2010 British election

[PyramidsofMars]

Wow, a boring old election between a crappy Labour leader known the world over as 'that guy who took over for Tony Blair' and the Conservative candidate and a posh pretty-boy elitist (in the genuine sense of the word) whose idea of Britain is of old boys' clubs and cups of tea while watching the test match, of 'law and order' and dealing with the ruffians (anybody who isn't rich or posh) justly, just got interesting.

Nick Clegg, leader of the traditional 'third party' in Britain, the Liberal Democrats, who are a liberal party in the true sense (their book of office is Mill's On Liberty) has skyrocketed in the polls after the first debate from a measly third place of near-irrelevance to a statistically insignificant one point lead over the Tories and a five point lead over Labour.

Has Britain's middle class finally found its voice? Maybe Clegg's vote transcends class. Perhaps if he holds onto it and really shakes things up, elections will become less about the posh vs. the working class. It's already less about that.

Gives me mild hope that the NDP under its future post-Layton leader, or a new party entirely, can enter the Canadian scene and break apart this ridiculous two-horse race between the gigantic jokes that our Tory and Liberal parties are.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/...rticle1542582/

[RedHot25]

Originally Posted by PyramidsofMars

Nick Clegg, leader of the traditional 'third party' in Britain, the Liberal Democrats, who are a liberal party in the true sense (their book of office is Mill's On Liberty) has skyrocketed in the polls after the first debate from a measly third place of near-irrelevance to a statistically insignificant one point lead over the Tories and a five point lead over Labour.

Near-irrelevance?

From what I understand - even before the debates - most were predicting that despite finishing way behind in number of seats won, they would likely be the difference makers in a minority gov't.

[starseed]

From what I have read, it seems like Labour is almost a lock to form the government despite the popular vote. As for the NDP, if they shed the fringe elements and continue to try to gain ground in the centre, all it would take is a charismatic new leader to get them a minority. Especially if the Liberals and Conservatives go at each other's throats with attack ads in this next election. (and they certainly will)

It seems kind of hard to imagine right now, however.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by starseed

From what I have read, it seems like Labour is almost a lock to form the government despite the popular vote. As for the NDP, if they shed the fringe elements and continue to try to gain ground in the centre, all it would take is a charismatic new leader to get them a minority. Especially if the Liberals and Conservatives go at each other's throats with attack ads in this next election. (and they certainly will)

It seems kind of hard to imagine right now, however.

Never happen for the NDP, in order for them to get anywhere near a minority they would have to get rid of their platform and sell their soul and adopt a moderate middle ground platform. They're not going to do that ever. They realize that they'll never be anything more then a third place alternative for the labour unions and the poor, and they're completely content fullfilling that need.

[Coys1882]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Never happen for the NDP, in order for them to get anywhere near a minority they would have to get rid of their platform and sell their soul and adopt a moderate middle ground platform. They're not going to do that ever. They realize that they'll never be anything more then a third place alternative for the labour unions and the poor, and they're completely content fullfilling that need.

and that is why I hate them.

[PyramidsofMars]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Never happen for the NDP, in order for them to get anywhere near a minority they would have to get rid of their platform and sell their soul and adopt a moderate middle ground platform. They're not going to do that ever. They realize that they'll never be anything more then a third place alternative for the labour unions and the poor, and they're completely content fullfilling that need.

I completely agree with you. An NDP that would win even a minority would not really be the NDP.

Canada is not a social-democratic country, nor a conservative country, nor a particularly left-wing country in any sense. The only parties that will win elections are moderate, centrist parties, as much as we all like to fling mud around and pretend that the Conservatives are Fascists and the Liberals are Marxists.

[troutman]

Posh - hee hee, makes me giggle. Brits talk funny.

[NBC]

Originally Posted by starseed

From what I have read, it seems like Labour is almost a lock to form the government despite the popular vote.

Really not sure what you are reading but that is far from the consensus on this side of the pond. In fact the vast majority of pollsters think that it will be a Conservative victory - with a minority government or hung parliament as they call it here. There is a real possibility that the LibDems overtake Labour to form official opposition.

Tonight is the next televised debate and we'll see who performs best. This is definitely not a forum for the inarticulate, uncharismatic Prime Minister to flourish in. People seem to be warming to Clegg but remain skeptical on his party's platform/agenda.

For some strange reason they are letting me vote. Should be interesting.

[Suzles]

To other British ex-pats - how do I vote now I am in Calgary - or have I left it too late?

[NBC]

Originally Posted by Suzles

To other British ex-pats - how do I vote now I am in Calgary - or have I left it too late?

If you are British and living in Canada, you would need to apply for a postal ballot. But you have probably left it too late now.

http://www.aboutmyvote.co.uk/

[HotHotHeat]

Originally Posted by troutman

Posh - hee hee, makes me giggle. Brits talk funny.

Giggle is one word for it.

[GirlySports]

So I'm trying to catch up on the debates, only watched the domestic one so far. Will watch the foreign issues one later. Just a first (uneducated) opinion seems like UK is so far behind Canada and US.

