2009 NCAA football thread!!

[nfotiu]

Originally Posted by Jesse834

He will not be coaching in the Sugar Bowl. Ouch.
http://www.sportingnews.com/college-...football-coach

Seems pretty shady to me. If the coach in the biggest (non nc) bcs game doesn't even want to bother sticking around for it, shows that these bowl games are viewed pretty much as exhibition games. The major bowls have lost so much of their luster since they added the nc game, I have no idea why any one would want to preserve them. The stands at these big bowl games look more empty every year. Only a matter of time before they are looking for ways to make them more profitable.

[transplant99]

Another thing to consider...IF (and those detractors need not chime in here...we get it already) there was some sort of playoff system, do you think Kelly leaves his club to go to ND...when he is undefeated and has a legitimate shot at winning a NC?

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Another thing to consider...IF (and those detractors need not chime in here...we get it already) there was some sort of playoff system, do you think Kelly leaves his club to go to ND...when he is undefeated and has a legitimate shot at winning a NC?

Definitely not, another good argument for a playoff.
However, why doesnt the NCAA just institute a rule that you can't hire new coaches until Jan 10 or something.

[wpgflamesfan]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

Definitely not, another good argument for a playoff.
However, why doesnt the NCAA just institute a rule that you can't hire new coaches until Jan 10 or something.

Are you kidding me?

Coaching Job at ND = Huge Salary, Great Television Exposure, Easier Recruiting, Great Facilities.

vs.

Current Job at CIN (with playoff) = Possible BCS Championship, Possible Salary Increase, Possibility that ND hires someone else.


Even though it would probably be the "right" thing to do, why would anyone stay somewhere with a bunch of possibilities, rather then go somewhere with some damn good guarantees.

[cheevers]

Originally Posted by moon

how is it not greener pastures?

He now has a national recruiting base, top notch facilities, big money in salary and to spend on coaching/recruiting, is on TV every week, is the coach of one of the top 5 all-time programs.

Also if his team goes undefeated they play for the NC.

Notre Dame may be down but it is a way better situation than Cincinatti and with him coaching they probably beat the Bearcats by a TD or two.

Yes this is a great point, but with that national recruiting base comes a program with a higher academic standard. It will always be harder to convince these kids to come to a school where they not only have to worry about football, but also need to go to class in order to remain academically eligible.

Also in terms of competing for the national championship every year, yeah if they go undefeated they are for sure in the NC, but they also usually play tougher teams during the year than Cincinatti. And this year featured a lot of undefeated teams, had one more team lost this year, Cincinatti could very possibly be playing for a NC this year.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by wpgflamesfan

Are you kidding me?

Coaching Job at ND = Huge Salary, Great Television Exposure, Easier Recruiting, Great Facilities.

vs.

Current Job at CIN (with playoff) = Possible BCS Championship, Possible Salary Increase, Possibility that ND hires someone else.


Even though it would probably be the "right" thing to do, why would anyone stay somewhere with a bunch of possibilities, rather then go somewhere with some damn good guarantees.

Really? You think if Cincinnati were in an 8 team playoff he'd jump before the tournament starts in a week or so?

[wpgflamesfan]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

Really? You think if Cincinnati were in an 8 team playoff he'd jump before the tournament starts in a week or so?

Why not. What benefit could he possibly gain from staying? A national championship with the possibility that ND fills the opening with someone else and you loose out on one of the college football "dream jobs".

[JayP]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Another thing to consider...IF (and those detractors need not chime in here...we get it already) there was some sort of playoff system, do you think Kelly leaves his club to go to ND...when he is undefeated and has a legitimate shot at winning a NC?

He probably would. How many Notre Dame level jobs are there out there? Maybe 5-6? Is it worth it for Kelly to pass on an NCAA dream job for a 1/16th chance at a National Championship in the playoffs?

