.

I do think that Buck gets traded for two reasons: his value will never be higher and the Jays do have a replacement prospect ready in J.P. Arencibia. For those unfamiliar with him, here's his AAA numbers this season:

.309/.363/.650 = 1.013 OPS
29 HRs in 87 games

Those are ridiculous numbers from a catcher. I think the Jays deal off Buck and get maximum value then go into next season with a solid Arencibia/Molina combo to ease the rookie in.

Based on the argument that the Jays should trade because a player's value has never been higher, then if I was the Jays, I would be moving Bautista. They are not contending this year and most likely next year as well. They have Travis Snider down in the system, who eventually, needs to come back up and get some serious playing time. Bautista might be able to fetch a good return, lots of contending teams are looking for a big bat and over the first half of the season and September of last year I believe he has hit 40 home runs.

[Sylvanfan]

Originally Posted by JayP

I do think that Buck gets traded for two reasons: his value will never be higher and the Jays do have a replacement prospect ready in J.P. Arencibia. For those unfamiliar with him, here's his AAA numbers this season:

.309/.363/.650 = 1.013 OPS
29 HRs in 87 games

Those are ridiculous numbers from a catcher. I think the Jays deal off Buck and get maximum value then go into next season with a solid Arencibia/Molina combo to ease the rookie in.

I was thinking Buck as a prime trade candidate too, although the destination is tough to figure. Of all the playoff contenders which ones need an upgrade at catcher?

Yankees have Posada, although he does DH a fair bit now. Red Sox no, not with Martinez and Varitek. Don't think Tampa would be interested since Jaso is starting to be their regular guy. Twins have Joe Mauer, Whitesox have AJ Pierzynski, so that leaves Detroit as the only real possible option. In the AL West Oakland isn't doing anything with Suzuki signed long term, the Angels have Napoli, and the Rangers just traded for Benji Molina.

In the NL the playoff contenders also look to be okay at the catching position. Maybe the Giants if they decide that they think they're a serious playoff team.

[JayP]

Originally Posted by Flickered Flame

Based on the argument that the Jays should trade because a player's value has never been higher, then if I was the Jays, I would be moving Bautista. They are not contending this year and most likely next year as well. They have Travis Snider down in the system, who eventually, needs to come back up and get some serious playing time. Bautista might be able to fetch a good return, lots of contending teams are looking for a big bat and over the first half of the season and September of last year I believe he has hit 40 home runs.

But like I said I think the Jays perceive Bautista to add a lot of value off the field as well. It's one of those things that's hard for us fans to judge because stuff like that is hard to quantify with the limited information we can get.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by JayP

But like I said I think the Jays perceive Bautista to add a lot of value off the field as well. It's one of those things that's hard for us fans to judge because stuff like that is hard to quantify with the limited information we can get.

True enough. I just like him. Good influence on the team, always plays with a smile.

Worth buying a ticket to see play.

[Gozer]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

True enough. I just like him. Good influence on the team, always plays with a smile.

Worth buying a ticket to see play.

Bautista is who the fans wanted Rios to be.

[Jiggy_12]

Its a tough call with Bautista.

He's 30 years old, and in 3-4 years when the Jays are supposed to be in contention mode, he will be 33/34 and on the decline. They never expected this kind of output, and the return for trading that bat might be huge...I think you have to pull the trigger.

[moon]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

Please don't trade Bautista!!!!!!!!!!

I love that swing! That ARM!

He's turned into a 5 tool player.

Not to be a hater but 4 tool player as he can't come close to hitting for average.

Originally Posted by fleury

Then there may be other guys who are just dumped for a bag of balls, like Molina, Ruiz, and Tallet.

Unless they somehow got another Ruiz he was already dumped for less than a bag of balls.

[Jason14h]

Eric Hinske and Alex Rios think your wood is premature y'all.

If anything Hinske could slightly compare to Lind...

And Rios quit on the Jays. He is having a very good year in Chicago this season. So that comparison really makes no sense.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by Jiggy_12

Its a tough call with Bautista.

He's 30 years old, and in 3-4 years when the Jays are supposed to be in contention mode, he will be 33/34 and on the decline. They never expected this kind of output, and the return for trading that bat might be huge...I think you have to pull the trigger.

I think they can contend before that. They're already a 90 win team this season. It shouldn't take 3-4 years to go from 90 wins to 100.

I do agree that some parts could be traded like Gonzalez was.
Buck, Overbay and some relievers like Downs and Camp, even Frasor.

Detroit is a team that is suddenly desperate. Needs a bat with Ordonez and Guillen out. They are losing ground fast.

But I'd like them to keep Bautista. I just love his attitude and the strengths he gives to the team. And even with you're 3-4 year plan, I'm not convinced 33/34 years old is on the decline these days. He could be a late bloomer who's starting to figure it out.

