Tell me about "All in One" Mortgages - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

JiriHrdina · 02-11-2009, 05:42 PM

Met with my broker today to talk about changing up my mortgage - and he recommended one of them "National Bank All in One" dealies.

Does anyone have this? What is the downside because I could see none, which means there must be.

MoneyGuy · 02-11-2009, 06:02 PM

I'll get in before Slava does. He's probably driving through nasty Calgary traffic at this moment.

This sounds like Manulife One (Canuck Tire also has one). If it's what I think it is, it's several products rolled into one - mortgage, lines of credit (can be multiple ones), chequing account, savings account. If this is what it is, are you a spender or a saver? If you're a good saver, look at it. If you're a big spender, I'd steer away from these things as they can get you into a world of trouble. That's your potential downside, being that you asked about that. Does this sound like what you were told. Or might be something entirely different. This product is also called an Australian mortgage. It started in Australia. It's called an Australian mortgage for another reason; used improperly and you can be burned, just like the big fires down under these days.

Traditional_Ale · 02-11-2009, 06:55 PM

The more too-good-to-be-true it sounds, the bigger a dick they're trying to put in your ass.

JiriHrdina · 02-11-2009, 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MoneyGuy

I'll get in before Slava does. He's probably driving through nasty Calgary traffic at this moment.

This sounds like Manulife One (Canuck Tire also has one). If it's what I think it is, it's several products rolled into one - mortgage, lines of credit (can be multiple ones), chequing account, savings account. If this is what it is, are you a spender or a saver? If you're a good saver, look at it. If you're a big spender, I'd steer away from these things as they can get you into a world of trouble. That's your potential downside, being that you asked about that. Does this sound like what you were told. Or might be something entirely different. This product is also called an Australian mortgage. It started in Australia. It's called an Australian mortgage for another reason; used improperly and you can be burned, just like the big fires down under these days.

Sounds about right - broker in fact told me the same thing - if I'm confident in my abilities to save than its a great deal.

Thanks. Much appreciated.

GoinAllTheWay · 02-11-2009, 07:18 PM

**edit**

DementedReality · 02-11-2009, 09:13 PM

i have M1 and frankly it has saved me .... i agree if you cant control your spending, its a nightmare waiting to happen. however, we are pretty good at minding our money and i lost my job 2 months ago and it has given me the cash flow to make it through.

sure i am not saving anymore, but having access to cash is exactly why i went with this product. without it, i would be in world of trouble financially.

DementedReality · 02-11-2009, 09:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fotze

A little off topic. What amount of cash do you wish you had socked away looking back? Just curious what a good amount is?

well, i never had to think about it like that ... i brought my mortgage down by about 45k since I got this product, I suppose I would have invested it is something like an ING account if not for the open style mortgage.

however, when i have "savings" its easy to spend .. for me, having "debt" motivates me to be wiser with my choices so i doubt i would have saved that much in a traditional set up.

how much cash would i want though? 6 months of pay cheques I suppose.

MoneyGuy · 02-11-2009, 10:09 PM

This style of product can be great when used properly in the right situation, or a disaster in the hands of the wrong people. Don't believe the folks who outright dismiss it. It has applications.

McG · 02-11-2009, 10:39 PM

this is the 2nd m1 product that we have had and what everyone has written is exactly true.

my wife and i always discuss whether or not a formal repayment plan is better or whether the m1 flexibility is better...we go back and forth on that.

one thing that we like is that the paycheque goes right onto the mortgage...you are saving interest cost from the day that you get paid.

i secretly think that my wife and i don't agree on how to best use the product...i am a huge saver and i think she spends a bit more than i would like...but at the end of the day we make it work.

Slava · 02-11-2009, 10:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

Met with my broker today to talk about changing up my mortgage - and he recommended one of them "National Bank All in One" dealies.

Does anyone have this? What is the downside because I could see none, which means there must be.

The National Bank All-in-One is a little different from the Manulife One as I understand. I'm not 100% sure, but I've been led to believe that the NB account is a series of accounts linked together, whereas the Manulife One account is everything mashed into one account (if that difference makes sense?). What this means operationally is significant as the Manulife One account doesn't have fees for each sub-account, and there is a certain ease and fluidity to doing business this way.

I speak highly of this particular product because for me it has made an incredible impact as opposed to a "standard" mortgage.

DementedReality · 02-11-2009, 10:43 PM

adding to McG's point, I have to say that all the $$$ arguments stopped when we got this product. of course, both people need to be somewhat aligned, but it just helped make our finances so much easier to manage and tha alone made the change worth it. if the kids need $$ for something, i no longer had to ask my wife to wait until payday or any of other usual spending discussions that require timing. true, big purchases require discussion, but this product simply made our marriage better. hard to believe a mortgage can make a difference?

a happy wife is a happy life. rinse and repeat.

