America becoming less Christian

[T@T]

"America is a less Christian nation than it was 20 years ago, and Christianity is not losing out to other religions, but primarily to a rejection of religion altogether, a survey published Monday found.
75 percent call themselves Christian, down from 86 percent in 1990"

http://www.cnn.com/2009/LIVING/wayof...ian/index.html

Their still at 75%
Strange a country with that many "so-called" god loving people can be so murderous in nature toward each other.

[Hack&Lube]

Originally Posted by T@T

Their still at 75%
Strange a country with that many "so-called" god loving people can be so murderous in nature toward each other.

16,692 murders in the U.S. in 2005. Out of a population of 295,560,549. That's less than a hundreth of a percent of the population.

[photon]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...=moreheadlines

What i found interesting was:

So many Americans claim no religion at all (15%, up from 8% in 1990), that this category now outranks every other major U.S. religious group except Catholics and Baptists. In a nation that has long been mostly Christian, "the challenge to Christianity … does not come from other religions but from a rejection of all forms of organized religion," the report concludes.

[Thor]

Originally Posted by T@T

"America is a less Christian nation than it was 20 years ago, and Christianity is not losing out to other religions, but primarily to a rejection of religion altogether, a survey published Monday found.
75 percent call themselves Christian, down from 86 percent in 1990"

http://www.cnn.com/2009/LIVING/wayof...ian/index.html

Their still at 75%
Strange a country with that many "so-called" god loving people can be so murderous in nature toward each other.

This survey was really interesting, especially that in all states the one growing movement was non religious.

A graphical map for you to examine the results:

http://www.usatoday.com/news/religio...h-survey_N.htm

The 2001 results:

http://www.usatoday.com/graphics/new...gion/flash.htm

What is interesting:

Minorities : Immigrants, especially from latin and poorer countries are much more likely to be very religious.

Whack-a-mole religion. In America much of the religious America represents people who have switched religious affiliation.

The one interesting thing is that the entire group of Nordic nations in 1-2 generations went from religious, to irreligious in that short period. Can that happen in the US? I don't think so, but with Obama at least we are moving away from theocracy and absolutism to a more moderate and scientific way of thinking.

What is clear is that

the study found that the numbers of Americans with no religion rose in every state.

" No other religious bloc has kept such a pace in every state," the study's authors said.

Americans abandoning religion as number of non-believers climbs to 15 per cent


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...-per-cent.html

Is this a pushback to Bush and the Evangelicals?? Is this a awakening of the atheist movement finally showing results?

Whatever is going on, its clear, the evangelical movement is facing a pushback to their dogma.

Wheter it be Prop 8, presidential candidates denying evolution, anti abortion, anti stem cells, etc..

Its clear that to those outside that spectrum realize, not only will gay marriage be looked upon like we view now womens voter rights, interracial marriage, etc.. But that clearly our future will see these anti-movements as backward and barbaric ideals based on a book that people pick and choose what parts to believe and agree with.

[Temporary_User]

Originally Posted by T@T

Strange a country with that many "so-called" god loving people can be so murderous in nature toward each other.

Now I have never read the christian bible myself, but didn't the whole religion start because of murder?
I mean the Jewish people murdered Jesus, and it was Jesus' father who sent Jesus to go die (Wouldn't that be looked on as parallel to hiring a hitman in today's terms?

[Thor]

Originally Posted by Hack&Lube

16,692 murders in the U.S. in 2005. Out of a population of 295,560,549. That's less than a hundreth of a percent of the population.

Not often I'd suggest apologetic response to atheism, but when a great video is made, it deserves its worthy praise:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdVucvo-kDU

Btw, correction on the video:

It has been brought to my attention that Marlon Brando, Mark Twain, and Susan B. Anthony are not atheists. I looked into it, and my original sources were wrong. Sorry.

I love how this guy could admit errors in his video, if he was fighting for the religious he'd deny it to his grave.

[T@T]

Originally Posted by Hack&Lube

16,692 murders in the U.S. in 2005. Out of a population of 295,560,549. That's less than a hundreth of a percent of the population.

Your kidding right? You think thats a small percentage?.

That percentage is over 3 times as much as Canada and would be much worst if their freakin hand guns were not being shipped here.

How many murders did we have in Calgary last year? I don't even know 25-30? but if Calgary was Washington, D.C we would have had about 700 murders last year....hows that for perspective?

Americans are funny, go to church and praise the almighty at noon and shoot someone in the head at midnight.

[Phanuthier]

I think Mardi Gras should have more of a Christian angle to promote family values

[Hack&Lube]

Originally Posted by Temporary_User

Now I have never read the christian bible myself, but didn't the whole religion start because of murder?
I mean the Jewish people murdered Jesus, and it was Jesus' father who sent Jesus to go die (Wouldn't that be looked on as parallel to hiring a hitman in today's terms?

That's a terribly incorrect view of the thing but it's true that much of the Old Testatment was basically God commanding his people to slaughter every last man woman and child of various city states...It was a product of it's times and that was a very brutal era of human history (which has mostly been brutal).

[Thor]

Originally Posted by Hack&Lube

16,692 murders in the U.S. in 2005. Out of a population of 295,560,549. That's less than a hundreth of a percent of the population.

The United States has the highest incarceration rate in the world at 737 persons imprisoned per 100,000 (as of 2005).[18] A report released Feb. 28, 2008 indicates that in the United States more than 1 in 100 adults is now confined in an American jail or prison.[9] The United States has 5% of the world's population and 25% of the world's incarcerated population.[6]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prisons..._United_States

American prisoners, biased towards minorities, biased towards the poor, biased towards mostly religious Americans.

