Raptors 2009 offseason thread

[octothorp]

Yeah, small upgrade on depth at the #4, but an upgrade nonetheless. This offseason will still be defined by how BC addresses the starting SF and SG positions, and I'm going to reserve judgement until we get a clear picture of how he's going to do that.

[moon]

Originally Posted by I wanna be like Miikka

Of course they need a player better then Evans, most of us are just commenting on this trade specifically. Kapono was trash and Evans at least has some hope of contributing to the Raps next year. I don't think anyone is on their knees praising Colangelo, this was an ok move but it has to followed up by much better moves if the Raptors are going to be a playoff team next season.

And all I am saying is that Kapono is no more trash than Evans. I don't think either is good enough that it should be a shock that there are differing opinions on the quality of return that each team gets.

As I said earlier it is a meh deal, one teams dufus for another teams dufus.

[JohnnyFlame]

Originally Posted by octothorp

Yeah, small upgrade on depth at the #4, but an upgrade nonetheless. This offseason will still be defined by how BC addresses the starting SF and SG positions, and I'm going to reserve judgement until we get a clear picture of how he's going to do that.

Well he has said a lot on subject already. He is bringing back Delfino. probably http://www.nba.com/raptors/video/200...ors/index.html

Who they grab at the nine likely fills the backup spot for SG. SF backup looks to be Printezis as they have been blabbing about that for months. But today on Doug Smith's blog(his info is usually hmmm) he said they have no intention of bringing him over so who knows.

But I think you can clearly see the way BC is going about it. He says they will be busy with moves this offseason. They either get rid of Hump or light a fire under his butt with Evans in the fold. Humpy won't be able to forget why he is put on the floor. Delfino adds a guy who isn't afraid to mix it up either though his Chuckafino personality is scary.

Really the only starting question is Marion? The rest are supporting cast moves if as rumored the Delfino thing is already in the bag. If he ain't staying I'm thinking draft night will see him go in an S & T.

POB being kept around as well. Evans and Hump fighting for minutes leaving Pops as the odd man out.

Right now though the starting lineup in pencil is :

Calderon, Delfino, Marion, Bargs and Bosh.

With a backup of :
?, Tyreke Evans, Printezis, Evans, Hump

So if Marion resigns and Delfino is a sure thing as rumored then it's just that second five that needs work and the draft will fix one spot.

[Gozer]

Originally Posted by moon

And all I am saying is that Kapono is no more trash than Evans. I don't think either is good enough that it should be a shock that there are differing opinions on the quality of return that each team gets.

As I said earlier it is a meh deal, one teams dufus for another teams dufus.

But the role of the dufus is important.

One is an unathletic swing man on a team of jumpshooters
One is a scrappy rebounder / hustle guy on a team of jumpshooters

The role makes it an upgrade, and "freeing up" $5M that was being spent on the wings allows for another upgrade (pending future transactions).
I realize that we didn't actually free $5M, but we have virtually no cap space tied up on wing players, at least until/unless we bring back Delfino.

[OzSome]

I hate to see Kapono go but I think I tend to agree with Colangelo's assessment. They are way too nice last season and Evans might help them change that. I've seen him played once and I saw how he hustled and he was ornery. Not sure if that's just one game but if he plays like that all season we might see some of the player stop pushing CB4 around.

[JohnnyFlame]

Originally Posted by OzSome

I hate to see Kapono go but I think I tend to agree with Colangelo's assessment. They are way too nice last season and Evans might help them change that. I've seen him played once and I saw how he hustled and he was ornery. Not sure if that's just one game but if he plays like that all season we might see some of the player stop pushing CB4 around.

Evans might help them change that? Nevermind that the last six years in a row he has been top 10 in rebounds per minute more important is this guy does not just have a rep for being mean--HE IS. The guy is downright dirty and I've yelled at the screen many a time when he has been abusing Raptor players. Yes he does it all the time. Yes the Raps stand around and watch as one of their players is hammered to the court. They do nothing in return. Guaranteed that won't be happening with him in the lineup. Can't be overemphasized enough but this is one of the nastier players in the league coming to easily the wimpiest team in organized basketball. But no it won't help with Bosh getting pushed around. That's Bosh's problem and hopefully Evan's attitude gives Bosh some inspiration to man up!!!!!!!!!

[bluejays]

Did anyone catch Amare Stoudemire's quote that he was definitely better than Bosh? I think the interviewer asked him straight up, "are you better than Bosh" and his reply more or less, "You should ask him. I'm definitely better than him and he would say it too".

