What would make Calgary more livable?

[Flames in 07]

Pulling the thought from the Apple thread, what does Calgary need to be more livable?

Here's my list:

1. A ton of well planned density in the beltline, Eau Claire and around Kensigton. Easy to say, and hard to do, but this will solve alot of problems in alot of city. Density is good, Calgarians need to get out of the mindset that a huge lot is a birthright. The Sunnyside TOD is a great start, and some of the projects going into the beltline look good ... need more of that. Density will spawn better restaurants, shopping etc.

2. More LRT spurs ... then connect them. I know the west leg is ready to go, but I'd love to see one go up center street, go out 17th ave SE then S at about blackfoot and I'd like to see the west leg have a large spur to the south, going down past fish creek and up north up to the NW leg.

3. Subsidize arts. Calgarians will like the arts ... I think it just needs to be shoved in their face.

4. increase taxes in the burbs, bring them down in the core. Any builder I have talked to says that Calgary is in for a infrasture gong show in the next couple decades. Density is way to low in the burbs and all the infrastrucre is going to cost a ton ... they can pay for it.

5. Bury the freaking LRT downtown. I met some city planner for Calgary in Chicago awhile ago and he said it would cost about a Billion dollars to do so ... not sure if that is true, and if so, I have no idea why, but it is still worth it. Alberta can pay for it.

[dissentowner]

From my impression from reading all the threads on here, less hookers and blow would be a good start.

[arsenal]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

From my impression from reading all the threads on here, less hookers and blow would be a good start.

Heathen!!!

[MelBridgeman]

Originally Posted by Flames in 07

Pulling the thought from the Apple thread, what does Calgary need to be more livable?

Here's my list:

1. A ton of well planned density in the beltline, Eau Claire and around Kensigton. Easy to say, and hard to do, but this will solve alot of problems in alot of city. Density is good, Calgarians need to get out of the mindset that a huge lot is a birthright. The Sunnyside TOD is a great start, and some of the projects going into the beltline look good ... need more of that. Density will spawn better restaurants, shopping etc.

2. More LRT spurs ... then connect them. I know the west leg is ready to go, but I'd love to see one go up center street, go out 17th ave SE then S at about blackfoot and I'd like to see the west leg have a large spur to the south, going down past fish creek and up north up to the NW leg.

3. Subsidize arts. Calgarians will like the arts ... I think it just needs to be shoved in their face.

4. increase taxes in the burbs, bring them down in the core. Any builder I have talked to says that Calgary is in for a infrasture gong show in the next couple decades. Density is way to low in the burbs and all the infrastrucre is going to cost a ton ... they can pay for it.

5. Bury the freaking LRT downtown. I met some city planner for Calgary in Chicago awhile ago and he said it would cost about a Billion dollars to do so ... not sure if that is true, and if so, I have no idea why, but it is still worth it. Alberta can pay for it.

The market will decide all of this. If people want to be cramped in the beltline in little boxes that apparently is what there true "birthright" is, then they will buy and developers will build. But you know there are pros and cons to everything including "density". Also some people don't care about better restaurants or shopping.

Define "Arts" and honestly if people actually liked them, there would be more of it...if your impression is it's lacking.

No need to increase taxes when living in the "burbs" already cost an arm and a leg if you drive....also increasing taxes...to penalize a group of people...stupid.

'I think it just needs to be shoved in their face" - ya that certianly is the way to go, push agenda on people...

The LRT should be buried...but apparently there is more too it than that...something about the stability of the soil, i think...I do know that Bankers Hall is sinking...some research is needed here.

Calgary is livable for me because my friends, family, good job, nice weather, hockey...and i live in the mission and can walk downtown and float down the river and enjoy some neat restaurants on 17th and 4th. i love it.

[Flames in 07]

Originally Posted by MelBridgeman

The market will decide all of this. If people want to be cramped in the beltline in little boxes that apparently is what there true "birthright" is, then they will buy and developers will build. But you know there are pros and cons to everything including "density". Also some people don't care about better restaurants or shopping.

Define "Arts" and honestly if people actually liked them, there would be more of it...if your impression is it's lacking.

No need to increase taxes when living in the "burbs" already cost an arm and a leg if you drive....also increasing taxes...to penalize a group of people...stupid.

'I think it just needs to be shoved in their face" - ya that certianly is the way to go, push agenda on people...

The LRT should be buried...but apparently there is more too it than that...something about the stability of the soil, i think...I do know that Bankers Hall is sinking...some research is needed here.

Calgary is livable for me because my friends, family, good job, nice weather, hockey...and i live in the mission and can walk downtown and float down the river and enjoy some neat restaurants on 17th and 4th. i love it.

Most of the time when people say something else is stupid ....

It's not a penalty, it is to have the small number of people who use the expensive infrastructure pay for it. The price of gasoline is totally irrelevant.

And yes to a degree the market decides things, but if left on it's own the market would chew off its own head if it knew it would make $5. The market should decide things like the value of a commodity but if left on it's own the 'market' would completely screw up a city. Careful thought needs to go into zoning and public expenditures.