Going to Notre Dame and getting the recruits he can get there would actually probably increase his chances of winning a championship than would staying with Cincy this year.

But this is all relative to the type of playoff implemented. I don't understand how you go on and on about adding a playoff, but not be specific about which one is going to be put into place. If the playoff is a 4-team playoff, then he might stay. If the playoff is a 16-team playoff, then he probably goes.

Either way, this sort of scenario only happens once every 3-4 years and really isn't a big selling point for a playoff (much like academics for the non-playoff people).

[GirlySports]

Interesting. Does a basketball coach who qualified for the tournament with a small school immediately jump ship and goes to a Kentucky or UCLA before the tournament starts?

[moon]

Originally Posted by cheevers

Yes this is a great point, but with that national recruiting base comes a program with a higher academic standard. It will always be harder to convince these kids to come to a school where they not only have to worry about football, but also need to go to class in order to remain academically eligible.

The last couple of years ND has got top 5 recruiting classes with those tough academic standards.

Also in terms of competing for the national championship every year, yeah if they go undefeated they are for sure in the NC, but they also usually play tougher teams during the year than Cincinatti. And this year featured a lot of undefeated teams, had one more team lost this year, Cincinatti could very possibly be playing for a NC this year.

Cincinnati had as good/lucky as season as possible and they still needed two teams (TCU would in the NC game before them).

They certainly play a much easier schedule but what are the chances that Cincinnati gets as many breaks in their own games to give them wins, has the talent to go undefeated and only one team from the Big 12, SEC, Big Ten, Pac 10 and maybe even the ACC goes undefeated?

It was a nice year for Cincinnati and if Florida doesn't care about not playing for the NC they may even end up undefeated but they still are a long ways away from winning a NC and not likely to get this close again any time soon.

[moon]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

Interesting. Does a basketball coach who qualified for the tournament with a small school immediately jump ship and goes to a Kentucky or UCLA before the tournament starts?

The tournament is a much different situation than playing in a bowl game.

You have a chance to win the NC in College Basketball, does it really matter if Cincinnati wins or loses their game?

For every team outside of Alabama and Texas the season is over and this is just a bonus reward that they get.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by moon

The tournament is a much different situation than playing in a bowl game.

You have a chance to win the NC in College Basketball, does it really matter if Cincinnati wins or loses their game?

For every team outside of Alabama and Texas the season is over and this is just a bonus reward that they get.

We're debating if football had a playoff, would a coach resign before the tournament.

[valo403]

You guys are all apparently missing the fact that December and the bowl season is a crucial recruiting phase. The reason that coaches leave for their new job before bowl games is the need to actually have a team in place for the following spring. Football doesn't work like basketball, the recruiting cycle is completely different, so a comparison is rather ridiculous.

I'm sure Kelly would have loved to have stuck around through the bowl and coached his team, but he'd also like to walk into South Bend with an actual crop of recruits. If the ND job remains in flux for 8 weeks there are going to be at least a few big time recruits who de-commit, you don't enter a job by letting talent walk away.

As for the 'would he in a playoff' question: Yes. He would. This is one of the biggest jobs in all of sports, you don't turn it down to hang onto a Rudy story. Although I'm sure that'd make a great after school special.

[transplant99]

I don't understand how you go on and on about adding a playoff, but not be specific about which one is going to be put into place.

Well mostly because i have no say in it.

As for the ND job....yes he may still have gone, but i dont think the decision is anywhere as easy if he is facing a real chance with a NC as a cherry on an undefeated season. As it stood now, he was facing taking the job ( and i am sure whole lot more $$) vs a trip to a meaningless Sugar Bowl game.

I dont think ND will EVER get back to the once prestigious level it was at. Kids used to want to play there as a dream spot. That was ata a time when academics was the pursuit and football was secondary/. these days, and lets not kid ourselves, a large majority of the kids in the good football programs (FL,USC, Texas, Etc) are not majoring in economics or business, they are majoring in football, with a prerequisite minor in some program. This aint 1973 anymore, and though sad, a reality. $$$ is what its all about anymore.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Well mostly because i have no say in it.

