MJMDT (Michael Jackson Memorial Day Thread)

[Pagal4321]

Originally Posted by Rerun

Looks like you are the one who can't keep your spoon out of the soup.

Take your Michael love and beat it.

Nah, I'll stick around to see you make a bigger fool of yourself, you are doing a mighty fine job.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by Devils'Advocate

What costs are we talking here? If you are talking about the stage setup and garbage clean-up, that's all covered by AEG.

The $4M was for increased police presence and other public servants providing the duties that they are supposed to provide. And that is being covered by the city of Los Angeles. However, they are asking for donations... from the Jackson family, from AEG, from other corporate sponsors AND the public. They are hoping that donations cover the $4M the same way that the Lakers celebration was covered by donations.

However, some economists say that the city shouldn't be asking for donations given that (a) the public servants including police officers were providing the service that they are hired by the public to do... is the public supposed to pay twice? and (b) the city is going to get its money back. There were so many people drawn into L.A. by the event, all renting hotel rooms, renting cars, going to restaurants... and according to the L.A. Economic Development Corp., the increased tax revenues from the event balance out the costs.

Exactly, people are very quick to look at one side of the ledger without considering the other. Very few, if any, people travelled to LA for the Lakers parade, any gains to the city would have been small. On this occasion LA has seen many people make a trip for the purpose of the funeral, and in a city that has such a large tourism base to begin with all of the requisite taxes and fees are in place to suck a good deal of money out of the visitors based on their presence alone.

[North East Goon]

Originally Posted by Devils'Advocate

What costs are we talking here? If you are talking about the stage setup and garbage clean-up, that's all covered by AEG.

The $4M was for increased police presence and other public servants providing the duties that they are supposed to provide. And that is being covered by the city of Los Angeles. However, they are asking for donations... from the Jackson family, from AEG, from other corporate sponsors AND the public. They are hoping that donations cover the $4M the same way that the Lakers celebration was covered by donations.

However, some economists say that the city shouldn't be asking for donations given that (a) the public servants including police officers were providing the service that they are hired by the public to do... is the public supposed to pay twice? and (b) the city is going to get its money back. There were so many people drawn into L.A. by the event, all renting hotel rooms, renting cars, going to restaurants... and according to the L.A. Economic Development Corp., the increased tax revenues from the event balance out the costs.

Excellent point from all the media alone that came into LA, they must have made there money back. I stand corrected.

[Frequitude]

Originally Posted by Rerun

How many MJ supporters here would let their child sleep over in Michael's bed?

What a weird question. Who the hell would let their child sleep in any stranger's bed?!?

[Rerun]

Originally Posted by Frequitude

What a weird question. Who the hell would let their child sleep in any stranger's bed?!?

Thats what I figure too... and even if you knew the person, how many people would let there child sleep in the same bed as a grown man (and a weird grown man at that)

But apparently there are so many people on here filled with "Michael Love" that they would allow him to do just about anything to their child. Weird.

The guy was a freak, a homosexual pedifile, a drug addict, and a nutcase.

But apparently because he wrote a snappy jingle or two, he gets cut a lot of slack and people worship the ground he walked on. Go figure.

[metallicat]

Except it was taxpayers paying for the funeral initially, how do they benefit from more hotel rooms being rented, or restaurants being eaten at? The balance sheet might be kosher, but I don't think things really even out for those paying the tab.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by oilers_fan

Except it was taxpayers paying for the funeral initially, how do they benefit from more hotel rooms being rented, or restaurants being eaten at? The balance sheet might be kosher, but I don't think things really even out for those paying the tab.

Taxpayers paying for it? Ya, through government expenditures out of government coffers, the same government coffers into which the hotel taxes are deposited. I don't know the numbers for the taxes in the area, but it's not really that hard to figure out that the money going out was at least partially offset by money coming in.

[Rerun]

I think Michael should have had a state funeral where they put his body on a train in an open casket and take him all across America to every little town and city that has a railway station, so all his adoring fans would have a chance to see him one last time. Why, they could have musicians, and dancers, and singers all singing and dancing to Michael's songs at every whistle stop. It would be a great show. The country would make millions from all the people wanting to see the greatest entertainer (if not the greatest human being) in the world. I'm sure it would be something Michael would want. One last big hurrah.

