Trading.....

[CMPunk]

Why is it down?

Fear of making a bad trade and being called out on it?

Cap space issues?

Lack of interest?

Can't get what you want?

You're happy where you are?

You're the Flyers and no one will trade with you?

[simmer2]

Good idea Spike, trading has definitely been down. My opinion is the teams lower in the standings still have way too high an asking price for an upgrade...that's why I haven't made a lot of moves. I did have one deal in place and still do but the Cheese room is an issue for the other squad.

For teams deciding to wait until the trade deadline, IMO value drops as more games are played. I'd rather pay for a player now and get more games out of them than trade for them with 2 games left in the season...I definitely won't pay nearly as much as I would now.

As for my situation, my team is playing pretty well right now so I'm not looking to make a ton of moves. I am still trying to upgrade Derek Armstrong (59) to a 61 or 62 OVR player but again I'm not going to make a move if I feel the asking price is too high.

[flambers]

Good question, no clue why its down. In my case I have Cheese room and trying to acquire a depth forward or depth dman. Not a lot of luck so far.

[Slava]

I would be more than happy to make trades. Problem in my case is the only players I have that people want seem to be the same players that I want to keep. Even the contending teams are only after my young hopefuls....which as a rebuilding team makes no sense to trade away.

[Da_Chief]

Originally Posted by CMPunk

Why is it down?

Fear of making a bad trade and being called out on it?

Cap space issues?

Lack of interest?

Can't get what you want?

You're happy where you are?

You're the Flyers and no one will trade with you?

Hit it right on the head King Risebrough!

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by Slava

Even the contending teams are only after my young hopefuls....which as a rebuilding team makes no sense to trade away.

This is pretty much it for me. I feel like I already have a strong team so I have little interest in trading strong long-term assets for a diminishing one.

I guess I'm pretty happy with my squad which is the Wild haven't been trading much.

[Knut]

I have been extremely busy lately. To the point where i felt helpless during my recent 9 game losing streak. I will remain this way until the new year.

Also.... I have all the old players in the league. It is really hard to make deals when your average age is close to 34.

[Goffie]

For me now I have done enough tweaking and I am happy as long as my team is doing well. I find that a few little shakeup deals when I am struggling is enough to get things going.

I am also in the same position as Grant as I feel I have a strong enough team and don't need to deal top youth for fading vets. Maybe closer to the deadline if I feel I am missing one very good piece to be a contender I will pay up, but right now I feel I have the players to make a run and just need a few minor chemistry oriented tweaks.

[Sample00]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

This is pretty much it for me. I feel like I already have a strong team so I have little interest in trading strong long-term assets for a diminishing one.

I guess I'm pretty happy with my squad which is the Wild haven't been trading much.

ditto!

[Swayze11]

Originally Posted by simmer2

Good idea Spike, trading has definitely been down. My opinion is the teams lower in the standings still have way too high an asking price for an upgrade...that's why I haven't made a lot of moves. I did have one deal in place and still do but the Cheese room is an issue for the other squad.

For teams deciding to wait until the trade deadline, IMO value drops as more games are played. I'd rather pay for a player now and get more games out of them than trade for them with 2 games left in the season...I definitely won't pay nearly as much as I would now.

As for my situation, my team is playing pretty well right now so I'm not looking to make a ton of moves. I am still trying to upgrade Derek Armstrong (59) to a 61 or 62 OVR player but again I'm not going to make a move if I feel the asking price is too high.

Not sure if this was referring to me but since ive been GM of the Avs, I have had maybe 5-7 trade offers, I am always the one sending them out. I have no problem with that, but like Slava said the only players people are interested in is my young guys (Perron, Wheeler, etc.) which make no sense.

Another issue I have are some GMs offering junk for a "rental" player in Mitchell. He is getting a grid deal regardless of who gives it to him and that grid deal will only be maybe 1 million more then his current contract. Unless its a blue chip prospect or a player currently in the NHL I will not trade him. Why would I want a guy who's been in the AHL for 3 years now and doesn't look like he will get out of there.

Heres my thoughts on the whole "making a push for the cup" and correct me if I am wrong. You give up long term assets to acquire an immediate upgrade reguardless of age, contract status, etc. For example if I traded Willie Mitchell for a blue chip prospect in the ECHL that would make perfect sense, you get a top d-man for this year and I get the long term asset. That is the current issue right now is GMs do not want to give up their top prospects who are 2-3 years away from a CPHL rating. Sure they might eventually get the same rating as Mitchell but thats not the case at this current moment. Now im not saying a Mitchell for Patrick Kane which does not make a lot of sense but a Mitchell for a lower 1st round prospect is not unreasonable is it?

