The Bow

[Iggy's Forehead]

OT- Are they still planning on putting up Palliser East and West (the glass buildings) around the Calgary tower? I saw a projected picture in the Herald over a year ago and they said it was planned for completion in 2010.

[kdoir345]

Originally Posted by Iggy's Forehead

OT- Are they still planning on putting up Palliser East and West (the glass buildings) around the Calgary tower? I saw a projected picture in the Herald over a year ago and they said it was planned for completion in 2010.

They're building Palliser South right now just south of One Palliser Square, and the development model has all three buildings. It was on display in the Avison club during the playoffs

[Regulator75]

Originally Posted by Azure

If anyone could take pictures....it'd be awesome.

There will be pictures here.
http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=131013

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Regulator75

There will be pictures here.
http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=131013

Thanks!

[Claeren]

Originally Posted by Iggy's Forehead

OT- Are they still planning on putting up Palliser East and West (the glass buildings) around the Calgary tower? I saw a projected picture in the Herald over a year ago and they said it was planned for completion in 2010.

They missed the cycle on those.

As was said, they are already well into building a 3rd building on the south side of the tracks, but the two you are asking about are certainly on hold. By the time it would be good to build they will likely come out with a new design. Not for sure or anything, but 5-10 years (min) is quite a period of time for a design to stay current.

Will likely be more profitable to sell that whole set of buildings to someone else to improve, as often happens from cycle to cycle... it will have turned into the anchor for an entirely transformed Centre St with the Bow, the Bow cultural centre, the Hyatt, the MArriott, and St Germain - there is inherient value there they can cash out on.


Claeren.

[kdoir345]

Originally Posted by Claeren

They missed the cycle on those.

As was said, they are already well into building a 3rd building on the south side of the tracks, but the two you are asking about are certainly on hold. By the time it would be good to build they will likely come out with a new design. Not for sure or anything, but 5-10 years (min) is quite a period of time for a design to stay current.

Will likely be more profitable to sell that whole set of buildings to someone else to improve, as often happens from cycle to cycle... it will have turned into the anchor for an entirely transformed Centre St with the Bow, the Bow cultural centre, the Hyatt, the MArriott, and St Germain - there is inherient value there they can cash out on.


Claeren.

I dont think theyve missed anything with those buildings, the whole complex is designed together, and like I said all three buildings are in the model with an updated cladding on One Palliser. The entire block is designed together so to change just those two doesnt seem to make much sense. The fact that they are on hold probably has more to do with not wanting to build on spec again like they did with Palliser South, since when they would be ready for occupancy so would numerous other new buildings.

[Claeren]

Originally Posted by kdoir345

I dont think theyve missed anything with those buildings, the whole complex is designed together, and like I said all three buildings are in the model with an updated cladding on One Palliser. The entire block is designed together so to change just those two doesnt seem to make much sense. The fact that they are on hold probably has more to do with not wanting to build on spec again like they did with Palliser South, since when they would be ready for occupancy so would numerous other new buildings.

I said they "missed the cycle" - not that the buildings themselves had missed. Building on spec is one thing/risk, building when the market for office space is shrinking in the face of millions of new sq-ft coming to market is an entirely different and more dramatic thing/risk.

I then merely speculated that by the time the market cycles back, years from now, the design THEN might need updating and that someone else entirely will likely buy it and want to put their own stamp/ego on it. (I see no aesthetic reason it couldn't happen either.)



Claeren.

[Muta]

Should be an interesting time in Calgary. There's a major Calgary resident possibly ready to shift locations (within the core), and that could mean... new development. In the meantime, watching the Bow go up will be fun.

[Clarkey]

Originally Posted by Muta

Should be an interesting time in Calgary. There's a major Calgary resident possibly ready to shift locations (within the core), and that could mean... new development. In the meantime, watching the Bow go up will be fun.

Which company?

[Muta]

Originally Posted by Clarkey

Which company?

I love to tell you, but I can't... contractual obligations and all.

[getbak]

Imperial has been heavily rumoured to be looking to build a new headquarters. Right now, they have staff spread across a few different buildings downtown (including the former Esso Plaza which they sold a few years ago when they were cutting back), and want to consolidate everything into one building. The rumour was that they were going to wait and see what Encana did and build something even bigger. Those rumours are a few years old now, so I don't know where things stand.

[Claeren]

Eighth Avenue Place (Penny Lane Towers) are going up on spec, so right there you have enough space for an Imperial or CNRL consolidation?

Both companies are notorious penny pinchers, in their own ways, relative to competitors so i can't see them building their own buildings when they can move into an (soon to be) existing complex?

Not sure who else it could be?

Both large and dispersed?



Claeren.

[Flames in 07]

Originally Posted by Claeren

Eighth Avenue Place (Penny Lane Towers) are going up on spec, so right there you have enough space for an Imperial or CNRL consolidation?

Not sure who else it could be?



Claeren.

Really I thought they were going to build up to the group then cap it off until they have a major tenant signed?

[Claeren]

Originally Posted by Flames in 07

Really I thought they were going to build up to the group then cap it off until they have a major tenant signed?

haha, wow, my own rumour coming back around....

Their PLAN is to find a major tenant by the time they are at the podium level and then proceed with the tower.

Their back-up (obviously i guess, but the point when the rumour was first under discussion at SSP is that they don't 'need' the best case scenario) would be to get to the podium and then mothball the rest until a tenant steps forward.

The only reason that was ever a rumour is that technicially if you start construciton in the city you are supposed to be planning on finishing it. IE: You could never get a permit (that includes tearing down Penny Lane) to build half a building. So to outwardly allow yourself that type of out is technically not allowed. But building something like that on spec, when such a large, conservative and careful developer is involved, is not done without back-up plans.


But regardless, if they found a tenant like Imperial or CNRL the problem is solved and no one knows what they would have done.

What are there chances of a big tenant coming forward in this business climate relative to all the other projects in the city though? 60%? 40%?




Claeren.

[Bill Bumface]

From what I remember hearing Penny Lane I was a go and Penny Lane II was on hold.

[I-Hate-Hulse]

We've taken space in Palliser South. Or as I call it, Mustard Seed NE. Lesseee.... lousy +15 access, no inside access to Eatons Center, crap for neighbors, no underground secure parking (in that neighborhood no less).... I raged for a good 3 hours when it was announced.

[kdoir345]

Originally Posted by I-Hate-Hulse

We've taken space in Palliser South. Or as I call it, Mustard Seed NE. Lesseee.... lousy +15 access, no inside access to Eatons Center, crap for neighbors, no underground secure parking (in that neighborhood no less).... I raged for a good 3 hours when it was announced.

Why?

Are you currently in the property moving over to Palliser South, or a new tenant?

[I-Hate-Hulse]

We'll be a new tenant, but I had a condo in the area for 4 years so I'm well aquainted with it. We're currently centrally located so no one's happy.

[chalms04]

http://www.calgaryherald.com/tower+b...#ixzz0t7fBewcv

Bow to become Calgary's tallest building between 2:30 and 3:30 today.

Suck it, Suncor Energy Centre!

[Azure]

Awesome.

Interesting that the article also mentions that there is 'unbelievable' interest in becoming a tenant.

Great to see.