[alltherage]

After having my interest in the whole Child Abuse scandal re-kindled from all this MJ hub-bub, I think I might have changed my mind about him being a pedo. I tried to read the least biased articles about it.. (impossible I know, but wikipedia seems to be pretty unbiased) and it really sounds like he was a victim of extortion, media money grubbers, etc more so than that he was a pedophile. Is it weird and crossing the line to have kids sleep over at your house? Yes. Unacceptable? Yes. But do I think he did these disgusting, irreprehensible acts? I don't think so... in everything I've read there are so many holes and so many pay days for people who shared their "stories"... most of which were conflicting or chronologically flawed. Add to that, the fact that there are many level-headed friends and so many charitable acts done by MJ, and it just doesn't add up. I don't know for sure- noone will, but I think my attitude has changed about this guy in the last few days.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by alltherage

After having my interest in the whole Child Abuse scandal re-kindled from all this MJ hub-bub, I think I might have changed my mind about him being a pedo. I tried to read the least biased articles about it.. (impossible I know, but wikipedia seems to be pretty unbiased) and it really sounds like he was a victim of extortion, media money grubbers, etc more so than that he was a pedophile. Is it weird and crossing the line to have kids sleep over at your house? Yes. Unacceptable? Yes. But do I think he did these disgusting, irreprehensible acts? I don't think so... in everything I've read there are so many holes and so many pay days for people who shared their "stories"... most of which were conflicting or chronologically flawed. Add to that, the fact that there are many level-headed friends and so many charitable acts done by MJ, and it just doesn't add up. I don't know for sure- noone will, but I think my attitude has changed about this guy in the last few days.

I'm the opposite. I used to think he was a victim by people who wanted to get rich, but after reading more about, I think he did molest those kids.

[CMPunk]

Originally Posted by Rerun;1926873[COLOR=Lime

]I think Michael should have had a state funeral where they put his body on a train in an open casket and take him all across America to every little town and city that has a railway station, so all his adoring fans would have a chance to see him one last time. Why, they could have musicians, and dancers, and singers all singing and dancing to Michael's songs at every whistle stop. It would be a great show. The country would make millions from all the people wanting to see the greatest entertainer (if not the greatest human being) in the world. I'm sure it would be something Michael would want. One last big hurrah[/color].

God I hope thats sarcasim

[Dion]

Originally Posted by alltherage

After having my interest in the whole Child Abuse scandal re-kindled from all this MJ hub-bub, I think I might have changed my mind about him being a pedo. I tried to read the least biased articles about it.. (impossible I know, but wikipedia seems to be pretty unbiased) and it really sounds like he was a victim of extortion, media money grubbers, etc more so than that he was a pedophile. Is it weird and crossing the line to have kids sleep over at your house? Yes. Unacceptable? Yes. But do I think he did these disgusting, irreprehensible acts? I don't think so... in everything I've read there are so many holes and so many pay days for people who shared their "stories"... most of which were conflicting or chronologically flawed. Add to that, the fact that there are many level-headed friends and so many charitable acts done by MJ, and it just doesn't add up. I don't know for sure- noone will, but I think my attitude has changed about this guy in the last few days.

Ask yourself why he paid out millions to those who accused him. I find it odd that his lawyers always urged him to settle. Like, why pay out money if you've done nothing wrong?

[Inferno]

Originally Posted by Dion

Ask yourself why he paid out millions to those who accused him. I find it odd that his lawyers always urged him to settle. Like, why pay out money if you've done nothing wrong?

You ever think maybe the guy was tired of all the stress he was being put under and just wanted it to end so he could move on and had the money to come to a settlement so he did? Coming to a settlement doesnt mean he was admitting he was guilty.

[CMPunk]

Originally Posted by Inferno

You ever think maybe the guy was tired of all the stress he was being put under and just wanted it to end so he could move on and had the money to come to a settlement so he did? Coming to a settlement doesnt mean he was admitting he was guilty.

I dunno, if I'm accused of something like child molestation, I'd rather have my name cleared instead of paying the people off to make it go away, but maybe I'm just different

[Dion]

Originally Posted by Inferno

You ever think maybe the guy was tired of all the stress he was being put under and just wanted it to end so he could move on and had the money to come to a settlement so he did? Coming to a settlement doesnt mean he was admitting he was guilty.

