Goalie Queries

[Nehkara]

Hey everyone!

I haven't closely followed QC this season but a quick look at the stats brought up a few questions that I would like to ask those of you who are more informed.

Keetley 30 GP (7-17-4) 2 SO - 2.70 - 0.899
Irving 26 GP (12-11-1) 0 SO - 2.27 - 0.907
Lalande 2 GP (2-0-0) 1 SO - 1.5 - 0.940

Give those stats I see that Keetley had trouble winning before being sent down. Irving looks very solid, good numbers. Lalande seems to have had a good start but it is too early to tell, I suspect.

The stats can only tell me so much.

Has Irving looked like the steady goalie that his stats suggest?
Has Keetley been as bad as his stats suggest?

Thanks in advance!

[dobbles]

both keetley and irving have had their ups and downs this year. i personally thought keetley needed less time a while back and was criticized by fellow fans, so i did a little research. i will go ahead and quote that for your reading pleasure!

i will hope to explain why i think keetley stunk up the place for a while, and why i personally have made statements saying i think he hasn't been playing well. i am pretty sure pimking shares my opinion that keetley stunk up the place for a while.

keetley had a great start to the season. keetley had 2 great games over the weekend. there is no denying that. so i do realize that all players have hot and cold streak. so i am willing to conceed that what i am about to say should be taken with a grain of salt.

from oct. 29th until jan. 17th, keetley played in 20 games. in that time he had a save % of 87.2. the ahl tracks stats for all goalies with over 900 minutes; in those 20 games, keetley played 1100 minutes, and the only goalie with a lower save % that meets the requirement is chris beckford-tseu. (87.1)

in that span, keetley posted save percentages of 68.4, 78.6, 71.4, 70.0, and 75.0. those are soem pretty brutal individual games. during that same time as keetley's stats were tanking, irving had improving stats. from oct. 29th until jan. 17th, irving had a save % of 91.9.

so what i am saying is this: keetley had a span of a couple months where he played pretty poor hockey that seemed to get worse as it went on. during that same time, irving played much better and had consistently improving stats. yet keetley got to play 1102 minutes, and irving only played 894. keetley got 20 starts and irving only go 13.

since i am sure this is still pretty wordy, and i am trying not to be nerdy like frerkes (big failure there eh?) i will summarize again: keetley had stats on the decline and kept getting top guy minutes, while irving constantly improved and never really got a fair amount of minutes. i know all the stats are probably confusing. i had to create a spreadsheet to calculate everything. but i wanted to provide the stats to show that i was not just talking off my @ss or using only my opinion.

like i said at the beginning, we do need to consider the whole season. and when doing that, irving is only marginally better than keetley statistically. but keetley had a pretty long slump. and i think we are all hoping his recent play in grand rapids is him getting his act together and not a hot streak that will be followed by a couple months of subpar play like we started the year with.

[PIMking]

http://echl.leaguestat.com/stats/gam...p?game_id=6667

Seems like keets is having a problem stopping pucks in the echl too..

Irving is going to be a stud! makes some rookie mistakes here and there but most of them dont cost them the game.

his first pro game was horrible I was at iowa and his first shot was a 2 on 0 breakaway.

Keets had a great first month and fell hard after that. He seems to have alot of problems with his stick side (hes a right catch) and likes to shoot from one side of the crease to calgary leaving a wide open net. Hes been having rebound problems also. I think the main thing is a mental problem not as much as a physical.

Here is what I forsee going on next year. McE is going to walk and go to another team that he will see more than 5 games a year.

Keets isnt going to make the big show next year and Irving is going to ride the pine in calgary stunting his growth as a goalie.

Keets and Lalande will be the tandem in the AHL next year.

Now unless Keets changes his habits and comes to camp and steals the show I think its going to be Irving riding the pine and packing the vets bags.

[lvwranglersfan]

Originally Posted by PIMking

http://echl.leaguestat.com/stats/gam...p?game_id=6667

Seems like keets is having a problem stopping pucks in the echl too..

I wouldn't blame the 3 goals from that game on him. His defense wasn't helping him at all. One of the goals was on the 3rd rebound. He looks a lot better to me than Lalande did. He is more positionally sound and makes a lot more routine saves. Lalande always had problems making the routine saves, he would make the spectacular ones, but the routine ones gave him problems.