[Prototype]

The only thing of value I have is Ovechkin, and he's been hot lately. His knees in the CPHL are strong, like bull. And I've managed to find a win here and there. While I could take a page out of the MJK playbook and try and trade and trade and trade my way to the top, I'm finally on track to where I want to be at the end of the season.

That being said, I haven't seen many offers I've liked. Peverly had some interest right around the time he signed his contract in the NHL. People were offering like he was still a nobody who hasn't been producing, rather than making a realistic offer for a point per game player.

I think people are more cautious this season, for whatever reason.

[Sylvanfan]

Originally Posted by simmer2

As for my situation, my team is playing pretty well right now so I'm not looking to make a ton of moves. I am still trying to upgrade Derek Armstrong (59) to a 61 or 62 OVR player but again I'm not going to make a move if I feel the asking price is too high.

The problem is why would a bad team take a guy like him back unless you sweeten the pot for them? Derek Armstrong isn't a guy you can use in a rebuild. When teams are making upgrades I think they need to realize that the guy they're dumping if it's a Derek Armstrong has zero or negative value and is more or less there to balance the money out and that it's the other assets that will make the deal happen.

It's the same old thing. Good teams want to get upgrades for junk, and bad teams want top end prospects for mediocre veterans. Eventually someone cracks or teams are forced to meet in the middle.

No one has the guts to give away good prospects to get a veteran player for a playoff run anymore because they think it won't matter as the good teams are too good anyway. Or teams who have them are already so good...that other teams don't have anything they want that they'd trade a decent asset to get. I remember in 04-05 with a lockout, people would give youth for vets because vets had ratings. Those days are long gone, and so is a lot of the trading during the season.

There is a serious asset imbalance in this league too as about 6 teams have an pretty high number of the best assets and have no real need to trade them. Basically unless those teams are pretty much going to trade with each other because no one else has anything they need. As a result theres a few teams with very little and they're in a position where the only assets other teams want are the ones they really don't want to trade. We're a bit like the NHL where most of the moves are going to be offseason stuff to get back within cap now.

[simmer2]

Originally Posted by Swayze11

Not sure if this was referring to me but since ive been GM of the Avs, I have had maybe 5-7 trade offers, I am always the one sending them out. I have no problem with that, but like Slava said the only players people are interested in is my young guys (Perron, Wheeler, etc.) which make no sense.

Another issue I have are some GMs offering junk for a "rental" player in Mitchell. He is getting a grid deal regardless of who gives it to him and that grid deal will only be maybe 1 million more then his current contract. Unless its a blue chip prospect or a player currently in the NHL I will not trade him. Why would I want a guy who's been in the AHL for 3 years now and doesn't look like he will get out of there.

Heres my thoughts on the whole "making a push for the cup" and correct me if I am wrong. You give up long term assets to acquire an immediate upgrade reguardless of age, contract status, etc. For example if I traded Willie Mitchell for a blue chip prospect in the ECHL that would make perfect sense, you get a top d-man for this year and I get the long term asset. That is the current issue right now is GMs do not want to give up their top prospects who are 2-3 years away from a CPHL rating. Sure they might eventually get the same rating as Mitchell but thats not the case at this current moment. Now im not saying a Mitchell for Patrick Kane which does not make a lot of sense but a Mitchell for a lower 1st round prospect is not unreasonable is it?

Pat, you make some good points. I'm in a similar boat as you, most of the time I'm making the offer to another team. I think you are one of the few GM's I get offered a deal rather than the other way around.

As for the UFA situation, it's definitely an interesting one. The problem is, most contenders are fairly close to the salary cap so they don't want to be taking on a lot of salary...for me I'm mainly looking for guys with 1 year left on their contract so I can just release them to free agency. I was in a similar boat a year ago because I saw upcoming UFA's as having just as much value as a regular guy on a grid contract because really, how often to UFA's go to free agency, they almost always get signed to a grid contract.

[simmer2]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

The problem is why would a bad team take a guy like him back unless you sweeten the pot for them? Derek Armstrong isn't a guy you can use in a rebuild. When teams are making upgrades I think they need to realize that the guy they're dumping if it's a Derek Armstrong has zero or negative value and is more or less there to balance the money out and that it's the other assets that will make the deal happen.

It's the same old thing. Good teams want to get upgrades for junk, and bad teams want top end prospects for mediocre veterans. Eventually someone cracks or teams are forced to meet in the middle.

No one has the guts to give away good prospects to get a veteran player for a playoff run anymore because they think it won't matter as the good teams are too good anyway. Or teams who have them are already so good...that other teams don't have anything they want that they'd trade a decent asset to get. I remember in 04-05 with a lockout, people would give youth for vets because vets had ratings. Those days are long gone, and so is a lot of the trading during the season.