As for arts, I would mean a very general meaning I guess. maybe shoved in their face is the wrong way to say it, but the reserves in Northern Alberta are going to bring people from all over the world to Calgary, and even though it's growing, Calgary still feels like a simple small prairie town. I know many people are proud of that, but people moving here will have expectations about large cities that in ways Calgary cannot provide right now.

Anyway thanks for the value add, anyone can criticize, what would you do?

[Wookie]

Originally Posted by Flames in 07

It's not a penalty, it is to have the small number of people who use the expensive infrastructure pay for it. The price of gasoline is totally irrelevant but people moving here will have expectations about large cities that in ways Calgary cannot provide right now.

1. How can you prove that the person who lives in Tuscany, Hawkwood, Edgemont, etc. doesn't work at the Foothills/Children's hospital, UofC, Local school, West of the city, out of town, Crowfoot professional buildings etc.? Same goes for any suburb. What about the majority that live in the suburbs that like it? Wait, tax them more because the minority wants trendy shops, condo's and nice shops and strolls around downtown.

2. People moving here and their expectations? Wow - that's something I really could not care at all about! If someone moved here and was upset because it didn't meet their expectations I'd think they were an idiot.

[Phaneuf]

More cowbell?

[Flames in 07]

Originally Posted by Wookie

1. How can you prove that the person who lives in Tuscany, Hawkwood, Edgemont, etc. doesn't work at the Foothills/Children's hospital, UofC, Local school, West of the city, out of town, Crowfoot professional buildings etc.? Same goes for any suburb. What about the majority that live in the suburbs that like it? Wait, tax them more because the minority wants trendy shops, condo's and nice shops and strolls around downtown.

2. People moving here and their expectations? Wow - that's something I really could not care at all about! If someone moved here and was upset because it didn't meet their expectations I'd think they were an idiot.

1. Well some things I don't need proof about. I presume they all use the transmission lines, sewer lines, water lines, gas lines, roads and parks. I have no idea what the location of someones workplace means, and why you think that matters.

2. And that is exactly how you manufacture a tight labor market. The bottleneck right now to growth in Cgy is certainly not jobs ... it is interest in the city. You may not care, but then, you probably don't have a business that is dependant on the vibrancy and/or growth of the city.

[SebC]

Originally Posted by MelBridgeman

The market will decide all of this. If people want to be cramped in the beltline in little boxes that apparently is what there true "birthright" is, then they will buy and developers will build.

Surely, if you're going to make an economic argument you should understand that the market only works to produce the most efficient solution when the externalities are internalized. Adjusting tax rates to reflect the real marginal costs to the city of surburban versus inner city development is how you do that.

[MelBridgeman]

Originally Posted by Flames in 07

Most of the time when people say something else is stupid ....

It's not a penalty, it is to have the small number of people who use the expensive infrastructure pay for it. The price of gasoline is totally irrelevant.

And yes to a degree the market decides things, but if left on it's own the market would chew off its own head if it knew it would make $5. The market should decide things like the value of a commodity but if left on it's own the 'market' would completely screw up a city. Careful thought needs to go into zoning and public expenditures.

As for arts, I would mean a very general meaning I guess. maybe shoved in their face is the wrong way to say it, but the reserves in Northern Alberta are going to bring people from all over the world to Calgary, and even though it's growing, Calgary still feels like a simple small prairie town. I know many people are proud of that, but people moving here will have expectations about large cities that in ways Calgary cannot provide right now.

Anyway thanks for the value add, anyone can criticize, what would you do?

I don't think there is anything wrong with Calgary...it has the same issues as every other city in the world has but on a different scale, whether is be higher or lower....Calgary is kind of a special case, it is a city that can experience unpresented growth from month to month...and it takes time and money to built infrastructure to support it...

As far as taxes go...my opinion is that they don't solve anything, but take for example the Luciaks, they have lived in Lake Bonivista for over 30 years...when they bought their house there wasn't anything unusual in doing so, there was no pro-density thanks to enviromental concerns fear mongering around, if anything they were living in the era where people moved further and further away thanks to cool modern day inventions like rapid transit and the automobile...so now we should tell them well you decision was wrong....so you pay more taxes....and less than someone who is doing everything "right" based on today's "fear".

Ways to improve the city - i don't disagree with anything (except taxes part), selfishly here are the things i would add.
1. New hockey arena
2. diff a move on the east side redevelopment and stampede park (pick up the progress)
3. Need more parks in little vancouver (west end)

Calgary is a great city, and if you have never lived anywhere else sometimes you don't see it...

[Flames in 07]

Originally Posted by MelBridgeman

I don't think there is anything wrong with Calgary...it has the same issues as every other city in the world has but on a different scale, whether is be higher or lower....Calgary is kind of a special case, it is a city that can experience unpresented growth from month to month...and it takes time and money to built infrastructure to support it...

As far as taxes go...my opinion is that they don't solve anything, but take for example the Luciaks, they have lived in Lake Bonivista for over 30 years...when they bought their house there wasn't anything unusual in doing so, there was no pro-density thanks to enviromental concerns fear mongering around, if anything they were living in the era where people moved further and further away thanks to cool modern day inventions like rapid transit and the automobile...so now we should tell them well you decision was wrong....so you pay more taxes....and less than someone who is doing everything "right" based on today's "fear".

