C-Train disruption (old bumped thread)

[Dion]

Originally Posted by 4X4

I read what you posted. We're going to have to agree to disagree. I've known 5 people that have killed themselves. Not one of them saw fit to deliberately ruin someone else's life on their way out. That doesn't make their suicides more noble of course, but between the car/garage trick, hanging in their own closet and good old fashioned ODing, there are quite a few ways to get it done.
IMO forcing a stranger to re-live your angst for the rest of his or her life is not justified by 'not being of rational mind'.

It doesn't matter how the act is done someone is going to be affected. Wether it be the C Train driver or family and friends.

When i swallowed those bottle of pills when i was 18 my mind wasn't focusing on how my act would affect family and friends and the intense grief it would cause. All I felt was incredible emotional pain, to a point where there was no light at the end of the tunnel - no hope. I knew that when the pills had done their job the pain i felt would no longer be there. That and the incredible sense of peace that years of suffering would be over.

Thankfully there wasn't enough pills in the bottle and i survived.

Months later after getting help i was horrified at what i tried to do and the grief and pain i would have inflicted on my family and friends. I'm in my 40's now and I am haunted by that memory every single day. To think i came that close to ending my life.

I understand that you wanted to agree to disagree. I just thought i'd offer a first hand experience.

[4X4]

I was going to dissect the different causes suicide has on different people but didn't. Now I think I better clarify that killing yourself already hurts your family and friends. Why do you need to spread that pain into another circle of family and friends by involving someone else?
Rational mind. I heard you. I guess I just have no idea how a person can be that far out of their mind.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

That is only because you are in a rational mind, therefore are fit to judge.

Yep, it's always different when you've been there, compared to when people think they know what they would do if they were there.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by 4X4

I was going to dissect the different causes suicide has on different people but didn't. Now I think I better clarify that killing yourself already hurts your family and friends. Why do you need to spread that pain into another circle of family and friends by involving someone else?
Rational mind. I heard you. I guess I just have no idea how a person can be that far out of their mind.

Really? (and that's not a snarky reply), cause I took some psych classes, and MANY people get that far out of their mind, it happens in every city, every day for many different reasons.

[OILFAN #81]

Originally Posted by Dion

It doesn't matter how the act is done someone is going to be affected. Wether it be the C Train driver or family and friends.

When i swallowed those bottle of pills when i was 18 my mind wasn't focusing on how my act would affect family and friends and the intense grief it would cause. All I felt was incredible emotional pain, to a point where there was no light at the end of the tunnel - no hope. I knew that when the pills had done their job the pain i felt would no longer be there. That and the incredible sense of peace that years of suffering would be over.

Thankfully there wasn't enough pills in the bottle and i survived.

Months later after getting help i was horrified at what i tried to do and the grief and pain i would have inflicted on my family and friends. I'm in my 40's now and I am haunted by that memory every single day. To think i came that close to ending my life.

I understand that you wanted to agree to disagree. I just thought i'd offer a first hand experience.

A: I'm glad that there weren't enough pills in that bottle.

B: My best girl friend tried to kill herself and fortunately was unsuccessful. After being there with her, IMO, it's harder to actually do the deed yourself and that's why people look to doing it in other ways (jumping in front of cars/trains). I don't think they have the intention of making someone else feel guilty by being involved indirectly but just don't have the emotional strength to do it themselves (hanging themselves, cutting their wrists etc). Anyways, I agree with the person who said that I wish other people didn't have to be involved if the unfortunate incidents had to happen in the first place, but that's me speaking from a clear state of mind. I've never been in that position so I guess my opinion on the matter isn't as valuable as to one's who has.

[4X4]

Originally Posted by flameswin

Really? (and that's not a snarky reply), cause I took some psych classes, and MANY people get that far out of their mind, it happens in every city, every day for many different reasons.

I guess when I think about it it's not so far fetched.

OK. Let me re-phrase my sentiment.

It is sadly ironic when a person chooses to end their (apparently) ruined life and inadvertantly ruins someone elses.

[OILFAN #81]

Originally Posted by 4X4

I was going to dissect the different causes suicide has on different people but didn't. Now I think I better clarify that killing yourself already hurts your family and friends. Why do you need to spread that pain into another circle of family and friends by involving someone else?
Rational mind. I heard you. I guess I just have no idea how a person can be that far out of their mind.

There are lots of ways. One of my best friends was violently assaulted and raped.