Where there's smoke there's fire. If i'm being accused of molesting children i'm sure as hell not going to give my accuser any money. All that payout did was cause more grief for MJ as the child molestation issue never went away. Instead it raised further doubts as to his innocence.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by CMPunk

I dunno, if I'm accused of something like child molestation, I'd rather have my name cleared instead of paying the people off to make it go away, but maybe I'm just different

Exactly.

It's not like paying the hush money and NOT clearing his name helped give him a less stressful life. If anything, to have those allegations hanging over him would have assured that the stress was always there.

Or what Dion said just before me... ^^^

[North East Goon]

Whether he did it or not, he put himself at risk by having kids by his side so much.

[Machiavelli]

It didn't help him, but this isn't the most sound of mind individual we're talking about.

You probably don't have boatloads of money like MJ had at the time. Maybe he thought throwing cash at his accusers would make them go away.

[Hack&Lube]

Michael Jackson was a very frail and weak childish individual, susceptible to bad influences and a poor judge of character in his professional contacts (agents, lawyers, doctors, etc.). They all latched onto him for easy money giving lazy, poor work and bad advice that did him harm over and over again in his adult life.

His doctors and lawyers got him to settle the first case (while still retaining their exhorbitant fees) because it was the easiest way out for him and they didn't think he could mentally survive the long trial. He won his second trial which looks like it did take a toll on him and probably exacerbated the prescription drug problems that killed him in the end.

I can't say either way what the truth about Michael Jackson is. There are so many stories out there by so-called biographers or people with some kind of inside-information and most of it conflicts with other stories. Most of them probably have an element to truth about it but a lot of it is false and the press has constantly published stories about Jackson before realizing they were being decieved. Even after his death, the mainstream press all published stories about how his maid had to pump his stomach many times because of prescription drugs, how he was gay, etc. A few days later the maid comes out to say that she doesn't even know how to pump a stomach and his security guards come out and say that he had a girlfriend. These stories might be true or not, but you can see how all the stories conflict and have been like that his entire life. Most of it is hearsay.

Michael Jackson was raised as a kid through abuse and turned into a workaholic by the age of 8 where he was forced to perform and be perfect on stage all the time. He definetely was a very disturbed person with a childish mind at heart. I can't say either way if he crossed any lines but he definetely loved the company of other children and wanted to make them happy. He did sleep in the same bed as them but I tend to think that in his childish mind, they were platonic sleep-overs. When I look at Neverland, I don't see a shady stranger trying to give out (millions of dollars) worth of candy to kids to get them into his van...I see a disturbed child-minded adult trying to recreate a childhood he think he missed out on trying to spend money making other kids happy who could be the friends he didn't have.

I look at his own children (as bizarre the situation is) and how they are coming out more into the limelight now and what they say about their dad it just doesn't look to me like he was the kind of person that takes that kind of advantage of them or abuses them.

[alltherage]

Originally Posted by Dion

Ask yourself why he paid out millions to those who accused him. I find it odd that his lawyers always urged him to settle. Like, why pay out money if you've done nothing wrong?

From what I've read, his health deteriorated to a dangerous level, and the guy just wanted it over with. Would I pay someone out? I don't think so... but this was so disgusting a malicious, so detrimental to his career and his spirit, so embarassing, that he just wanted it to stop. Have you read Evan Chandler's recorded phone call?

Originally Posted by Evan Chandler (Wikipedia)

There was no reason why he [Jackson] had to stop calling me...I picked the nastiest son of a bitch I could find [Evan Chandler's lawyer, Barry Rothman], all he wants to do is get this out in the public as fast as he can, as big as he can and humiliate as many people as he can. He's nasty, he's mean, he's smart and he's hungry for publicity. Everything's going to a certain plan that isn't just mine. Once I make that phone call, this guy is going to destroy everybody in sight in any devious, nasty, cruel way that he can do it. I've given him full authority to do that. Jackson is an evil guy, he is worse than that and I have the evidence to prove it. If I go through with this, I win big-time. There's no way I lose. I will get everything I want and they will be destroyed forever...Michael's career will be over.

Like, that's pretty damning in my opinion along with all the other murky crap.