Report: Israel storms Gaza-bound aid ships

[valo403]

Originally Posted by Azure

Yes.

We here in Canada love to blame Israel for not being more humane with their actions, not only now, but in years past.

And then we forget about what its like sitting in an area where all your neighbors want to kill you, and where territory you GAVE UP is inhabited by people who use it to shoot rockets into Israel.

To make matters worse, people tend to ignore those rocket attacks, and condemn Israel for the blockade without realizing that Israel has no choice but to impose a blockade. They HAVE to protect their own citizens from more attacks, and inspecting the cargo coming in is the only way they can possibly do that.

International outcry against stuff like this is why Israel says 'screw you' to everyone.

Especially when a bunch of morons in the media start bitching about 'international waters'...when its a grey area at BEST, and other countries do the same thing Israel is doing with the blockade and boarding, ALL THE TIME.

And lets not even get started by the people who voted Hamas into power. These same people Israel should be nice too.

Thank you for proving my point.

[ynwa03]

Originally Posted by Azure

Apparently 4,000 isn't enough according to some people.

Keep bending over and taking it you know where.

Why are these 'rockets' being fired into Israel? Surely it's not for entertainment? You can't just take parts of the conflict in isolation, just to suit your argument.

[VladtheImpaler]

Originally Posted by ynwa03

Why are these 'rockets' being fired into Israel? Surely it's not for entertainment? You can't just take parts of the conflict in isolation, just to suit your argument.

What is, because Hamas and Hezbollah are scum and should be exterminated like rats, Alex?

[Blaster86]

Originally Posted by ynwa03

Why are these 'rockets' being fired into Israel? Surely it's not for entertainment? You can't just take parts of the conflict in isolation, just to suit your argument.

Because back, after World War 2 when Palestine and Israel were given their own countries, Palestine and other Arab nations delcared war on Israel immediately and got their crap packed in by the more-than-prepared Israelis. Because the Palestinians got their ass handed to them so bad, their country was annexed by Israel along with parts of Egypt, Jordan and Syria.

Palestinians started this, Palestinians lost. Palestinians are sore losers. That's why they are firing rockets.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by ynwa03

Why are these 'rockets' being fired into Israel? Surely it's not for entertainment? You can't just take parts of the conflict in isolation, just to suit your argument.

Ignoring the two reasons above, does it even matter?

Why don't they try the peaceful route?

[CaptainCrunch]

Helen Thomas resigns after making anti Israel statements

http://www.jpost.com/International/A...aspx?id=177755

[Flames Fan, Ph.D.]

Originally Posted by Blaster86

Because back, after World War 2 when Palestine and Israel were given their own countries, Palestine and other Arab nations delcared war on Israel immediately and got their crap packed in by the more-than-prepared Israelis. Because the Palestinians got their ass handed to them so bad, their country was annexed by Israel along with parts of Egypt, Jordan and Syria.

Palestinians started this, Palestinians lost. Palestinians are sore losers. That's why they are firing rockets.

Perhaps the situation is a little more nuanced than what you've described?

I think there is some important history between the time of recession of Ottoman rule from the region (which lasted ~4 centuries) and the official establishment of the state of Israel in 1948.

[SeeBass]

Re:Helen Thomas

I was just thinking that you hear many comments, and some worse, about Palestinians but I can't recall anybody getting fired over it.

This wasn't just anybody, she was an icon for a profession.

In my books, this time, fired=resigned

[Coys1882]

Originally Posted by Azure

Ignoring the two reasons above, does it even matter?

Why don't they try the peaceful route?

Well said. It's like those protesters at the Olympics - the minute they start smashing windows their cause is lost to me. They are now just animals.

The same goes for Hezbollah and Hamas. If they genuinely feel aggrieved then go through the proper means - suicide bombings at cafes and on buses have the same effect as those idiots in Vancouver.

[Azure]

Sad how everything is turning out, because Fatah at one point was willing to negotiate a peace deal.

[Flames Fan, Ph.D.]

Originally Posted by SeeBass

Re:Helen Thomas

I was just thinking that you hear many comments, and some worse, about Palestinians but I can't recall anybody getting fired over it.

This wasn't just anybody, she was an icon for a profession.

In my books, this time, fired=resigned

Perhaps if she was the Republican House Majority leader and spoke out similarly about the Palestinians, then she could have kept her job.