Someone else I know had to sit and watch both parents as well as two siblings get executed. If either of those happened to me, i'd probably be in the same state.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by OILFAN #81

B: My best girl friend tried to kill herself and fortunately was unsuccessful. After being there with her, IMO, it's harder to actually do the deed yourself and that's why people look to doing it in other ways (jumping in front of cars/trains). I don't think they have the intention of making someone else feel guilty by being involved indirectly but just don't have the emotional strength to do it themselves (hanging themselves, cutting their wrists etc). Anyways, I agree with the person who said that I wish other people didn't have to be involved if the unfortunate incidents had to happen in the first place, but that's me speaking from a clear state of mind. I've never been in that position so I guess my opinion on the matter isn't as valuable as to one's who has.

Glad to hear she survived and you were there to comfort her

[OILFAN #81]

I just wanted to clarify my previous post because reading it again one thing might have came out wrong. When I said I wish other people didn't have to be involved, that's kind of hypocritical of me because I thank my lucky stars everyday I was there that night because if I wasn't.......well I don't want to think about it. Anyways, I didn't mean it like that.

Basically I meant that when they do try and commit suicide (and strangers are there who are helpless - not family/friends who can do something about it like I did in helping her), that it's unfortunate that they are bystanders.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by 4X4

I was going to dissect the different causes suicide has on different people but didn't. Now I think I better clarify that killing yourself already hurts your family and friends. Why do you need to spread that pain into another circle of family and friends by involving someone else?
Rational mind. I heard you. I guess I just have no idea how a person can be that far out of their mind.

And having never been there, you probably can't truly appreciate just how lucky you are that you have never been that far "out of your mind".

It is a completely warped view of the world, there is no doubt. In my case, I had convinced myself that I was burden on my family, and they'd would be better off without me. I think a lot of people in that position think the same. Looking back eleven years later, I can see how irrational it was, but in the moment? That line gets blurred beyond recognition.

It is definitely easy to look at this case, and question why someone would not only (potentially) try to take their life, but to do so in such a way that would affect so many others. It's easy to call it self-centred, and perhaps it really is. But when you are lost in the pain of the moment, you really don't consider how others view you. Rather, you may end up convincing yourself that even those strangers would look at you and believe they would be better off if you were gone.

Of course, no-one can know what was going through her head right now. Maybe there was a lot of selfishness involved with a thought of "If I am going to go anyway, I might as well make myself famous on the way out." A way to be remembered, perhaps, even if for all the wrong reasons.

Either way, I echo what others said earlier: hopefully she can recover fully, and find a means to a better life.

[maverickeastwood]

Everybody's situation, upbringing, work-life, home-life, etc are different. There is always a level of grief that must be dealt with, some think their's is worse than others. I came across this letter.

http://www.fact.on.ca/renouf/r_letter.htm

I have no opinion as I don't have experience with such a state, but this letter shows what can push people to such a point.

[4X4]

I just got a pm from somebody claiming to be a friend of the person at the center of this thread. I'm bumping this thread to publically announce that I stand by my comments no matter how evil and ugly and not human the person that pmnd me thinks I am.

I cannot think of anything more selfish than ambushing and forcing someone else to assist in your suicide. To you people that pmd me, blow it out your ass. If you wanna kill yourself, go ahead. Just don't involve a train operator and force them to have to relive it for the rest of his or her life.

My apologies if that sounds harsh, but this is a message board and we're all entitled to our opinions. My opinion is that your friend is a selfish jerk. Glad to hear she's doing better. Hope she realizes that she almost ruined someone else's life that day.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by 4X4

I just got a pm from somebody claiming to be a friend of the person at the center of this thread. I'm bumping this thread to publically announce that I stand by my comments no matter how evil and ugly and not human the person that pmnd me thinks I am.

I cannot think of anything more selfish than ambushing and forcing someone else to assist in your suicide. To you people that pmd me, blow it out your ass. If you wanna kill yourself, go ahead. Just don't involve a train operator and force them to have to relive it for the rest of his or her life.

My apologies if that sounds harsh, but this is a message board and we're all entitled to our opinions. My opinion is that your friend is a selfish jerk. Glad to hear she's doing better. Hope she realizes that she almost ruined someone else's life that day.

Good post.

I've experienced depression and anxiety in my life to the point of having to be medicated, but never once did I consider killing myself at the expense of someone else.

[4X4]

Actually, it was a not so good post. I re-read what the person sent me and she clarifies that the person in the story was not attempting suicide. It was an accident. And the person is getting better.

Of course, that doesn't change my view on involving someone else in your suicide. I still think that that is a terrible thing to do.

So, Iggysfuturewife, and your friend, my apologies for my last post. But no apologies for any other posts.

[ken0042]

I have changed the title as I was trying to figure out how this thread got so many views so fast; and then I realized the thread was exactly one year old.

[4X4]

Yeah, sorry for the bumpage. I went from zero to pissed off when I got that message, but it turns out that I misread it. So this thread can probably quietly die...