'IRA' violence is back

[ok, ok,....I get it]

Originally Posted by flip

I find that pretty offensive. You're the clueless one. Until your family has been forced to flee to another country because of relentless persecution you should shut up.

whatever......you are a fool if you think what these people do should be acknowledged.........have you been there, I know a few people that were there during the height of the troubles, 1 a squadie, 1 a ulsterman, and 1 a catholic.......

[flip]

Originally Posted by Jagger

Not *my* people actually. You could include a large number of Canadians in there too then with a blanket statement like that. If you had friends blown up by these terrorists perhaps you wouldn't be so flippant.

Please. They are your people. You are British and they are British people. Let's not argue over the semantics of "your". I obviously don't mean they belong to you and that you have anything to do with it.

[flip]

Originally Posted by ok, ok,....I get it

whatever......you are a fool if you think what these people do should be acknowledged.........have you been there, I know a few people that were there during the height of the troubles, 1 a squadie, 1 a ulsterman, and 1 a catholic.......

Maybe you should start the thread from the beginning again.

[ok, ok,....I get it]

Originally Posted by flip

I completely agree. No one should have to bury their innocent children because some morons decide to act like a two bit terrorist. That being said the Irish have been burying their dead children, comforting their raped wives etc for about a 1000 years. Now I understand that British rule in N Ireland is no longer oppressive as it once was but that hatred is still there.

I am probably about 5 generations, or more, removed from the violence against my family and it still gets me riled up when this subject comes up.

you need to learn forgivness

[icarus]

Originally Posted by Ford Prefect

I thought this was done by some splinter dissident group which the IRA proper has disassociated itself from and reconfirmed their dedication to the peace process. It's probably a bit overblown to phrase this as a new IRA uprising.

Hence the 'IRA'.

[flip]

Originally Posted by ok, ok,....I get it

you need to learn forgivness

I will, as soon as N Ireland is given back to the Irish.

[Mean Mr. Mustard]

Originally Posted by flip

I find that pretty offensive. You're the clueless one. Until your family has been forced to flee to another country because of relentless persecution you should shut up.

I take it that you personally were forced out of Ireland by the English as a child? My ancestory is Scottish - look at the Battle of Culloden and the impact of that, the English forced people who I am sure I am related to, to go to the colonies and work in the fields with many of them dying. How are the Irish currently being prosecuted by the English? Quite frankly I just don't see it.

[Mean Mr. Mustard]

Originally Posted by flip

I will, as soon as N Ireland is given back to the Irish.

Why? What difference does it make in your life other than of a purely symbolic nature, it has been hundreds of years, maybe it is time to let the grudge go/

[ok, ok,....I get it]

but it's clearly what defines FLIP.....his life long support of the Irish struggles....I am sure he has done many trips to Northern Ireland and donated large amounts of money to show his support........perhaps is he feels so strongly he should join the struggle........

[flip]

Originally Posted by Mean Mr. Mustard

I take it that you personally were forced out of Ireland by the English as a child? My ancestory is Scottish - look at the Battle of Culloden and the impact of that, the English forced people who I am sure I am related to, to go to the colonies and work in the fields with many of them dying. How are the Irish currently being prosecuted by the English? Quite frankly I just don't see it.

Obviously no I wasn't forced out of Ireland, but it is the reason my family is in Canada.

And you are right the Irish aren't currently being prosecuted by the English, but the hatred and resentment remains in a lot of people. Maybe it'll eventually go away and after enough generations people like me will die off and people who don't care will dominate the landscape of this issue. Or maybe it'll always be there like the Palestine/Israel conflict. Bottom line for me is that the British need to just admit they are occupying another countries land and leave. Like has been said though, they have been there so long, with minimal resistance from the Irish (they tried but usually got squashed), that it is unlikely that the British will leave any time soon.

Personally I see it no differently than if the US never left Iraq. Think you'd have some pent up feelings if you were Iraqi and the US was still there in 20 years? 50? 100? Especially if they spent a significant portion of that time raping and pillaging.

[Jagger]

Originally Posted by flip

Please. They are your people. You are British and they are British people. Let's not argue over the semantics of "your". I obviously don't mean they belong to you and that you have anything to do with it.

