Who's getting the H1N1 shot?

[troutman]

Hospitalized Patients with 2009 H1N1 Influenza in the United States, April–June 2009

http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/NEJMoa0906695


Methods Using medical charts, we collected data on 272 patients who were hospitalized for at least 24 hours for influenza-like illness and who tested positive for the 2009 H1N1 virus with the use of a real-time reverse-transcriptase–polymerase-chain-reaction assay.

Results Of the 272 patients we studied, 25% were admitted to an intensive care unit and 7% died. Forty-five percent of the patients were children under the age of 18 years, and 5% were 65 years of age or older. Seventy-three percent of the patients had at least one underlying medical condition; these conditions included asthma; diabetes; heart, lung, and neurologic diseases; and pregnancy. Of the 249 patients who underwent chest radiography on admission, 100 (40%) had findings consistent with pneumonia. Of the 268 patients for whom data were available regarding the use of antiviral drugs, such therapy was initiated in 200 patients (75%) at a median of 3 days after the onset of illness. Data suggest that the use of antiviral drugs was beneficial in hospitalized patients, especially when such therapy was initiated early.

Conclusions During the evaluation period, 2009 H1N1 influenza caused severe illness requiring hospitalization, including pneumonia and death. Nearly three quarters of the patients had one or more underlying medical conditions. Few severe illnesses were reported among persons 65 years of age or older. Patients seemed to benefit from antiviral therapy.

http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/NEJMoa0908535

Conclusions These data suggest that a single dose of 15 µg of hemagglutinin antigen without alum adjuvant induces a typically protective immune response in the majority of subjects between 12 and 60 years of age. Lesser immune responses were seen after a single dose of vaccine in younger and older subjects.

[MelBridgeman]

Originally Posted by Dion

Zero? Simply not true.



http://www.calgaryherald.com/health/...458/story.html

Like i said in a previous post - genetic disposition.. seems aboringinals get hit harded then others

First, the agency is receiving reports that infections in Inuit communities in Canada are showing "disproportionate numbers of serious cases occurring,” said Keiji Fukuda, WHO's interim assistant director-general for health security and environment. The agency is seeing “a larger number than expected of young Inuit people developing serious illnesses requiring hospitalization.”

But i am also not denying that H1N1 will take the life of otherwise healthy people either.

[Raekwon]

Originally Posted by NuclearFart

The other thing people don't know is that it's not really the virus that kills you; it's the body's immune system over-reacting and flooding the lungs with reactive cells and fibrotic tissue. Why is this relevant to you? Because it means having a "competent" or "healthy" immune system is 1) not as protective against H1N1 as against the usual/seasonal flu strain, and 2) could theoretically exacerbate H1N1 complications. Hence why we are seeing a disproportionate amount of young, healthy adults being admitting to hospital and requiring ICU admission.

Well if this is the case then I guess people with healthy immune systems should be the first to get shots

[jammies]

Originally Posted by NuclearFart

However miniscule you perceive the risk, if it includes death, a couple days of mild malaise is a small price to pay for some degree of protection.

Not according to my estimation of the risks. I'm - at minimum - just as likely to die in a car accident this year. I *could* take the precaution of wearing protective padding and a crash helmet every time I get in the car, which would significantly reduce that risk, but I don't, and neither does anyone else.

There are sound medical reasons for getting the shot (if it was available, which it's not). Fear of a tiny, almost insignificant chance of death is not one of them, and the main problem I have is the inaccurate representation of this flu as some sort of incipient Black Death. The media, as usual, can take most of the blame for hyping this into a disaster - nobody gets panicked over missing a few days of work, but death has a way of focusing the attention.

Further to risk/reward, how much do you think it's costing the Alberta health system to fast-track this vaccine program? Even at a very low guesstimate of $10 a dose and a million doses, that's $30 million for the vaccine alone. Now add in the labour involved in distributing and administering the dose, which can't be much less than the same. That's a very conservative $60 million, and I'd bet that it's more like double or triple that. Could that money have been spent more productively elsewhere in the health care system? Would a more rational programme of targetting only high-risk groups been a better use of the dollars?

[Dion]

Originally Posted by jammies

Now add in the labour involved in distributing and administering the dose, which can't be much less than the same.

Ever consider the fact they are using pre existing staff and only reasigned them to do the vaccines? Or the fact they shutdown heath clincs so those staff could administer the vaccine? I don't see how that raises the cost to the health system.

[Rerun]

Originally Posted by Drury18

Zero.

All deaths have been in people with pre-existing medical conditions as per the Alberta Health Board. No healthy people have died from this flu in Alberta and more then 95% of deaths across Canada have been in people with underlying conditions.

I am hoping they do an autopsy on the 13 year old from Toronto who died of the flu because I don't believe for a second that a perfectly healthy 13 year old boy goes from having a bath to dead in 10 minutes. That's an undetected underlying condition at work there, not a flu.

Perhaps zero deaths but I suspect that many people without underlying health problems have been admitted to hospitals. They may even be hooked up to ventilators of which there is a limited number of in most hospitals.

The impact of large numbers of people being admitted to hospitals because of serious flu symptons, could be catastrophic to our health care system. If you think lineups are long in hospital Emergency departments now, wait till you have hundreds of people with serious flu symptoms clogging the hospital Emergency departments.

