Michael Jackson suffers cardiac arrest - Dead at the age of 50

[flip]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

What does that have to do with music?

Can you do that while singing?

Plus this thread is about Michael Jackson and I'm pretty sure he's in that video.

[carom]

Originally Posted by transplant99

One of the talking heads on TV said it best earlier....

"he never had a childhood and as such he never learned to be an adult"

Let the psychoanalysis of MJ go on forever. Will we ever get to the bottom of it?

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by flip

Can you do that while singing?

Plus this thread is about Michael Jackson and I'm pretty sure he's in that video.

The context I was referring to is how some people defending the gimmicks that are used to sell pop music to the masses point to things like moonwalking dance moves as a defense... when really, it is the gimmick and is exactly the point I was making. I made comments about Michael Jackson and pop music in general as being shallow and was told to watch the moonwalker video as a counter to that... so I asked; what does that have to do with music?

I think if people say they loved Michael Jackson as an entertainer and performer, then fine. He is probably the most influential entertainer and performer of my generation for sure... but I think his contribution to music is being overstated. I'm not saying it's not there, but just that it's not everything it is promoted as being.

[feartheflames]

People, this man was by all means very sad, he lived a lonely life full of abuse and exploitation. he never stood a chance at normalcy. Surrouneded by people who were money hungry and didnt give him the help and treatment he deserved. He was described as a child in a mans body.

He was beaten and mentally abused since age 5.

As for the child molestation allegation... if your child was raped, would you accept even a cent from his rapist? I doubt it.

This man was NOT proven guilty, if he is ... well then he is with God now, let God deal with it. He has died today, let him have some respect on his dying day, If you have nothing nice today.. please dont say anything at all.

[feartheflames]

There are two things to say about him. He was a musical genius; and he was an abused child. By abuse, I do not mean sexual abuse; I mean he was used brutally and callously for money, and clearly imprisoned by a tyrannical father. He had no real childhood and spent much of his later life struggling to get one. He was spiritually and psychologically raped at a very early age – and never recovered. Watching him change his race, his age, and almost his gender, you saw a tortured soul seeking what the rest of us take for granted: a normal life.
But he had no compass to find one; no real friends to support and advise him; and money and fame imprisoned him in the delusions of narcissism and self-indulgence. Of course, he bears responsibility for his bizarre life. But the damage done to him by his own family and then by all those motivated more by money and power than by faith and love was irreparable in the end. He died a while ago. He remained for so long a walking human shell.
I loved his music. His young voice was almost a miracle, his poise in retrospect eery, his joy, tempered by pain, often unbearably uplifting. He made the greatest music video of all time; and he made some of the greatest records of all time. He was everything our culture worships; and yet he was obviously desperately unhappy, tortured, afraid and alone.
I grieve for him; but I also grieve for the culture that created and destroyed him. That culture is ours’ and it is a lethal and brutal one: with fame and celebrity as its core values, with money as its sole motive, it chewed this child up and spat him out.
I hope he has the peace now he never had in his life. And I pray that such genius will not be so abused again.
18 Comments

from CNN.com

[NuclearFart]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

The context I was referring to is how some people defending the gimmicks that are used to sell pop music to the masses point to things like moonwalking dance moves as a defense... when really, it is the gimmick and is exactly the point I was making. I made comments about Michael Jackson and pop music in general as being shallow and was told to watch the moonwalker video as a counter to that... so I asked; what does that have to do with music?

I think if people say they loved Michael Jackson as an entertainer and performer, then fine. He is probably the most influential entertainer and performer of my generation for sure... but I think his contribution to music is being overstated. I'm not saying it's not there, but just that it's not everything it is promoted as being.

You say this like music and entertainment are mutually exclusive, when in fact they are inextricably linked.

[Smell My Finger]

Thriller has sold triple platinum, quadruple platinum. How about 28 times platinum. MJ's worst cd his last sold 2.5 million. For Michaels standards and his critics it was considered a failure. For any average artists they would love to sell 2.5 million copies in a given year.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by NuclearFart

You say this like music and entertainment are mutually exclusive, when in fact they are inextricably linked.