True story.

[burn_this_city]

Originally Posted by Azure

Sad how everything is turning out, because Fatah at one point was willing to negotiate a peace deal.

For me all hope seemed to end when Rabin was assassinated by that Orthodox zealot.

[pepper24]

Originally Posted by SeeBass

Re:Helen Thomas

I was just thinking that you hear many comments, and some worse, about Palestinians but I can't recall anybody getting fired over it.

This wasn't just anybody, she was an icon for a profession.

In my books, this time, fired=resigned

For a long time professional that has covered the White House since JFK they were dumb remarks. Even more dumb was her apology that she didn't mean it and that isn't who she really is. You have to put out the flames but harsh words.

[Blaster86]

Originally Posted by Flames Fan, Ph.D.

Perhaps the situation is a little more nuanced than what you've described?

I think there is some important history between the time of recession of Ottoman rule from the region (which lasted ~4 centuries) and the official establishment of the state of Israel in 1948.

Maybe so, but at the end of the day what has caused this to happen right now is the fact that they declared war and got their **** packed. They don't declare war, and they have their own country right now.

[Flames Fan, Ph.D.]

Originally Posted by Blaster86

Maybe so, but...

TBQH (is it draft day yet?), that's a lot of background to capitulate into a "maybe so, but..."

There is a bigger picture here which is muddied if we gloss over the history in the region predating the establishment of the Israeli state.

[Flames Fan, Ph.D.]

Originally Posted by pepper24

For a long time professional that has covered the White House since JFK they were dumb remarks. Even more dumb was her apology that she didn't mean it and that isn't who she really is. You have to put out the flames but harsh words.

In addition to her comments, the other sad part is that Thomas was one of the few people in that room willing to ask tough questions (repeatedly).

Now all that is left are the sycophants who had super soaker wars with Joe Biden and Rahm Emmanual this weekend.

[Nage Waza]

Originally Posted by valo403

My issue with all of this is the apparent ease with which actions by either side are condemed and those of the other praised based on misinformation. There's plenty of blame to go around in this entire conflict, not just this particualr incident. I understand that it's a heated topic, but when there's no interest in doing much more than blaming one side or the other what's the point? It's not limited to this board obviously, but it would be nice to actually see educated people take moderate stances as opposed to flying out to one extreme or the other. A bit of a pipe dream, but one can hope.

Why don't you leave this thread? You made accusations against me which were false, and then you write about misinformation? I thought I was fairly moderate, I only jump in heavily when real misinformation starts. I am very consistent about that.

I don't think Israel should have shot people in the boat, but I also cannot blame them. They are enforcing a blockade, a blockade which is aimed at crippling Hamas. Upon entering one of the boats, IDF were attacked by passengers who claimed to be peace activists, but were most likely looking for a violent confrontation. With that said, once a solider goes down, safety is off and bullets will be fired. There is now no argument as to the justification of the IDF commandeering the boat, experts all over have defended Israel. The issue now is the knee jerk reaction, as always, against Israel.

The anti Israel rants displayed in this thread are brutal. The claims that if you criticize Israel you are an anti Semite is simply a tactic that has become popular to defend one's self from accusations. A similar method used to be "I don't hate black people but" or "I don't hate Asians but".

If I have strayed from these thoughts at all, I am happy to discuss.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Flames Fan, Ph.D.

TBQH (is it draft day yet?), that's a lot of background to capitulate into a "maybe so, but..."

There is a bigger picture here which is muddied if we gloss over the history in the region predating the establishment of the Israeli state.

Still doesn't justify suicide bombers or constant rocket attacks.

I know you agree.

Just saying that if they have a criticism against Israel, there are better ways to deal with it. Like I said, sad that we've gotten to this point, because Fatah was willing to talk peace.

Hamas isn't.

[Flames Fan, Ph.D.]

Originally Posted by Azure

Still doesn't justify suicide bombers or constant rocket attacks.

I know you agree.

I do agree.

And I ask you to take a step back and consider the magnitude of your comments.

In other words, what justifies the killing of another human being?

[Mean Mr. Mustard]

Originally Posted by Flames Fan, Ph.D.

I do agree.

And I ask you to take a step back and consider the magnitude of your comments.

In other words, what justifies the killing of another human being?

Protecting my family and my country and what it stands for. In my opinion at least.