Henry Louis Gates Arrested in his own home

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Igottago

Exactly. Once the definite proof was provided, there was no need for anything else. The cop was there to investigate a break in...it wasn't a break in, case closed. He's not there to investigate Gates' personality or tendency to be a jerk. The cop probably just didn't like the way he was being talked to. Not enough of a reason to arrest the guy.

Course it is. The majority of 'disorderly conduct' arrests are based around people not respecting the authority of the cops.

Good or bad, thats the way it is.

[Rerun]

Originally Posted by nik-

Again I'd be a prick too. Once ID is shown that's where the interaction should end, period. It's been proven that its his home, and the cops have no reason to be there, they should leave.

I'm not going to get into whether it's racism or not because we can't successfully confirm what the thoughts of either side was. If Gates felt it was as a result of racial profiling, that's his choice. Regardless, the cops should be gone as soon as there was no reason for them to be there.

I get the impression that the cops would have liked to be out of there too... but Gates just wouldn't let the matter drop. He was bound and determined to play the race card and make sure the whole neighborhood heard about it.

He wanted to prove a point... and honestly I think he was glad he was arrested because he now gets to strut his stuff on the world stage.

[jolinar of malkshor]

Originally Posted by nik-

Again I'd be a prick too. Once ID is shown that's where the interaction should end, period. It's been proven that its his home, and the cops have no reason to be there, they should leave.

Again, like Azure said, maybe he only showed his school ID. That is not sufficient in most cases.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Azure

I would probably be annoyed too, but I would be grateful that someone reported the a suspected B&E, and I would also understand that the cops are just trying to do their jobs.

Their ass is on the line, not Gates'. So, if they don't feel satisfied with the ID, or the proof that Gates lived there they had every right to MAKE SURE that he actually did.

Once they are satisfied, they should leave.

Remember, if the cops don't follow up properly, and someone presented fake ID(like Harvard ID)....to prove that they lived there, and the next day the owner came home and reported that all his crap got stolen, who is going to get fired?

I can't disagree with this post because it's basically 3 paragraphs of saying the cops should do their jobs.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Rerun

He wanted to prove a point... and honestly I think he was glad he was arrested because he now gets to strut his stuff on the world stage.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by nik-

I can't disagree with this post because it's basically 3 paragraphs of saying the cops should do their jobs.

Which is exactly why its so hard to judge the cops here.

All we know for SURE is that Gates played the race card. He said it himself.

Was that before he presented the ID? After? When? Did he refuse to present his ID because he was up on the 'this is racist' pedestal? How do you deal with someone that is screaming 'racism'....when all you did is ask for proper ID?

[Rerun]

^^^ Don't give me that NIK. The guy loves to show people what a big shot he is (thats why he brought up the fact that he is a Harvard Professor), and he isn't shy about having his name in the papers.

Why, I wouldn't be surprised if in the near future he runs for public office.

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by Azure

Course it is. The majority of 'disorderly conduct' arrests are based around people not respecting the authority of the cops.

Good or bad, thats the way it is.

Garbage. That should not be the way it is. Whats to stop a cop from arresting anyone because they simply don't like them?

In this case, clear cut..the guy is at home, he is being accosted by the cops at his own house. He is not being disorderly in public. He provided evidence he lived there.

"While I was led to believe that Gates was lawfully in the residence, I was quite surprised and confused with the behavior he exhibited toward me," Crowley said, according to the report.

So basically the cop didn't like him. Did Gates hit him? Nope. Did he threaten him? Doesnt seem like it.

Not liking someone's attitude does not justify an arrest.

[Cowperson]

Originally Posted by Azure

Controversy that he helped create by getting involved.

I'm not going to argue about this.....to me, Obama is using this incident as a pedestal to preach to the world that racism is still an issue in the US, and that is wrong. Why? Even if racism is still a problem(it is)....that doesn't mean that this incident was racially motivated. Secondly, what if tomorrow evidence comes out and proves Gates was acting like a prick by playing the racist card. Does that mean Obama will call his buddy Gates 'stupid' for HIS actions? Of course not. He'll just ignore the issue.

Pretty stupid to use it as a talking point for racial problems when you don't even know all the facts. And pretty stupid to call the cops 'stupid' when you don't even know what happened.

Obama's odd argument could be interpreted as racist overkill in itself even . . . . .

Gates apparent immediate launch into a tirade about race could also indicate racist attitudes of his own.

By that I mean, not all racists are white, something that seems to be frequently forgotten.

In any event, saying an officer who gave mouth-to-mouth resuscitation to a dying Reggie Lewis - and the mother of Lewis defends him in the newspaper today - is a racist makes Gates look a little idiotic.

Here's the human thing . . . . .none of us would like to be challenged by a police officer while standing in our own home. Some of us would handle it reasonably. Some of us would seeth but let the officer get on with his business. Some of us would get upset and lash out.

That would happen regardless of the black or white thing. Those would all be the common human reactions.

Gates needs to admit he's human. Obama needs to admit it's possible for a black man to have a human reaction to an unpleasant circumstance.

Cowperson

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Rerun

^^^ Don't give me that NIK. The guy loves to show people what a big shot he is (thats why he brought up the fact that he is a Harvard Professor), and he isn't shy about having his name in the papers.

Why, I wouldn't be surprised if in the near future he runs for public office.

LOL

You don't even know this man and you most likely hadn't even heard of him before this incident. Yet you seem so sure what his personality is.

How embarrassing.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Igottago

Garbage. That should not be the way it is. Whats to stop a cop from arresting anyone because they simply don't like them?

The courts.