[Knut]

^
Add the economic impact of having 10 to 30% of the workforce staying home because of flu symptoms.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Dion

Giving people a heads up as to what this virus could do to our health system is a good thing. Far too many people take our heath system for granted and assume it will always be there for them if they ever get sick. To me that attitude needs to change.

Giving people a heads up is one thing, but yelling fire in a crowded theatre is another.

The vaccine isn't even available to most people in Canada, so until it is, there is no point in demanding that people get it or insinuating that they are dooming society if they don't.

Not to mention that even if all the people who want it go out and get the vaccine when it is available to them, the logistical problems will make it unlikely that everyone in that group will get it in time. Therefore, you should stop worrying about people who choose not to get it.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

Giving people a heads up is one thing, but yelling fire in a crowded theatre is another.

The vaccine isn't even available to most people in Canada, so until it is, there is no point in demanding that people get it or insinuating that they are dooming society if they don't.

When the program was started there was no word or hint of a vaccine shortage. That shortage is creating a lot of problems and panic we are reading about.

Not to mention that even if all the people who want it go out and get the vaccine when it is available to them, the logistical problems will make it unlikely that everyone in that group will get it in time. Therefore, you should stop worrying about people who choose not to get it.

We don't know how future vaccinations will be handled and what changes prov govts will be making to accomidate those that want it.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Dion

When the program was started there was no word or hint of a vaccine shortage. That shortage is creating a lot of problems and panic we are reading about.

We don't know how future vaccinations will be handled and what changes prov govts will be making to accomidate those that want it.

Even without the shortage, it wouldn't have changed anything. I mean, it is only a shortage of 150,000 doses. That wasn't going to make or break anything. It was calculated that even before the shortage, it would take until sometime after the New Year to vaccinate everyone.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

Even without the shortage, it wouldn't have changed anything. I mean, it is only a shortage of 150,000 doses. That wasn't going to make or break anything. It was calculated that even before the shortage, it would take until sometime after the New Year to vaccinate everyone.

The issue is getting the high risks groups done quickly. So far that has been badly mismanaged. They should been screening people right from the start. The vaccine shortage is only going to delay gettng those high risk groups done.

[metallicat]

Does anyone have a 1-800 number I can call to talk to someone about this? I don't think my asthma is bad enough to consider myself high-risk, as it's only exercised induced...but I would like to talk to someone in the industry to see what they say. Is there a phone number to call?

[Mccree]

Originally Posted by oilers_fan

Does anyone have a 1-800 number I can call to talk to someone about this? I don't think my asthma is bad enough to consider myself high-risk, as it's only exercised induced...but I would like to talk to someone in the industry to see what they say. Is there a phone number to call?

http://www.healthlinkalberta.ca/default.htm

Not sure if they will give you an answer other than a generic one but it might help.

[LChoy]

Healthlink sounds like the best place to start
http://www.healthlinkalberta.ca/default.htm

Calgary Health Region (403) 943-5465, Capital Health Region (780) 408-5465, or Toll-Free 1-866-408-5465

[Flames_Gimp]

Originally Posted by Drury18

I don't believe for a second that a perfectly healthy 13 year old boy goes from having a bath to dead in 10 minutes. That's an undetected underlying condition at work there, not a flu.

well he didn't go from bath to death in 10 minutes, they were treating the symptoms for 48 hours, which quite possibly turned into a pneumonia.

and yeah, when you have an infection that goes respiratory, filling lungs with fluid and thick mucus you can drop dead in minutes. could be as simple as a blockage and suffocating.

[HOOT]

Originally Posted by Dion

The issue is getting the high risks groups done quickly. So far that has been badly mismanaged. They should been screening people right from the start. The vaccine shortage is only going to delay gettng those high risk groups done.

I would really be curious on what percentage of people that got their shots so far actually fall into high risk. As far as I can tell there seems to be a ton of people who know they aren't high risk yet still got it.

Can I blame people like them for the deaths of people? Similar how so many here want to blame the people not getting the shot for the deaths of others.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by HOOT

I would really be curious on what percentage of people that got their shots so far actually fall into high risk. As far as I can tell there seems to be a ton of people who know they aren't high risk yet still got it.

Can I blame people like them for the deaths of people? Similar how so many here want to blame the people not getting the shot for the deaths of others.

Blame Dr. Andre Corriveau who said it was his decision to initially open clinics to all Albertans last Monday. Also the federal govt for giving out much the same message.

[HOOT]

Originally Posted by Dion

Blame Dr. Andre Corriveau who said it was his decision to initially open clinics to all Albertans last Monday. Also the federal govt for giving out much the same message.

Why people can't make their own decisions and believe everything they see on TV?

As far as I can tell and remember is there has always been a clear message that high risk patients get it first. If a doctor on TV told you to jump off a bridge would you do it?

[Bagor]

Are long-term smokers a priority group?
You'd think they'd be pretty high risk.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by HOOT

Why people can't make their own decisions and believe everything they see on TV?

As far as I can tell and remember is there has always been a clear message that high risk patients get it first. If a doctor on TV told you to jump off a bridge would you do it?

The message in the beginning was for high risk groups to get thier shots as well as healthy Canadians. Read Jiri's post again.

http://forum.calgarypuck.com/showpos...&postcount=865