As for the ND job....yes he may still have gone, but i dont think the decision is anywhere as easy if he is facing a real chance with a NC as a cherry on an undefeated season. As it stood now, he was facing taking the job ( and i am sure whole lot more $$) vs a trip to a meaningless Sugar Bowl game.

I dont think ND will EVER get back to the once prestigious level it was at. Kids used to want to play there as a dream spot. That was ata a time when academics was the pursuit and football was secondary/. these days, and lets not kid ourselves, a large majority of the kids in the good football programs (FL,USC, Texas, Etc) are not majoring in economics or business, they are majoring in football, with a prerequisite minor in some program. This aint 1973 anymore, and though sad, a reality. $$$ is what its all about anymore.

Cincy doesn't have a real chance at a NC in a playoff. They are not a good football team, not relative to Bama, Florida, Texas, TCU, or even OSU.

I agree to an extent with your assessment of the ND job, but ND still has numerous advantages over any other program in the country. Nobody else has a national tv deal on par, nobody else has a national backing like ND, and there are very few programs with the alumni network (some of which aren't even alumni) than ND. It's bigger money, bigger prestige, better facilities better recruits, and overall a greater opportunity than all but a handful of programs in the country. If Kelly was going from USC, Texas, or Florida to ND there would have been second thoughts, but outside of those (and a couple other) elites there's no second guessing that offer.

[transplant99]

Cincy doesn't have a real chance at a NC in a playoff. They are not a good football team, not relative to Bama, Florida, Texas, TCU, or even OSU.

Strictly your opinion.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Strictly your opinion.

I'd like to see you find me anyone outside of the greater Cincinnati region who thinks a Tony Pike lead team is a legitimate contender for best in the nation.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by valo403

I'd like to see you find me anyone outside of the greater Cincinnati region who thinks a Tony Pike lead team is a legitimate contender for best in the nation.

Really? I have to find you others who dont think like you to make this more than an opinion??

How about...#3 in the BCS standings, # 4 in the Harris, #4 in the USA, and #2 in the final computer rankings??

Sadly we will never know however, because college football is above a playoff to find out.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Really? I have to find you others who dont think like you to make this more than an opinion??

How about...#3 in the BCS standings, # 4 in the Harris, #4 in the USA, and #2 in the final computer rankings??

Sadly we will never know however, because college football is above a playoff to find out.

If you stay undefeated you're going to be ranked in the top 5, that doesn't make you an elite team. I've watched Cincy play a lot this year, and have actually backed them due to the CMU ties of Kelly and a roommate who is CMU alum, but they simply aren't that good. They beat average/bad teams all year long.

BTW, the plus one system that I have pushed for all along would see Cincy get their chance.

[JayP]

Originally Posted by transplant99

I dont think ND will EVER get back to the once prestigious level it was at. Kids used to want to play there as a dream spot. That was ata a time when academics was the pursuit and football was secondary/. these days, and lets not kid ourselves, a large majority of the kids in the good football programs (FL,USC, Texas, Etc) are not majoring in economics or business, they are majoring in football, with a prerequisite minor in some program. This aint 1973 anymore, and though sad, a reality. $$$ is what its all about anymore.

Notre Dame may never get back to what they once were, but tons of programs can say the same thing. It's a completely different landscape in college football.

However, Notre Dame has still been pulling in top 5 recruiting classes in spite of those academic restrictions. They're still able to pull elite, NFL-quality talent like Tate, Floyd, and Clausen. They have the best TV deal in all of college football, a huge national following, and still are the most talked about team in college football despite being average for so long.

Notre Dame may never be at the level that USC, Florida, Bama, Texas, etc. are at now ever again, but they'll certainly be at a higher level than Cincy and that's all that really matters.