But not everyone who is a good entertainer is a good musician. Half of what pop stars do is not music, but a means to sell music.

Clearly Micheal Jackson was a good musician. Again, I am only disagreeing with those that think he is the single most influention musician ever. He certainly influenced the way music is sold and marketed more than anyone else though. IMO, his record sales point to that fact more then they point to the quality of the product.

[awildermode]

Originally Posted by Russic

Admit it, when you hear the rap section in "Black or White" all you can see in your mind is Macauly Culkin. Wrecks it for me too.

genuis!

[Teh_Bandwagoner]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

What does that have to do with music?

He's dancing. You dance to music.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Teh_Bandwagoner

He's dancing. You dance to music.

In that case, Kevin Federline is a musical genius as well. He is also a dancer.

[Teh_Bandwagoner]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

In that case, Kevin Federline is a musical genius as well. He is also a dancer.

You made no statement about musical genius. You simply asked what the video had to do with music, of which the response is obvious.

If you wanna talk about musical genius, yes MJ is a musical genius. Kevin Federline is not. To compare the two is pretty ridiculous. MJ had a sense of musicality that very few do, and to be able to translate that into such specific body movements is even more impressive. I can't even begin to understand how much muscle control he had to pop and lock like MJ.

I get that you don't like MJ and maybe you don't like his style of dance or music, but there is a large populace that does. In fact he forged an entire new generation of hip hop/r&b dancers, and to say he's not a genius in that style of music or dance is pretty assinine.

[Smell My Finger]

You could go to any country in the world and not speak that langauge and just say Michael Jackson and that stranger would know who you are talking about.

[flamey_mcflame]

Goodbye Michael. You were an artist, you were an icon and you will always be a legend. But I wouldn't wish your legacy and your tortured life on anyone.

[RougeUnderoos]

Apparently it wasn't a heart attack. Rumor has it that he had a stroke in the children's ward.

[flip]

Originally Posted by Smell My Finger

You could go to any country in the world and not speak that langauge and just say Michael Jackson and that stranger would know who you are talking about.

Or you could just touch a little kid and they'd say Michael Jackson.

No wait maybe that's Catholic Priest.

[Reggie Dunlop]

I will claim unequivocally with complete certainty that the man was, in fact, a notorious serial pedophile and it's not incumbent upon me to prove otherwise. There are jurors in his criminal trials who were hampered for various reasons. It was a gross miscarriage of justice.

Michael Jackson was also a ruthless manipulator. Simply put, you cannot rise to the position at his height of fame without being so. His tears are of the crocodile variety. Many have endured worse childhoods than his. He gains no sympathy.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Teh_Bandwagoner

You made no statement about musical genius. You simply asked what the video had to do with music, of which the response is obvious.

Actually, yes I did. You quoted me out of context. Go back and read the string of posts that lead up to the post you quoted. I questioned his contribution to music and was told to watch him dance... so I watched and asked; "What does that have to do with music"?

[Reggie Dunlop]

Michael Jackson's entire schick was a pale pastiche of innovators like James Brown, Little Richard and Stevie Wonder. Whereas these innovators sought to document the American Black Experience, Jackson instead became (with cunning ruthlessness) the Anti-Black. Gender-neutral too. Pandering to every demographic certainly has its advantages, but as an artistic statement it is suspect.

[flip]

Originally Posted by Reggie Dunlop

Michael Jackson's entire schick was a pale pastiche of innovators like James Brown, Little Richard and Stevie Wonder. Whereas these innovators sought to document the American Black Experience, Jackson instead became (with cunning ruthlessness) the Anti-Black. Gender-neutral too. Pandering to every demographic certainly has its advantages, but as an artistic statement it is suspect.

Reggie I hate to do this to you but:

Principal: Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
Billy Madison: Okay, a simple "wrong" would've done just fine.