First Shaq with his Rupaul comment, now Amare. Bosh is probably the biggest joke of a star bigman in the league when it comes to respect and being a puss. Didn't Garnett disrespect him too?

[JohnnyFlame]

Originally Posted by fleury

Did anyone catch Amare Stoudemire's quote that he was definitely better than Bosh? I think the interviewer asked him straight up, "are you better than Bosh" and his reply more or less, "You should ask him. I'm definitely better than him and he would say it too".

First Shaq with his Rupaul comment, now Amare. Bosh is probably the biggest joke of a star bigman in the league when it comes to respect and being a puss. Didn't Garnett disrespect him too?

Garnett or Shaq can make the comments. Both have played tough two way basketball. But Stoudemire? Mr. No defense. He should look in the mirror sometime and he will see Bosh's reflection. They are the same player. In both their defenses they have been playing on teams with coach's who don't pay any attention to defense or much else for that matter. Just go out there and run and gun boys. Make them shats. A whole lot of similar players around them who also just float on one end of the floor.

The theory goes if you surround them with tougher, defensive players they will join in and be less of a liability. Plus they bring in a defensive assistant coach in Iavaroni. So we will see if they buy in to playing some defense.

[malcolmk14]

I hate the Raptors, I've never liked Chris Bosh, but he is twice the player Amare Stoudemire is.

[bluejays]

Bumping this thread for the draft. I'm honestly really excited about this draft simply because of the hype surrounding possible deals. By all accounts, it's a terribly weak draft, and apparently there's a lot of talk about possible deals. Hopefully Colangelo can swing a deal to move up and pick in the top 4. We shall see Friday.

[JohnnyFlame]

Originally Posted by fleury

Bumping this thread for the draft. I'm honestly really excited about this draft simply because of the hype surrounding possible deals. By all accounts, it's a terribly weak draft, and apparently there's a lot of talk about possible deals. Hopefully Colangelo can swing a deal to move up and pick in the top 4. We shall see Friday.

I think it's only called a weak draft because of the lack of stars up top. But really after the first few guys there a whole lot of players who will be good NBA players. Just more likely to be role/depth players or projects. Lots of point guards, a few swingmen and then guys like Derozan who could be this freakish small forward or could be a total bust. His athleticism is awesome but good grief his handles, shot and heck a whole lot of his game is just not there or not developed as yet. That's where the gamble comes in. I see BC not moving up as he has nothing to move up with unless some team is looking to just shed salaries or bad contracts. In other words he moves up but has to take an overpaid palooka in the deal to do so.

I think it's more likely they grab another pick. They have 3 million bucks from the Miami deal to throw at some team and there are a number of them in financial trouble. That or they trade down as there really isn't a whole lot of difference after the first group is gone. I wish they could move up because I think Evans is the best fit in the draft for the Raptors. Just what they need and after him Harden. But they won't get either at ninth. BC loves to wheel and deal though so I'm sure hoping he pulls something off.

[Hustle]

Originally Posted by fleury

Bumping this thread for the draft. I'm honestly really excited about this draft simply because of the hype surrounding possible deals. By all accounts, it's a terribly weak draft, and apparently there's a lot of talk about possible deals. Hopefully Colangelo can swing a deal to move up and pick in the top 4. We shall see Friday.

Seems like there's going to be a bunch of movement and heresay in this draft. The only real given is Griffin to the Clippers. Thabeet to the Grizzlies seems really probable too... after that its wide open. The Wildcard really is Rubio.

Hopefully we see something big go down just for entertainment value.... hopefully it's as crazy as that Pistons-Celtics rumor. Talk about a 'interesting' idea.

EDIT: Looks like a deal went down already with Jefferson headed to the Spurs. Hopefully this gets the ball rolling..

[bluejays]

For those don't know the deal Hustle is referring to, it's Allen and Rondo for Hamilton, Prince and Suckey. I don't know the contract situations any any of them, but just futurewise, is it just me or does Detroit get screwed? Prince is a great SF IMO, Hamilton is a winner and Stuckey is an up and comer. Allen can still shoot the lights out, but no way is he on the up and up. Rondo IMO is simply overrated. Odd deal for Detroit at the least.

[flamingreen]

Originally Posted by fleury

For those don't know the deal Hustle is referring to, it's Allen and Rondo for Hamilton, Prince and Suckey. I don't know the contract situations any any of them, but just futurewise, is it just me or does Detroit get screwed? Prince is a great SF IMO, Hamilton is a winner and Stuckey is an up and comer. Allen can still shoot the lights out, but no way is he on the up and up. Rondo IMO is simply overrated. Odd deal for Detroit at the least.