In this case, clear cut..the guy is at home, he is being accosted by the cops at his own house. He is not being disorderly in public. He provided evidence he lived there.

He is being disorderly, or he can be charged with disorderly conduct if he's screaming and yelling 'racism' to the cops.

"While I was led to believe that Gates was lawfully in the residence, I was quite surprised and confused with the behavior he exhibited toward me," Crowley said, according to the report.

So basically the cop didn't like him. Did Gates hit him? Nope. Did he threaten him? Doesnt seem like it.

Not liking someone's attitude does not justify an arrest.

Uh, no. According to that quote, the officer was willing to accept that Gates did indeed live there, but that he still wanted to be a prick about the cops coming to check in on him.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by jolinar of malkshor

Again, like Azure said, maybe he only showed his school ID. That is not sufficient in most cases.

I'll have to check, but I'm pretty sure I read that this is a Harvard owned house, so Harvard ID was likely completely appropriate. His actual ID may not have had this address on it, I know when I've rented places at school my ID has retained my permanent address.

[Rerun]

Originally Posted by Igottago

Garbage. That should not be the way it is. Whats to stop a cop from arresting anyone because they simply don't like them?

In this case, clear cut..the guy is at home, he is being accosted by the cops at his own house. He is not being disorderly in public. He provided evidence he lived there.

He wasn't accosted by the cops. You are clearly exagerating.

Originally Posted by Igottago

"While I was led to believe that Gates was lawfully in the residence, I was quite surprised and confused with the behavior he exhibited toward me," Crowley said, according to the report.

So basically the cop didn't like him. Did Gates hit him? Nope. Did he threaten him? Doesnt seem like it.

Not liking someone's attitude does not justify an arrest.

Where do you get that from? You are obviously twisting the cops words into something he didn't say.

As for Gates threatening the cop... when Gate's said: "You don't know who you're messing with".... is that not a threat?

[valo403]

Originally Posted by Rerun

^^^ Don't give me that NIK. The guy loves to show people what a big shot he is (thats why he brought up the fact that he is a Harvard Professor), and he isn't shy about having his name in the papers.

Why, I wouldn't be surprised if in the near future he runs for public office.

Hilarious. You've never even heard the guys name before but now you're well acquainted with his personality. That's quite the talent.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by valo403

I'll have to check, but I'm pretty sure I read that this is a Harvard owned house, so Harvard ID was likely completely appropriate. His actual ID may not have had this address on it, I know when I've rented places at school my ID has retained my permanent address.

How is Harvard ID appropriate when you would need a Harvard computer to access the information?

Either way....according to what the cop said, he was 'led to believe' that Gates did indeed live there, so maybe the Harvard ID was sufficient. Or maybe he did see a driver's license.

But, Gates was still being a prick about it all. That is why he got arrested.

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by Azure

Uh, no. According to that quote, the officer was willing to accept that Gates did indeed live there, but that he still wanted to be a prick about the cops coming to check in on him.

So he was arrested for being a prick. If that's a legitimate reason to arrest someone, I'm gonna call the cops right now, there's a lot of people I know who'd I'd love to see hauled of to jail for a day. It may be a monumental waste of resources, but hey, the guy's a prick.

[Byrns]

How can it be racial profiling when a complaint call was placed into 911. It's not like they chose the house at random and arrested him.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Igottago

So he was arrested for being a prick. If that's a legitimate reason to arrest someone, I'm gonna call the cops right now, there's a lot of people I know who'd I'd love to see hauled of to jail for a day. It may be a monumental waste of resources, but hey, the guy's a prick.

You don't have to be a prick about it.

The 'disorderly conduct' is a vague term and can apply to a whole slew of different situations.

Obviously the cops felt that by the way Gates responded, he was being disorderly. So they arrested him. IF, he was using the racist card and was yelling and screaming at the officers, they had due cause to arrest him.

As much as we may not like it when a cop comes to our house to investigate a B&E, it doesn't mean we should be acting like idiots when all they're trying to do is their job.

[Iowa_Flames_Fan]

So having now read the actual police report, I can see why charges were dropped.

Here's what happened, by the police officer's own admission.
1. He asked Gates to step outside. Gates refused, as is his right when he is residing peacefully within his own home.
2. He asked Gates for ID. Gates complied.
3. The police officer, without establishing probably cause, entered a private residence without permission and without identifying himself and showing proper identification first.
4. Gates never left his own porch.
5. Gates' only crime was to call the guy a racist. Which, given that the guy immediately assumed Gates was a criminal upon seeing him inside the house, is at least understandable even if you don't feel that it's true.

If it were me, I'd walk away. You're a cop--you don't get to arrest someone because he called you a nasty name. It's understandable to be upset when someone calls you a name you don't like. It's not understandable to then abuse your power and arrest him when he's committed no crime and you know that he's committed no crime.

My prediction: Crowley will be suspended without pay, and possibly fired. Gates will sue and be awarded damages. Life in Cambridge will continue as normal, complete with outdoor chess games in Harvard Square and sushi on every street corner.

[Iowa_Flames_Fan]

Originally Posted by Azure

You don't have to be a prick about it.

The 'disorderly conduct' is a vague term and can apply to a whole slew of different situations.

Obviously the cops felt that by the way Gates responded, he was being disorderly. So they arrested him. IF, he was using the racist card and was yelling and screaming at the officers, they had due cause to arrest him.

As much as we may not like it when a cop comes to our house to investigate a B&E, it doesn't mean we should be acting like idiots when all they're trying to do is their job.

Come on, Azure. You don't really believe that yelling at a cop from your own porch is a crime, do you? We don't live in a police state.