[howard_the_duck]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

I think they can contend before that. They're already a 90 win team this season. It shouldn't take 3-4 years to go from 90 wins to 100.

I do agree that some parts could be traded like Gonzalez was.
Buck, Overbay and some relievers like Downs and Camp, even Frasor.

Detroit is a team that is suddenly desperate. Needs a bat with Ordonez and Guillen out. They are losing ground fast.

But I'd like them to keep Bautista. I just love his attitude and the strengths he gives to the team. And even with you're 3-4 year plan, I'm not convinced 33/34 years old is on the decline these days. He could be a late bloomer who's starting to figure it out.

False. I'd be shocked if they are more than a game or 2 above .500 at season's end. August is usually when the wheels come off, and it's not like they have much of a cushion as is.

[flambers]

Originally Posted by Jiggy_12

Its a tough call with Bautista.

He's 30 years old, and in 3-4 years when the Jays are supposed to be in contention mode, he will be 33/34 and on the decline. They never expected this kind of output, and the return for trading that bat might be huge...I think you have to pull the trigger.

I believe Bautista is in his last year of his contract, the Jays would offer Arbritation and I bet he declines.

I would think if he is not moved he would leave in the off season.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by howard_the_duck

False. I'd be shocked if they are more than a game or 2 above .500 at season's end. August is usually when the wheels come off, and it's not like they have much of a cushion as is.

How is it false? You don't know. You're just speculating.

---

I will lower it to 85 wins.. i miscalculated their current record

[KTown]

I am going to be staying in downtown TO on a layover Friday night from when I leave my business meeting in the states. Think I might catch the game, since its been at least 10 years since I've seen them play live. Marcum is on the mound Friday night and I've always wanted to see him pitch.

[Clever_Iggy]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

In the NL the playoff contenders also look to be okay at the catching position. Maybe the Giants if they decide that they think they're a serious playoff team.

Meet Buster Posey:

Twenty game hit streak: http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?...=.jsp&c_id=mlb

Through 50 games this season: Batting .366, 8 HR, 34 RBIs - http://mlb.mlb.com/team/player.jsp?player_id=457763

The Giants #1 Prospect coming into this year: http://www.minorleagueball.com/2009/...-giants-top-20

Posey is also the guy that allowed the Giants to trade Bengie Molina to the Rangers. If the Giants need anything, it's corner outfield power.

[Antithesis]

TSN is reporting that the Jays' asking price for Downs from the Yankees is Joba Chamberlain, which the Yanks are balking at.

[Flickered Flame]

Originally Posted by Antithesis

TSN is reporting that the Jays' asking price for Downs from the Yankees is Joba Chamberlain, which the Yanks are balking at.

And rightfully so.

[Matty81]

The problem with dealing with the Sox or Yankees is that they overrate their young players massively IMO. Any guy in their system who has any success gets so hyped.

Chamberlain has regressed every season for 4 years, I don't think too many other teams would be calling a 4th year set up pitcher with an ERA of 6.00 an untouchable and yet the reaction on the net to asking for him for the best reliever available is shock and awe.

Frankly, I wouldn't trade the two high compensation picks alone for Chamberlain, and that's the floor for Downs. I'd say deal outside the division and stay away from the Yankees and Red Sox.

[flambers]

Personally I believe its a good move by AA to start with a very high asking price (i.e. Asking for Joba). Especially with the Yank's or Red Sox. Anything else would be a mistake.

I would bet he will lower his stance somewhat on Saturday morning but most likely with a team outside their conference.

It could be an interesting day for the Jays....

[flames_1987]

Love what AA is asking for Downs, the guy is worth it.

As for Bautista, I think if your AA you at least listen to offers, if some team is willing to overpay and gets a little desperate closer to the weekend then personally I'd pull the trigger on it. I still don't see the Jays contending for at least a few more years, and Bautista could truly bring in some sick return. But then again, if there's nothing out there it's not a bad thing to be stuck with the league leader in homers.

[bluejays]

Downs is good, and Joba hasn't been the same for a few seasons, and like Matty has said, just because he's a Yank prospect, he's valued so much higher. He's a good player, fairly large frame, but he can never get his pitching together or his mental game in place. We've seen endless Yank prospects being dealt and going nowhere with their careers. Joba still has potential, but he gets lit up nicely. I don't think it's too much to ask for Joba, but with the view that he's a top tier prospect by seemingly everyone else around the league (especially the Yanks), his value is higher as judged by the market. I'd actually take the chance on Joba, but I don't think he's nearly the same player many believe. He may turn out to be a closer someday perhaps (being bigboned and all), but as a starter, I'm not sure he'll ever make it. Downs is a very good player, and I'm sure he'll rebound nicely with another organization when given more of a role.