Slava · 02-11-2009, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DementedReality

adding to McG's point, I have to say that all the $$$ arguments stopped when we got this product. of course, both people need to be somewhat aligned, but it just helped make our finances so much easier to manage and tha alone made the change worth it. if the kids need $$ for something, i no longer had to ask my wife to wait until payday or any of other usual spending discussions that require timing. true, big purchases require discussion, but this product simply made our marriage better. hard to believe a mortgage can make a difference?

a happy wife is a happy life. rinse and repeat.

It is a similar experience for so many of my clients, and I agree it is a little strange how much easier it makes life!

Top Shelf · 02-12-2009, 07:22 AM

From what I've read, the M1 type mortgages can be good for people who have money left over at the end of the month after paying all there bills. They can also be good for people who have a fluctuating income every month

There are a few good discussions on the pros and cons of this product on the web, one I found was here:

http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/...age-review.htm

More specific to the Manulife offering.

On the same site, they break down the numbers:

http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/...e-mortgage.htm

To quickly summarize the Manulife One mortgage, it’s a giant HELOC that encompasses your mortgage, chequing/savings and other debt. The biggest advantages being convenience and the ability to have your extra cash flow working against the mortgage. The disadvantages being the higher cost relative to getting a regular discounted variable rate mortgage.

DementedReality · 02-12-2009, 08:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fotze

Our financial person has recommended this for a just in case. If there was no large monthly fee I would probably do it. Are they all $35 per month?

M1 is $14 for me... it was no big deal as my previous banking methods were costing me well over $40 per month.

I like it, but I am sure someone who had the patience and wanted to make the effort could break it down and have the same mechanics with an ala carte system for cheaper. however its just not worth the hassle for me and even at a slightly higher cost than ala carte, its still a great product for me. especially with my recent lay off.

psicodude · 02-12-2009, 08:47 AM

I also have the M1 account (Thanks Slava!) and am extremely happy with it. We have paid down nearly $15,000 in debt since getting it last fall, while not really changing our spending habits. Those habits, however, have always been fairly conservative though....which I think is the key with this type of account.

I think the best advice I could give is to sit down with an expert on the product for an hour or two. My wife was really skeptical about the whole thing at first, but after hearing the details about how it works and why it makes such a difference every month, we both agreed it was a no-brainer.

You should also be prepared to throw up in your mouth after you use a bank machine for the first time and see your account balance is $ -150,000.

Slava · 02-12-2009, 08:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Top Shelf

From what I've read, the M1 type mortgages can be good for people who have money left over at the end of the month after paying all there bills. They can also be good for people who have a fluctuating income every month

There are a few good discussions on the pros and cons of this product on the web, one I found was here:

http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/...age-review.htm

More specific to the Manulife offering.

On the same site, they break down the numbers:

http://www.milliondollarjourney.com/...e-mortgage.htm

To quickly summarize the Manulife One mortgage, it’s a giant HELOC that encompasses your mortgage, chequing/savings and other debt. The biggest advantages being convenience and the ability to have your extra cash flow working against the mortgage. The disadvantages being the higher cost relative to getting a regular discounted variable rate mortgage.

You can also access the Manulife One calculator at www.manulifebank.ca and check out the figures for yourself.

Incinerator · 02-12-2009, 09:23 AM

I have a DIY version at TD, my chequing account has $200 in it on a good day and my buddy waived the monthly fee on that for me, so I don't have to pay $3.95 every month. I do everything with my HELOC, it works especially well if you are self-employed and don't have a steady paycheque. Stuff it all in to lower your interest on good months and it'll save your behind on bad months.

macker · 02-12-2009, 09:43 AM

MFC just reported a fourth-quarter loss of $1.87 billion as they took a pounding because of their exposure to the stock market. The Manulife One and Manulife Income Plus are products that were introduced in much different market conditions and they could cause MFC even more pain and suffering going forward. Good thing they also sell DI & CI as it could be a bumpy recovery for them! Best CEO in the business though too bad he is leaving...This quarterly loss is almost AIGish...

Ford Prefect · 02-12-2009, 09:53 AM

So what's the upside for the financial institutions with M1s? There must be some or they wouldn't be offering this product.

Incinerator · 02-12-2009, 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ford Prefect

So what's the upside for the financial institutions with M1s? There must be some or they wouldn't be offering this product.

most people does not have the self-discipline to manage their own finances, you give the average joe $200K to play with they will usually put the new car and vacation on it without thinking whether they can afford to.