Organic Food No Better Than Regular Food?

[Berger_4_]

I just hate when people say that GMO foods are bad for you. No. They're not. If it wasn't for GMO's we wouldn't have enough food to go around...any environmental benefits people think come from eating organic foods are completely neutralized by the fact that you need way more land to grow the same amount of food. If it wasn't for the use of pesticides and herbicides, we could potentially not have enough food. Besides, the amount of chemicals you take in is a tiny, tiny amount. Nowhere near enough to do any harm. If you can handle farm chemical with virtually no safety equipment, how can eating a little bit of the stuff on your potato be bad for you?

[DOK]

Originally Posted by 4X4

I thought people buy organic so that when they're in the line at the grocery store they can hit on the other people with organic food in their baskets.

Isn't that the rule for grocery shopping in the general produce section all the time? I'll buy a starfruit if you have a starfruit and ask how to tell if it's fresh, then throw it out when I get home - kind of idea. Maybe people go for the organic shoppers because they think they have more money?

[DOK]

Originally Posted by Berger_4_

I just hate when people say that GMO foods are bad for you. No. They're not. If it wasn't for GMO's we wouldn't have enough food to go around...any environmental benefits people think come from eating organic foods are completely neutralized by the fact that you need way more land to grow the same amount of food. If it wasn't for the use of pesticides and herbicides, we could potentially not have enough food. Besides, the amount of chemicals you take in is a tiny, tiny amount. Nowhere near enough to do any harm. If you can handle farm chemical with virtually no safety equipment, how can eating a little bit of the stuff on your potato be bad for you?

GMO? Genetically modified? That has nothing to do with organic or chemical treated. Totally separate things. Seedless watermelon is genetically modified, so yes, I agree, gmo isn't always bad for you.

BUT, you could look at the consumption rate of north americans as a whole. They eat like pigs, throw away like people who throw a lot of stuff away and generally don't care about other peoples eating habits. To potentially not have enough food is ridiculous if you've ever been to Vegas, a 2 lb. corn beef sandwich that could feed a family of six being eaten by one skinny guy, who throws 75% of it out, that's the real issue.

And, um, any chemical is not a good thing. Just because it's a tiny amount doesn't make it good. Small doses are still doses.

[Berger_4_]

Originally Posted by DOK

GMO? Genetically modified? That has nothing to do with organic or chemical treated. Totally separate things. Seedless watermelon is genetically modified, so yes, I agree, gmo isn't always bad for you.

BUT, you could look at the consumption rate of north americans as a whole. They eat like pigs, throw away like people who throw a lot of stuff away and generally don't care about other peoples eating habits. To potentially not have enough food is ridiculous if you've ever been to Vegas, a 2 lb. corn beef sandwich that could feed a family of six being eaten by one skinny guy, who throws 75% of it out, that's the real issue.

And, um, any chemical is not a good thing. Just because it's a tiny amount doesn't make it good. Small doses are still doses.

Yeah, I know the difference between GMO and organic food. It was brought up earlier, so I thought I'd throw my two cents in.

I'm not saying that consumption rates are really high. I'm saying that in order for us to maintain our current rate of consumption, using pesticides and herbicides to control the spread of bugs and weeds is a necessity. Go out to the country and have a look at a field that used chemical pest controls and then look at one that didn't. I'd be willing to bet that the one using herbicides and such to control the problems in it look a helluva lot better than the one that doesn't use anything.

I'll agree that a small dose is still a dose, but the thing is that the amount harmful toxins taken in from eating a piece of fruit or vegetable, a slice of bread, or using canola oil would be negligible...it would take hundreds of you taking in the same stuff over and over again for it to affect you in any way.

If I can handle the chemicals in their concentrated state without any really severe effects, then there's no way a tomato or piece of broccoli wouldn't have any effect after being washed and rinsed ten times over.

Oh and just to win over all the alchy's...without all those great 'cides...no beer! Without high grade barley, where are we gentlemen? We're in a very thirsty, very sober place. Or we're drinking Dude for the rest of our lives. And I am not down with Dude.

[DOK]

Didn't mean to come off harsh. Your right, at the current rate, we're doing what's necessary or at the least, what's easiest. I know from my past work at Serca we'd bring in bananas so green they were almost rock hard and the kind of green that comes in crayola boxes. By the time they got shipped to the stores they were a nicer green, so by the time they get to the table they'd finally be yellow. If it's not healthy, it's gross just the same.

I guess it would be nice to have people consume what they need, to grow locally and to live better without killing our earth at an alarming rate. That'll be the most hippie thing you'll ever hear me say.

[Phanuthier]

Ok I'm not really a nutrition nut, but why are people who buy organic foods crazy or gullible or whatever? And wouldn't this study vary from country to country, based on food standards and such?

In the USA, obesity rates %-wise are super high, and talking to a pretty knowledgeable friend, he said it has a lot to do with the growing and preservation of food and how the food isn't digested properly or whatever that causes % of obese Americans to be so much higher then Canada (for example). Since I'm trying to work a little on my fitness and diet, I'm told I should go towards organics for food with more protein per, or carbs per or whatever, so the actual nutrients and whatnot in regular foods is lower, and thus harder to build muscle and whatnot.

Any comments would be welcome

[firebug]

Originally Posted by DOK

And, um, any chemical is not a good thing. Just because it's a tiny amount doesn't make it good. Small doses are still doses.

Where can you get this chemical-free food?

As far as I can tell, the food I eat is comprised entirely of chemicals.

~firebug

[malcolmk14]

Organic food is typically something that white people enjoy.