There is a serious asset imbalance in this league too as about 6 teams have an pretty high number of the best assets and have no real need to trade them. Basically unless those teams are pretty much going to trade with each other because no one else has anything they need. As a result theres a few teams with very little and they're in a position where the only assets other teams want are the ones they really don't want to trade. We're a bit like the NHL where most of the moves are going to be offseason stuff to get back within cap now.

With Armstrong specifically, he's a throw-in and I'd mainly be looking at a prospect/pick to upgrade. In general most teams need to have a CPHL guy going back their way as they are barely able to ice the minimum roster spots on forward or defense.

And I agree with you Chad, there are probably 6 or 7 teams that have the best assets and most often you'll see trades between those teams and very few between the poor and rich teams. I think that's why the teams without the assets are asking for so much more, because they are just trying to get to the point where they are competitive. As for what can be done about it, I don't know. There are a few leagues out there which only allow you to keep a certain number of players carrying over to the next year; ie) you'd only be able to re-sign one of your UFA's for the year, all others would go into the free agency pool. This would force asset-heavy teams to likely move their better UFA's either before the deadline or be forced to release them.

Two years ago I was able to move a lot of my older vets but it seems that has really changed; good teams want a lower asking price and lower teams don't want to budge because they want to get a decent asset back.

[I wanna be like Miikka]

I'm just waiting for the right time to offer up Mike Richards for Iginla.

I know trading is down on my end because I'm a lot more busy. I've maybe received 4 trade offers in the past 10-12 months, so unless I'm on msn messaging people asking them then I usually don't get much done in the way of trading.

Also, most of the time the biggest traders are the rebuilding teams. This year that hasn't been the case so much, likely due in part to high prices of the contenders. Really though, when I was rebuilding I used to love seeing a contending team lose a bunch of games, because I knew they wanted to make a move bad and I could go in there and give them something they need (Maybe GMs are more patient now).

It should be interesting to see who gives in first, the rebuilding teams or the contenders.

[simmer2]

Originally Posted by I wanna be like Miikka

I'm just waiting for the right time to offer up Mike Richards for Iginla.

I know trading is down on my end because I'm a lot more busy. I've maybe received 4 trade offers in the past 10-12 months, so unless I'm on msn messaging people asking them then I usually don't get much done in the way of trading.

Also, most of the time the biggest traders are the rebuilding teams. This year that hasn't been the case so much, likely due in part to high prices of the contenders. Really though, when I was rebuilding I used to love seeing a contending team lose a bunch of games, because I knew they wanted to make a move bad and I could go in there and give them something they need (Maybe GMs are more patient now).

It should be interesting to see who gives in first, the rebuilding teams or the contenders.

I'll just continue to add to the thread; Ravi makes an interesting point. A lot of the really active GM's used to be the rebuilding ones which is good becasue they'll try and make a lot of deals happen. I like to trade a lot (last year I traded a bunch) but this year I am actually doing well so I'm not as inclined to make a move.

[CMPunk]

Originally Posted by Da_Chief

Hit it right on the head King Risebrough!

At least I have the guts to do what it takes to improve my team. I'm not ashamed of either deal
I made to win those awards.

The reason I'm not trading is because I hardly see anyone on msn when I'm on. As well, the one part
I'm looking for seems to be tough to find or cost a lot and I don't have the pieces to pay for it.

[Swayze11]

Originally Posted by CMPunk

At least I have the guts to do what it takes to improve my team. I'm not ashamed of either deal
I made to win those awards.

The reason I'm not trading is because I hardly see anyone on msn when I'm on. As well, the one part
I'm looking for seems to be tough to find or cost a lot and I don't have the pieces to pay for it.

This is a big part of the lack of trading. It seems you, Simmer, Victor, Dan, Joe, Ian, Grant, Matt(stars), flambers, Syl, Ravi, and Trevor are the only consistent GMs on MSN. Ive said this for awhile and I think something needs to be inforced. I understand people have busy lives but it kinda sucks seeing the same GMs online.

[simmer2]

Originally Posted by CMPunk

At least I have the guts to do what it takes to improve my team. I'm not ashamed of either deal
I made to win those awards.

The reason I'm not trading is because I hardly see anyone on msn when I'm on. As well, the one part
I'm looking for seems to be tough to find or cost a lot and I don't have the pieces to pay for it.

What's that?

[Sylvanfan]

Well there is one GM in this league I got sick of and absolutely won't deal with because it's not worth putting up with his crap. Got sick of the way he treats everyone and types like a 6 year old on MSN. It's one thing to act a jerk, and it's another to actually be one which this guy is. So that has slowed my trading down a bit. I think a few others have black listed this guy too, he's the new LA Kings GM.

I used to be pretty harsh on Axel some time back and I guess it got to him. Eventually I figured it out and offered him an apology and was able to somewhat salvage that relationship. You know it's not so bad to own up to being responsible for your actions sometimes.