[PIMking]

Originally Posted by lvwranglersfan

I wouldn't blame the 3 goals from that game on him. His defense wasn't helping him at all. One of the goals was on the 3rd rebound. He looks a lot better to me than Lalande did. He is more positionally sound and makes a lot more routine saves. Lalande always had problems making the routine saves, he would make the spectacular ones, but the routine ones gave him problems.

Are you sure your talking about the same keetley and Lalande???

Because what you said about keets is what I would say about Lalande and what you said about Lalande I would say about keets.

[Drunk Skunk]

Lalande was out of position quite a bit this past weekend. He got lucky several times. Once, he was on the ice, laying down, and was closer to the face off circle than he was the crease.

[Imported_Aussie]

Originally Posted by PIMking

Here is what I forsee going on next year. McE is going to walk and go to another team that he will see more than 5 games a year.

Keets isnt going to make the big show next year and Irving is going to ride the pine in calgary stunting his growth as a goalie.

Keets and Lalande will be the tandem in the AHL next year.

Now unless Keets changes his habits and comes to camp and steals the show I think its going to be Irving riding the pine and packing the vets bags.

i hope for irving's sake you are wrong, he needs game time to develop, and i think sutter wont want to burn a 1st round pick and a guy with promise. If McE walks and Keetley isnt there yet, the flames will hopefully make a move to get another backup, either in the UFA market or a minor trade

of these 3 goaltenders, do you guys only see irving as the one to make the jump to the NHL? Is Irving a future number 1 down the road, or a tweener?

[lvwranglersfan]

Originally Posted by Drunk Skunk

Lalande was out of position quite a bit this past weekend. He got lucky several times. Once, he was on the ice, laying down, and was closer to the face off circle than he was the crease.

My experience is that he overplays the angles a lot and leaves a lot of the net open from the back door. Keetley has been very impressive with us, although I would still put Glenn Fisher, an Edmonton prospect, as our #1.

[PIMking]

Originally Posted by Drunk Skunk

Lalande was out of position quite a bit this past weekend. He got lucky several times. Once, he was on the ice, laying down, and was closer to the face off circle than he was the crease.

Your right there DS, We didnt get to see the houston game but he wasnt as sharp as I expected.

[PIMking]

Originally Posted by Imported_Aussie

i hope for irving's sake you are wrong, he needs game time to develop, and i think sutter wont want to burn a 1st round pick and a guy with promise. If McE walks and Keetley isnt there yet, the flames will hopefully make a move to get another backup, either in the UFA market or a minor trade

of these 3 goaltenders, do you guys only see irving as the one to make the jump to the NHL? Is Irving a future number 1 down the road, or a tweener?

I think Irving will force kipper to retire in 4 years. Kipper has a 5 year contract that I doubt sutter is going to keep him as a back up. Irving gets better and better every game I see him. Im not a goalie person either but im amazed how well that he has played. I hope for Irving and the Flames sake that he doesnt get to ride the pine in calgary too.

I think he is going to make it very hard for sutter in 4 years on whos going to be the goalie in calgary.

[JiriHrdina]

First great insight and thoughts in this thread.

However I doubt Irving will ride the pine. I think the Flames view him as a future #1, and as such will take the appropriate development path with him.

If McH walks (and I'm not sure he does, not much market for guys with no wins) than I think the Flames simply bring in another back-up. There's a ton of guys out there to be had every off-season.

[SparkyOne]

Originally Posted by lvwranglersfan

My experience is that he overplays the angles a lot and leaves a lot of the net open from the back door. Keetley has been very impressive with us, although I would still put Glenn Fisher, an Edmonton prospect, as our #1.

He was doing that tonight in the Lake Erie game as well. They scored their first goal when he was out of position, and later in the game Chucko saved a certain goal when Lalande was out too far playing an angle and the puck got behind him but not over the line.

Sometimes I was yelling, sometimes I was closing my eyes and praying.....

[The Fonz]

I can't see Sutter bringing in Irving if he's not going to get to play. If McElhinney wants out, there are plenty of UFA goaltenders who could replace him...

Dubielewicz, Wade
Norrena, Fredrik
Ersberg, Erik
Denis, Marc
Weekes, Kevin
MacDonald, Joey
Valiquette, Stephen
Tellqvist, Mikael
Johnson, Brent
Labarbera, Jason

...just to name a few.