[corporatejay]

Penn & Teller's Bullshi!t episode was on this last night. Pretty good episode. They even did taste testing, people couldn't tell the difference. Good fruit is good fruit, I can by junk from safeway from the "organic" section too, it just depends on who they buy from.

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by malcolmk14

Organic food is typically something that white people enjoy.

Agreed.

http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/2008...-organic-food/

[yads]

I really like getting produce at the crossroads market in the summers. The produce is usually cheaper and tastes 10 times better than safeway produce.

[kermitology]

Originally Posted by Berger_4_

I just hate when people say that GMO foods are bad for you. No. They're not. If it wasn't for GMO's we wouldn't have enough food to go around...

With the introduction of GM wheat the yields are much higher, but along with that, so is the amount of gluten in wheat. There is a startling increase in the number of cases of celiac disease in the last 50 years, and while I don't have proof, I'd bet dollars to dimes that it's linked to the increase in gluten from higher yields of GM wheat.

So GM CAN be bad for you.

Besides, we should view it as a population control measure. There are too many people on the Earth to be sustainable.

[mykalberta]

Its hard to believe so many people buy organic. Yet eat bread, use cooking oil. All those are sprayed with chemicals.

If farmers didnt use chemcials for wheat, canola, barley etc. I doubt the yield in North America could feed us, let alone help feed the world.

Also, I highly doubt someone could tell the difference between free range chicken and factory chicken if both were prepared as the same dish with same piece. I agree free range chickens have more meat on whole, but you pay per pound so its more expensive.

[burn_baby_burn]

Originally Posted by Berger_4_

If you can handle farm chemical with virtually no safety equipment, how can eating a little bit of the stuff on your potato be bad for you?

Your probably talking about herbicides or fungicides. If your handling insecticides you should be wearing safety equipment. A good part of Western Canada doesn't have to worry too much about insecticides. Sure there are insecticides on some seed treatments, to control flea beetles in canola for instance. Also some insecticides may need to be applied in crop for grass hoppers in certain years, or diamond back moths in Canola, or wheat midge. It is still a drop in the bucket compared to the amount of insecticides being applied to fruit and vegetable crops in warmer climates.

Personally I'm not worried at all about consuming commercially produced food that has been protected with chemicals. If the pesticides are being used properly there should be no danger to the consumer. The overwhelming majority of farmers are not going to use any more pesticides than they absolutely have to. Those chemicals are not cheap and the more a farmer sprays the more it is going to affect his bottom line. In fact a lot of farmers cut application rates to try and save money when they can.

The only time I have come across a farmer using way to much chemical was a Hutterite colony using a granular insecticide on potatoes. I can't remember the product, the active ingredient or the insect that they were targeting. I just remember that they were applying 5 o 6 times more insecticide than the label recommended. Since that day I will never buy potatoes or any other vegetables from the Hutterites at a farmers market.

[Devils'Advocate]

Originally Posted by mykalberta

Its hard to believe so many people buy organic. Yet eat bread, use cooking oil. All those are sprayed with chemicals.

I don't think it is total avoidance of all chemicals, but rather reduction of chemicals. And personally, though this isn't true for most people that eat organic foods, I don't give a about eating the chemicals. It's rather all the run-off and the environmental impacts.
http://environment.gov.ab.ca/info/library/7715.pdf

As for Penn and Teller, their unique and particularly ripe brand of bull should be taken with a pillar of salt.

[mykalberta]

Unless it goes through the ground water I cant see how alot of pesticides get into rivers. At least where I grew up, there were no crop lands adjacent tor rives. That was all reserved for prime cattle land. That is what I would worry about vis a vi water quality. And with the amount of spray that is actually applied, I cant see alot of that getting into the ground water - its not like crops are soaked, if anything for costs they are under sprayed and most farmers will take a hit on yield to save money on spray - although alot of that has to do with crop insurance not covering the costs of spraying.

I suppose with irrigation in Southern Alberta its more of an issue.

[burn_baby_burn]

Originally Posted by kermitology

With the introduction of GM wheat the yields are much higher, but along with that, so is the amount of gluten in wheat. There is a startling increase in the number of cases of celiac disease in the last 50 years, and while I don't have proof, I'd bet dollars to dimes that it's linked to the increase in gluten from higher yields of GM wheat.

So GM CAN be bad for you.

Besides, we should view it as a population control measure. There are too many people on the Earth to be sustainable.

I didn't realize any GM Wheat was being marketed in Canada yet? What variety is it?

[burn_baby_burn]

Originally Posted by Devils'Advocate

I don't think it is total avoidance of all chemicals, but rather reduction of chemicals. And personally, though this isn't true for most people that eat organic foods, I don't give a about eating the chemicals. It's rather all the run-off and the environmental impacts.
http://environment.gov.ab.ca/info/library/7715.pdf

As for Penn and Teller, their unique and particularly ripe brand of bull should be taken with a pillar of salt.

I think intensive livestock operations have a much larger impact on water quality than pesticides in Alberta.

[Shazam]

Originally Posted by kermitology

With the introduction of GM wheat the yields are much higher, but along with that, so is the amount of gluten in wheat. There is a startling increase in the number of cases of celiac disease in the last 50 years, and while I don't have proof, I'd bet dollars to dimes that it's linked to the increase in gluten from higher yields of GM wheat.

Uh... What? Gluten is formed when gliadin and glutenin join together in the presence of water (kneading speeds up the process).

Don't want gluten? Don't leaven your bread, and don't knead.

[Buff]

Wouldn't it be funny if they found out that organic foods is the new margarine?