1. This is the first ever leaders debate on tv. Really? In 2010? How did people know what they were voting for in the past?
2. They're talking about addressing too many immigrants by introducing a points-system. Canada's had this since the 60s.
3. They're talking about recalling MPs who are too corrupt but this may be a drastic measure.
4. They're talking about making the House of Lords less useless. It's been useless since the beginning of time.
5. Education and over-testing. UK students losing to the rest of the world.
6. Law. Talking about tougher sentences and less parole. Some bloke got burglerized 5 times by the same burgler!

The debate was mostly the new guy (Lib-Dem) saying the other two guys are useless

I really thought UK was more advanced than this in 2010.

[mariners_fever]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

So I'm trying to catch up on the debates, only watched the domestic one so far. Will watch the foreign issues one later. Just a first (uneducated) opinion seems like UK is so far behind Canada and US.

4. They're talking about making the House of Lords less useless. It's been useless since the beginning of time.

I really thought UK was more advanced than this in 2010.

Since the House of Lords is the equivalent to our Senate, I'd say they're further ahead than us on this issue as at least it hits their debate and is an issue. Here, it never is an actual election issue; reforms are only being attempted by swerving around the constitutional mechanisms that would require such reform to be subject to an amendment process like Meech Lake or Charlottetown.

At least the UK has already abolished some of the 'jobs for life' positions in the House of Lords like the hereditary peers.

[Hemi-Cuda]

anyone who lived in BC when the NDP held power knows how disastrous it would be for Canada to have them in power, they almost single-handedly ruined the forestry industry and didn't give a damn about anyone outside of their base of the retirees and the poor

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by mariners_fever

Since the House of Lords is the equivalent to our Senate, I'd say they're further ahead than us on this issue as at least it hits their debate and is an issue. Here, it never is an actual election issue; reforms are only being attempted by swerving around the constitutional mechanisms that would require such reform to be subject to an amendment process like Meech Lake or Charlottetown.

At least the UK has already abolished some of the 'jobs for life' positions in the House of Lords like the hereditary peers.

Canada's tried to elect senators. And there would be senate reform if there was a conservative majority. There would be another Meech Lake.

UK's had majorities forever. Brown is the one in the debate talking about an elected House of Lords. His party has been the majority 13 years. What's taking so long?

[amorak]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

So I'm trying to catch up on the debates, only watched the domestic one so far. Will watch the foreign issues one later. Just a first (uneducated) opinion seems like UK is so far behind Canada and US.

1. This is the first ever leaders debate on tv. Really? In 2010? How did people know what they were voting for in the past?
2. They're talking about addressing too many immigrants by introducing a points-system. Canada's had this since the 60s.
3. They're talking about recalling MPs who are too corrupt but this may be a drastic measure.
4. They're talking about making the House of Lords less useless. It's been useless since the beginning of time.
5. Education and over-testing. UK students losing to the rest of the world.
6. Law. Talking about tougher sentences and less parole. Some bloke got burglerized 5 times by the same burgler!

The debate was mostly the new guy (Lib-Dem) saying the other two guys are useless

I really thought UK was more advanced than this in 2010.

The Canadian points system has been overhauled several times, to the point where it's actually harder for, say, a 30 year old Brit Engineer to move here than an 90 year old Indian woman with no english. The Brit's are talking about a point program that actually increases a person’s score the more they'd fit in with their culture, as opposed to the Current Canadian system that adds points for multiculturalism... aka being old and unable to speak english, as well as being here to be a drain our health care system.

I am exaggerating a bit, but unfortunately, not a lot...

[Canada 02]

Originally Posted by amorak

The Canadian points system has been overhauled several times, to the point where it's actually harder for, say, a 30 year old Brit Engineer to move here than an 90 year old Indian woman with no english. The Brit's are talking about a point program that actually increases a person’s score the more they'd fit in with their culture, as opposed to the Current Canadian system that adds points for multiculturalism... aka being old and unable to speak english, as well as being here to be a drain our health care system.

I am exaggerating a bit, but unfortunately, not a lot...

Looks like you are exaggerating a lot. This is the questionaire. Education, english or french proficiency, and work skill are given a premium

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/immigra...sess/index.asp

this is the same questionaire, but shows the points for each category and answer

http://www.workpermit.com/canada/points_calculator.htm

[amorak]

Fair enough I was going off a couple of British acquaintances who said as much. Being that they'd been through the process, I took them at their (admittedly biased) word.

[GirlySports]

British? Bias? NO WAY!

[Flame Of Liberty]

Originally Posted by PyramidsofMars

Nick Clegg, leader of the traditional 'third party' in Britain, the Liberal Democrats, who are a liberal party in the true sense (their book of office is Mill's On Liberty)

ridiculous

Lib dems = traditional liberals watered down with socialists. A cat mixed with a dog so to speak...

The party was formed in 1988 by a merger of the Liberal Party and the Social Democratic Party.

Promoting social liberalism, the Liberal Democrats voice strong support for constitutional reform, electoral reform, civil liberties, and higher taxes for public services.

The party objects to state limitations on individual rights and favours a welfare state that provides for the necessities and amenities of life

The Liberal Democrats are the most pro-European Union of the three main parties in the UK.


British Liberals in the true sense are spinning in their graves.