Ways to improve the city - i don't disagree with anything (except taxes part), selfishly here are the things i would add.
1. New hockey arena
2. diff a move on the east side redevelopment and stampede park (pick up the progress)
3. Need more parks in little vancouver (west end)

Calgary is a great city, and if you have never lived anywhere else sometimes you don't see it...

I think overall Cgy is a decent city, don't get me wrong, I guess my biggest complaint is that it is still a big small town ... in many negative respects ... but that's OT. The topic was how to make it more livable, not how to salvage it.

I have no idea how your taxes arguement about someone in Bonavista has anything to do with what I'm saying. I'm saying that people in the burbs should pay their fair share of infrastructure costs. How exactly does my comment make you migrate to fear mongering?

As for your hockey arena, I agree, but I'd also replace McMahon and Foothills which are both just garbage and embarrassing.

[RW99]

More arts, green space downtown, less rednecks, less cookie cutter developments, build up not out.

[MelBridgeman]

Originally Posted by Flames in 07

1. Well some things I don't need proof about. I presume they all use the transmission lines, sewer lines, water lines, gas lines, roads and parks. I have no idea what the location of someones workplace means, and why you think that matters.

We all use those items. If you live in Deer Run or in the deep south, there is a treatment plant near fish creek...the trendy people in the beltline have one out near deerfoot...

water lines...mmmm - our water sources are close to the burbs than the beltline

not sure why people in the beltline get to have a tax break....considering you dont have to built new utlility lines from downtown out to each new community.

[MelBridgeman]

Originally Posted by Flames in 07

I think overall Cgy is a decent city, don't get me wrong, I guess my biggest complaint is that it is still a big small town ... in many negative respects ... but that's OT. The topic was how to make it more livable, not how to salvage it.

I have no idea how your taxes arguement about someone in Bonavista has anything to do with what I'm saying. I'm saying that people in the burbs should pay their fair share of infrastructure costs. How exactly does my comment make you migrate to fear mongering?

As for your hockey arena, I agree, but I'd also replace McMahon and Foothills which are both just garbage and embarrassing.

would would be the fair share of infrastructure costs of someone in Bonavista (which is the burbs) when the infrastructure is already there?

[BigBCalgary]

As a born and raised Calgarian the last thing I would want is more Density in the core. I personally feel that instead of the positive results suggested that there would be more negative (I my Mind) results. I do not want Calgary to be like any of the major centers in the states (New York, Chicago etc.) I like the suburbs, Most of my friends are still 10 - 15 minutes away and If I feel the need , which is rare, to go downtown - I do. But I don't know anybody in my demographic that wants to live downtown as much as it's a nice place to visit once in a while.

[Flames in 07]

Originally Posted by MelBridgeman

We all use those items. If you live in Deer Run or in the deep south, there is a treatment plant near fish creek...the trendy people in the beltline have one out near deerfoot...

water lines...mmmm - our water sources are close to the burbs than the beltline

not sure why people in the beltline get to have a tax break....considering you dont have to built new utlility lines from downtown out to each new community.

You are missing my point I think. In the burbs less people use them per km because of how sparse it is. IE the denominator is much lower.

[jammies]

Originally Posted by MelBridgeman

The market will decide all of this. If people want to be cramped in the beltline in little boxes that apparently is what there true "birthright" is, then they will buy and developers will build. But you know there are pros and cons to everything including "density". Also some people don't care about better restaurants or shopping.

The way this city is going, we'll end up like the many cities in the US where the cost of the suburbs eventually outstrips the tax base, causing the city to raise taxes to a point where people leave the city entirely to live in feeder communities to escape the tax burden, thereby worsening the situation in a spiral which ends up with the city being chronically underfunded and its infrastructure crumbling.

So "the market" needs to start reflecting the true cost of building all these suburbs, as right now we are underwriting the profits of developers and the lifestyles of the suburbanites with the tax money of businesses and the inner city. I'd like to see how many people would choose to live out past 162nd Ave S if their houses were tens of thousands dollars more to pay for freeway expansions, and their taxes were doubled up to pay for the cost of maintenance of the all the infrastructure they need.

As far as what I'd like to see in Calgary, I'd like to see the river park system vastly expanded. You can never have enough parkland, and while the current parks are nice, they could do so much more with them.

[Flames in 07]

Oh and one more. I don't understand why builders in Calgary get away with twinning every project they build. It doesn't matter if it is commerical or residential, everyone seems to get away with twinning whatever they build.

[Flames in 07]

Originally Posted by MelBridgeman

would would be the fair share of infrastructure costs of someone in Bonavista (which is the burbs) when the infrastructure is already there?

The cost to maintain and replace it. Presuming it has been fully amortized.

I don't work for the city so have no special knowledge, but I have talked to 4 builders who have all said Calgary is remarkably bad at city design, fundamentally because it is so sparse and the cost of maintaining the city is going to cripple the tax base because of how sparse things are.

[Shazam]

$30/barrel oil should do the trick.