5 killed on Macleod trail crash - Update: GUILTY!

[fredr123]

Originally Posted by Vulcan

As far as I know, unless you can get a lowering of the charge there is no longer any benefit to pleading guilty as far as sentencing goes. So defendants are going to court and pleading not guilty as a guilty plea gets them nothing.

An early guilty plea is a factor the judge will consider in sentencing.

There is also the prospect that in return for a guilty plea the Crown will join you in sentencing submissions. In other words, the Crown might agree to recommend with defence counsel a sentence within a certain range in return for the defendant pleading guilty and avoiding a trial. The judge is not bound by any joint sentencing submission but a reasonable sentence proposed by both counsel is something that the judge will have difficulty ignoring.

[Madman]

Originally Posted by Bagor

Why so long?

That's what she said.

[ken0042]

Originally Posted by Bagor

Why so long?

The verdict will be decided by judge alone. (Defendant's choice.) Apparently the judge wants time to go over each and every piece of evidence again. I say good- make sure that the right choice is made.

As for Der and "selling his soul"- I disagree. The worse the crime, the more I want the defendant to have proper representation. This crime speaks for itself; so let's make sure this defendant has no grounds for appeal based on inadequate counsel.

[CGYTransplant]

Originally Posted by Azure

Meaning what?

That nobody should defend the accused? Round 'em up, hang them from a tree without proving them guilty?

So much for 'innocent until proven guilty.'

But, Tschetter IS guilty. He was driving the truck that slammed into the car, and he killed 5 people. He has never denied that he was the driver, and every witness on the scene saw him get out of the truck, in which he was the sole occupant. So, that's not even in question.

The question is, HOW guilty is he?

[Azure]

Originally Posted by CGYTransplant

But, Tschetter IS guilty. He was driving the truck that slammed into the car, and he killed 5 people. He has never denied that he was the driver, and every witness on the scene saw him get out of the truck, in which he was the sole occupant. So, that's not even in question.

The question is, HOW guilty is he?

I think even Der would agree that his client is guilty.

He just wants the best possible outcome for Tschetter.

[4X4]

From what I understand, Der is arguing against the manslaughter charges because he's also been charged with criminal negligence causing death. Theoretically redundant, and precedent setting if found guilty of both.

edit, and after posting I decided to go back ans see if it was already said... Indeed, fred already said it...

[VladtheImpaler]

Originally Posted by Azure

I think even Der would agree that his client is guilty.

He just wants the best possible outcome for Tschetter.

He is guilty of something, the real legal issue is what... besides being an idiot that is.

[Ford Prefect]

Originally Posted by fotze

I've wondered if it is as frustrating for lawyers to argue about legal stuff with non-lawyers as it would be for a brain surgeon arguing about brain surgery with non-brain surgeons.

Why the hell would you cut into that grey piece on the frontal lobe, what the hell are you thinking, idiot?

What I wonder is if a frustrated brain surgeon has cut into the grey piece of the frontal lobe on defense lawyers.

[fredr123]

Originally Posted by Ford Prefect

What I wonder is if a frustrated brain surgeon has cut into the grey piece of the frontal lobe on defense lawyers.

That part is probably already missing.

[Madman]

Originally Posted by VladtheImpaler

besides being an idiot that is.

That is a rude comment offensive to all idiots - please refrain.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by fotze

I've wondered if it is as frustrating for lawyers to argue about legal stuff with non-lawyers as it would be for a brain surgeon arguing about brain surgery with non-brain surgeons.

Why the hell would you cut into that grey piece on the frontal lobe, what the hell are you thinking, idiot?

If it is anything like trying to talk to non-techy people about their computer issues...

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by fredr123

An early guilty plea is a factor the judge will consider in sentencing.

There is also the prospect that in return for a guilty plea the Crown will join you in sentencing submissions. In other words, the Crown might agree to recommend with defence counsel a sentence within a certain range in return for the defendant pleading guilty and avoiding a trial. The judge is not bound by any joint sentencing submission but a reasonable sentence proposed by both counsel is something that the judge will have difficulty ignoring.

I was told by a crown prosecutor that sentence bargaining was no longer in effect. He explained along the lines of

an offender who exercises their
right to trial cannot be penalised for having done so.

Thinking more on the issue though it may have had only to do with juvenile cases or the case I was following as at that point the crown no longer had any bargaining chips or maybe he was trying to get rid of me.

[jar_e]

Just got the email...Tschetter has been found guilty of manslaughter and criminal negligence.

[KTrain]

Here's the CBC story about it: http://www.cbc.ca/canada/calgary/sto...tschetter.html

[Dion]

Originally Posted by jar_e

Just got the email...Tschetter has been found guilty of manslaughter and criminal negligence.

How many years did he get?

[fredr123]

According to the CBC article:

Daniel Tschetter, 51, was convicted Thursday afternoon of five counts of criminal negligence causing death in the deadly crash in December 2007. Provincial court Judge Bruce Fraser has not yet ruled on the five counts of manslaughter against Tschetter.

Sentencing usually follows at a later date after a conviction is entered when lawyers for both sides have an opportunity to make submissions.

[Dion]

nm

[4X4]

Tschetter, who testified during the trial that he was a recovering alcoholic, said he was in a rush to wash out his truck that day after a cement delivery. He told the court he was distracted by checking on the vehicle's gauges and was frustrated because his water lines were freezing.
After the collision, Tschetter said he reached under his seat and took a drink of what he thought was water from a bottle, before realizing it was vodka.
He testified that he threw the bottle of vodka into the drum of his cement truck, because he didn't know what to do if people saw him with the container. Tschetter explained the vodka bottle was in the truck so he could offer drinks to staff at concrete suppliers to get to the front of long lineups.


Ugh. I know we already beat this to death but it still pisses me off.
Lame excuses followed by bullsh1t.

[Boblobla]

Originally Posted by Dion

Frack!

They better throw the book at this guy!

They wont. I could be wrong but sentences in Canada are served concurrently are they not? Not consecutive like in the States?

[TheyCallMeBruce]

How many years is manslaughter?