America is the country that is intolerant on drugs, intolerant and aggressive for even petty crimes (unusually long prison terms) and this is all in a overwhelmingly christian nation. Where did forgiveness and love for all mankind go to?

[photon]

I found this one even more interesting!

Overall, the current research revealed that only 9% of all American adults have a biblical worldview. Among the sixty subgroups of respondents that the survey explored was one defined by those who said they have made a personal to commitment to Jesus Christ that is important in their life today and that they are certain that they will go to Heaven after they die only because they confessed their sins and accepted Christ as their savior. Labeled “born again Christians,” the study discovered that they were twice as likely as the average adult to possess a biblical worldview. However, that meant that even among born again Christians, less than one out of every five (19%) had such an outlook on life.

http://www.barna.org/barna-update/ar...-past-13-years

This one surprises me.

[J pold]

Praise the Lord!

[Thor]

Originally Posted by photon

I found this one even more interesting!

http://www.barna.org/barna-update/ar...-past-13-years

This one surprises me.

That is VERY hopeful. As the literal view is not only harmful but dangerous to this world, be it Christian or Muslim.

Not only are most Americans cafeteria Christians, they are at worst ready to discard I think their core beliefs when faced with tough questions.

I was reminded about the gay marriage movement, where the Mormon church (come on really? they are as sane as scientology) spent tens of millions in California (where Mormons represent 1-3% of the state) to pass Prop 8.

The same church that said blacks were cursed and doomed to hell, that indians were a tribe of Israel (ruh roh, DNA proved it wrong)... Yet this is what we saw in California. Hate propoganda, lies, and ultimately playing on the fears of minorities (blacks/hispanics) that are more religious than the white american.

So my question to those pick/choose Christians in America is why do you ignore the slavery, ignore the women as property, the plethora of brutal things the bible's teach and then say OH but gay is wrong is the right part of the bible. These same people deny Shellfish is wrong to eat (not according to the bible) but are fully ok with denying human rights to gays in marriage.

Pick/Choose Christians, and in California they were able to pass Prop 8 with the religiosity of blacks and hispanics.

Very sad.

[Displaced Flames fan]

I told you guys this was happening, just thought it was at a much higher rate already. And it may be. Some people are reluctant to divorce themselves completely from their claim to a particular religion even if they don't practice it in any way whatsoever.

[Daradon]

Originally Posted by Thor

Is this a pushback to Bush and the Evangelicals?? Is this a awakening of the atheist movement finally showing results?

Whatever is going on, its clear, the evangelical movement is facing a pushback to their dogma.

I dunno, I haven't gone through all of your links yet, but in the main story it actually said that while Christianity is on the decline, Evangelical and 'born again' type beliefs are actually on the rise.

'The survey also found that "born-again" or "evangelical" Christianity is on the rise, while the percentage who belong to "mainline" congregations such as the Episcopal or Lutheran churches has fallen.'

At least according to THIS survey and story, Christianity is on the decline, but the more radical subsections are growing over the more mainstream beliefs.

Not really a great trade off IMO. it's not Christians or religious people that are the problem, it's the most radical of the religious people (in any religion) that are.

The ones that want to teach Creationism and change laws and protest gay funerals etc. As like with Muslim beliefs, it's not the majority that are the problem. It's the minority that want to bomb buildings and decapitate cartoonists that are.

[Temporary_User]

As someone who grew up in the States, I have a hard time believing that even 75% is christian.
I have never been to church outside of one time I went with a friend and his family after I stayed the previous night at their home. Other than him, I can't think of a single other friend who went to church every sunday.

[skins]

Originally Posted by T@T

Strange a country with that many "so-called" god loving people can be so murderous in nature toward each other.

A couple comments...

Christians are ordinary people and can make the same mistakes or poor decisions that anyone else can make. They are not immune to greed, jealously, hate, desperation or mental illness. The vibe I get from your post that you think Christians should be held to a higher standard because of their beliefs. Like it's worse for a God-fearing Christian to murder someone than an Atheist. Is that true? Sure, the basis for their respective ethical codes may be different, but the distinction between what is right and wrong is similar.



The part I bolded in your post leads me to believe you're experience with Christians is that they project a sense of moral superiority because of their religion, and if that's the case then I understand your view point. But I really don't think religious belief has a much impact on whether someone decides to commit murder (present day United States - historically is a different story). Also, I wonder how many convicted murderers in the US are "Christians" (do they go to church more than a couple times a year, do they actually believe what they are hearing from the preacher or reading in the bible, etc?).

Interesting topic.

[Thor]

Originally Posted by Displaced Flames fan

I told you guys this was happening, just thought it was at a much higher rate already. And it may be. Some people are reluctant to divorce themselves completely from their claim to a particular religion even if they don't practice it in any way whatsoever.

I think one thing we have to remember about these surveys is they don't dig deeper.

For example most of my Christian friends don't believe in adam/eve, don't believe in the resurrection, don't believe the bible is anything other than a man's creation.

If pollsters dug deep to people claiming Christian belief, the numbers of people who really see the bible literally is very small, as photon posted.

A perfect example of people who claim being Christians and are about as far from the American definition is the Nordic countries. In Sweden/Denmark most people there call themselves Christian, in 2 countries where people who don't believe in God make up around 80% of the population.

When the sociologist dug deeper in his book (society without god), he found that people who didn't believe in God, calling themselves Christian meant Christian by it was there heritage, they felt strongly in the golden rule, strongly about charity and taking care of each other as a people.

Obviously socialism there works well with the teachings of Jesus about charity, helping the poor and caring for your fellow man.

So for me anytime I see statistics from surveys I always wonder if people are being truly honest about what they believe, if they really give it much thought or even if it really means much to them at all.

So that 75% or higher that are said to be Christian, you really can't assume that more than a minority of that is true literalist's.