Why wouldn't Detroit do this deal? You're clearing 37 million or so for the summer of 2010 (free-agentpaloza) and can build around Rajon Rondo. That's a great step forward for a team that is completely rudderless atm.

No way is Rajon Rondo overrated. He had three triple doubles in the playoffs and flirted with 4 or 5 more. Not to mention he took a depleted Celtics team farther than they should have gone. He is a better talent going forward than anything Detroit is giving up.

[Gozer]

Originally Posted by flamingreen

Not to mention he took a depleted Celtics team farther than they should have gone. He is a better talent going forward than anything Detroit is giving up.

*eyeroll*

Depleted = defending champs with one remarkable injury? Maybe two if you count Powe. Rondo was exposed as Orlando just ignored him and defyed Rondo to win games by himself. Rondo is Tony Parker before he had a jump shot.

[JohnnyFlame]

Originally Posted by Gozer

*eyeroll*

Depleted = defending champs with one remarkable injury? Maybe two if you count Powe. Rondo was exposed as Orlando just ignored him and defyed Rondo to win games by himself. Rondo is Tony Parker before he had a jump shot.

To me it looks like the Celtics trying to parlay Rondo's playoff performance into some team overpaying for him. Out there trying to make moves not unlike San Antonio who pull off a sweet deal bringing in Jefferson. They just stay good on and on and on--Sheesh. Meanwhile the Raps are doing what? Minny loading up with picks and Washington fills out their rotation and sixth man spot.

I sure hope BC is going to be busy Thursday night or before.

[moon]

The San Antonio deal shows what is wrong with the NBA today where trades are about contracts and not players at all.

Bowen will be cut and most likely return to SA. Oberto could also be cut, leaving Milwaukee with Kurt Thomas who is injured and won't ever play again but is valuable because of his expiring contract.

I guess every team can take advantage of trades like LA, Boston and SA have with the weaker teams but it just seems wrong to me that teams are trading away very good to great players for 5 cents on the dollar and with no thought of making their teams better.

Also that Detroit-Boston deal would be awful for Detroit. Unless they could guarantee to get two of the top FA's in 2010 they are left with a bad team next year and not much promise beyond that. Rondo is a 3rd banana at best and although he puts up some gaudy numbers in some games still makes way too many terrible decisions and bad shots to give up your three best players to get.

[JohnnyFlame]

Originally Posted by moon

The San Antonio deal shows what is wrong with the NBA today where trades are about contracts and not players at all.

Bowen will be cut and most likely return to SA. Oberto could also be cut, leaving Milwaukee with Kurt Thomas who is injured and won't ever play again but is valuable because of his expiring contract.

I guess every team can take advantage of trades like LA, Boston and SA have with the weaker teams but it just seems wrong to me that teams are trading away very good to great players for 5 cents on the dollar and with no thought of making their teams better.

Also that Detroit-Boston deal would be awful for Detroit. Unless they could guarantee to get two of the top FA's in 2010 they are left with a bad team next year and not much promise beyond that. Rondo is a 3rd banana at best and although he puts up some gaudy numbers in some games still makes way too many terrible decisions and bad shots to give up your three best players to get.

Boston let's this leak so they can stir the market for Rondo. Today the rumor is Rondo for Gay and Conley. They will just see if they can make hay out of his playoff performance. I agree the whole business/not trying to win stuff is annoying.

[carom]

Originally Posted by JohnnyFlame

Lots of point guards, a few swingmen and then guys like Derozan who could be this freakish small forward or could be a total bust. His athleticism is awesome but good grief his handles, shot and heck a whole lot of his game is just not there or not developed as yet. That's where the gamble comes in.

Good call.

What else does anyone know about him? How does he fit in next year?

[JohnnyFlame]

Originally Posted by carom

Good call.

What else does anyone know about him? How does he fit in next year?

It's a shoot for the moon(no not Jamario) type of pick. The guy is a phenom but highly unpolished. But instead of taking the most ready for the big leagues(you know ala Rico stinkin Fata) they took a guy who could actually become an allstar. He can play SG/SF and will be backing up Delfino and Marion if they can resign these two.

He really played well as his freshman year came to a close. Pac 10 tourney MVP. Him or Evans were the two guys I wanted as they are both the same kind of guy. They go to the basket and they provide lots of excitement. Of course, both of them could be complete busts because they have holes galore in their games.

He will provide some energy off the bench for them next year and hopefully a few years down the road turns out to be a stellar pick. Cross your fingers and every other appendage as well.