It's strange for me actually as I have English, Scots, Welsh, AND Irish background in my family. We get around. I dislike the British Empire history too and am certainly not proud of it. However, all bets are off when I see what these pathetic terrorists did to the common folk in Northern Ireland and mainland Britain in recent times. This gets me hot under the collar as I actually *saw* the consequences of their violence and knew personally people directly affected by it.

[Rathji]

Originally Posted by Mean Mr. Mustard

Why? What difference does it make in your life other than of a purely symbolic nature, it has been hundreds of years, maybe it is time to let the grudge go/

If it was that easy then we wouldn't have people killing each other for thousands of years in the Middle East.

[flip]

Originally Posted by ok, ok,....I get it

but it's clearly what defines FLIP.....his life long support of the Irish struggles....I am sure he has done many trips to Northern Ireland and donated large amounts of money to show his support........perhaps is he feels so strongly he should join the struggle........

Hey, like I said, if there was a sign up sheet tomorrow for the Irish war of independence I'd seriously consider it. At this point it is all diplomatic so that was a really stupid post you just made.

[FlamesAddiction]

Has the public ever been polled in Northern Ireland?

If the people of Northern Ireland want British occupation to end, then the British should leave.

Unless the majority wants to be part of Britain, then their presense there serves no other purpose than to continue flexing their colonialist muscles.

[flip]

Originally Posted by Rathji

If it was that easy then we wouldn't have people killing each other for thousands of years in the Middle East.

This is the thing. Time makes some conflicts better and some worse. In this case a lot of people have just let it go, the British have been there so long that Catholics and Protestants have been living side by side for too long to just kick out all British/Protestants.

On the other hand some conflicts get worse with time. It appears that this incident is just a flare up and that the long term conflict will not go the way of Israel/Palestine, but who knows.

[Mean Mr. Mustard]

Originally Posted by Rathji

If it was that easy then we wouldn't have people killing each other for thousands of years in the Middle East.

I agree and the amount of respect that I have for those with blood enemies is pretty minimal - but then again I guess hate fosters hate and so it goes. It just seems a shame that in an information age in which ideas can be communicated and shared with such ease that there even exists a reason in which these ancient feuds can continue to exist.

[ok, ok,....I get it]

Originally Posted by flip

Hey, like I said, if there was a sign up sheet tomorrow for the Irish war of independence I'd seriously consider it. At this point it is all diplomatic so that was a really stupid post you just made.

no no you wouldn't you are no different that the majority of society....you are full of piss and vinegar..until push comes to shove....then in the words of Bullet Tooth Tony this "Should precipitate your balls into shrinking, along with your presence.".........

[flip]

Originally Posted by ok, ok,....I get it

no no you wouldn't you are no different that the majority of society....you are full of piss and vinegar..until push comes to shove....then in the words of Bullet Tooth Tony this "Should precipitate your balls into shrinking, along with your presence.".........

.

Wow. I'm not even going to ask, you can just go ahead and give the "i gave so much for my country" speech now. You're right the rest of us are a bunch of freeloaders and you're a hero. Please stop poisoning this thread the rest of us are trying to have an intelligent discussion.

[Mean Mr. Mustard]

Originally Posted by flip

Hey, like I said, if there was a sign up sheet tomorrow for the Irish war of independence I'd seriously consider it. At this point it is all diplomatic so that was a really stupid post you just made.

I don't think you know the first thing about war or killing. I hope your post about going and fighting the English or whatever is some sort of hyperbole, because if it isn't it really makes me question your decision making abilities.

[ok, ok,....I get it]

Originally Posted by flip

.

Wow. I'm not even going to ask, you can just go ahead and give the "i gave so much for my country" speech now. You're right the rest of us are a bunch of freeloaders and you're a hero. Please stop poisoning this thread the rest of us are trying to have an intelligent discussion.

no not at all, I can see the rest of the thread sees you point as logical and thought out.....my point is you have no idea what you are talking about.....just because you think it makes you seem hard, and "irish" you have these opinions............you are a prime example of.....ah never mind....speaking to you is like pi$$ing in the ocean, I could do it all day and it would not make a difference