China needs to chill out. Big time.

[HotHotHeat]

The past week has been an absolutely insane time in China. In just the past several days, the CCP has:

- Closed Mt. Everest to all tourist activity in lead up to the Olympics (Which is in Chinese controlled Tibet)
- Blocked Youtube to all internet users in China
- Called the Dalai Lama a criminal over his support of the peaceful Tibetan protests

China is stressing out. They're scared of anything that could even remotely taint their image on the world stage as we move closer to the Olympics. Problem is, this uptight attitude is getting them nowhere with their own people, or the world.

Of all that the CCP has done in the past days, the most concerning is a further censorship of the internet. Doesn't China realize that controlling expression and free thought within China is going to do them much more harm than good, as far as their worldwide image is concerned?

"This system of censorship is unparalleled anywhere in the world and is an insult to the spirit of online freedom," claims the report, "[and] with less than a year to go before the Beijing Olympics, there is an urgent need for the government to stop blocking thousands of websites, censoring online news and imprisoning Internet activists."

It seems like the harder they try to control the image of China, the more they oppress their own people. Not a winning combination. These olympics will be a historical show of embarrassment for China unless they change their tone.

[Wookie]

I can't believe they even got an Olympics in the first place.

[Ozy_Flame]

Were not the Moscow Olympics subject to similar scrutiny? This isn't the first time the IOC has made a puzzling decision like that.

[Russic]

Originally Posted by Wookie

I can't believe they even got an Olympics in the first place.

Exactly what I was thinking. The issue with Tibet is just one problem of many imo.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame

Were not the Moscow Olympics subject to similar scrutiny? This isn't the first time the IOC has made a puzzling decision like that.

Puzzling decision? I thought the whole point of both of these decisions was to give the host countries the opportunity to improve their image in the global community.

China: You're doing it wrong.

[Cowboy89]

^

Well what did you expect? How is this any different than the way China's always been for a couple of generations now with regards to political freedoms? In fact the whole 'reform' concept in China is an attempt to modernize the economy away from socialism, but while maintaining control and power. We've watched them shift from Communism to Facism in two decades. China's almost been given a free-ride during that time on Human rights/Political freedom because of their growing economic importance to the west and also due to their extensive efforts to manage their reputation abroad. This includes spying on former Chinese citizens abroad and "coercing" them not to speak bad of the country and attempting to influence Cantonese and Mandarin culture beyond their own borders.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Locke

Puzzling decision? I thought the whole point of both of these decisions was to give the host countries the opportunity to improve their image in the global community.

China: You're doing it wrong.

Maybe in your mind, but in terms of China, they're doing what they usually do. the decision makers have a very internalized view of how China works and does business. They don't care about international pressure or external influence, they still see themselves as the middle empire, and the absolute moral authority in that region of the world.

Thats why they continue to mow down Tiebet, and thats why they continue to threaten and posture with Tiawan.

They're right in what they do, everyone else is f$$ked up.

[Burninator]

Someone explain the whole Tibet thing to me. I'll admit I am quite ignorant to the whole situation, but why should I be in favour of "freeing" this country from communist rule so it can turn into a religious dictatorship?

[HotHotHeat]

CC,

Do they really not care about international pressure? I agree they still believe they're a moral authority, but in a globalized economy, how can you not care about international pressure?

The place is such a mess. Their banking system is a gong show of corruption and instability. The more we learn about how they operate the less I think we have to worry about in terms of NA and Europe losing it's status as the centre of the global economy.

[HotHotHeat]

Originally Posted by Burninator

Someone explain the whole Tibet thing to me. I'll admit I am quite ignorant to the whole situation, but why should I be in favour of "freeing" this country from communist rule so it can turn into a religious dictatorship?

First of all, Buddhism is hardly a 'religion'. It's defined as one, but it's more a set of mind. They don't believe (I think) in anything Supernatural. A Buddhist run state wouldn't be nearly as bad as 'holy states'.

I believe this uprising was caused by China accusing the Dalai Lama of trying to upstage the Olympics.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by HotHotHeat

CC,

Do they really not care about international pressure? I agree they still believe they're a moral authority, but in a globalized economy, how can you not care about international pressure?

The place is such a mess. Their banking system is a gong show of corruption and instability. The more we learn about how they operate the less I think we have to worry about in terms of NA and Europe losing it's status as the centre of the global economy.

I honestly believe what I posted.

If you look at their poor quality control in their export products. Their blatent theft of patents in terms of their high tech industry and their continual abuse of human rights then what I've said holds water.

If you want to do business with China, you do business on their terms, accept their payment terms, accept that the majority of their industry is run by their military and that you are going to have to accept a rather large trade imbalance.

They won't negotiate on any of those aspects at all.

To use the term supreme arrogance is an understatement.

[Reaper]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

They're right in what they do, everyone else is f$$ked up.

So, China is a 19 year old high school dropout?

[troutman]

Originally Posted by Burninator

Someone explain the whole Tibet thing to me. I'll admit I am quite ignorant to the whole situation, but why should I be in favour of "freeing" this country from communist rule so it can turn into a religious dictatorship?

I agree with a "Free Tibet", but I'm not sure a theocracy is the best thing for the Tibetans.

[FireFly]

Originally Posted by troutman

I agree with a "Free Tibet", but I'm not sure a theocracy is the best thing for the Tibetans.

Shouldn't Tibetans be the ones to decide that for themselves?

[iggypop]

Originally Posted by Locke

China: You're doing it wrong.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Maybe in your mind, but in terms of China, they're doing what they usually do. the decision makers have a very internalized view of how China works and does business. They don't care about international pressure or external influence, they still see themselves as the middle empire, and the absolute moral authority in that region of the world.

Thats why they continue to mow down Tiebet, and thats why they continue to threaten and posture with Tiawan.

They're right in what they do, everyone else is f$$ked up.

I understand that, I know where you're coming from and I agree with you completely.

My argument was; that in the context of the Olympics, its an opportunity being presented to China to improve their image.

And for the most part, the Olympics are a marketing slam-dunk, and China is screwing it up.

[Burninator]

Originally Posted by FireFly

Shouldn't Tibetans be the ones to decide that for themselves?

Well they want the world to help them so they can get their country back. But I don't want to help them unless they want Democracy. I'm not really interested in putting a Oligarchy (monk class) into power, religious or otherwise. And obviously they need someones help because they can't take on the super giant that is China by themselves.

[HotHotHeat]

Ultimately, this little uprising won't change a thing. A few thousand people will die (China will say it was 30 or 40), people will fear for their lives, and conform to the wishes of the CCP. Human rights for all!

[JimmytheT]

Originally Posted by HotHotHeat

First of all, Buddhism is hardly a 'religion'. It's defined as one, but it's more a set of mind. They don't believe (I think) in anything Supernatural. A Buddhist run state wouldn't be nearly as bad as 'holy states'.

I believe this uprising was caused by China accusing the Dalai Lama of trying to upstage the Olympics.

Not true. Buddhism is fundamentally built on the concept of reincarnation.

[troutman]

Originally Posted by FireFly

Shouldn't Tibetans be the ones to decide that for themselves?

Will they get a choice?

My mom has done a lot of charitable work for the Canadian Tibet Society, and has met the Dalai Lama a couple of times. One of our ancestors, Sir Francis Younghusband, explored Tibet for the British.

http://www.tibet.ca/en/newsroom/wtn/170

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_Younghusband

He served as British commissioner to Tibet from 1902-1904. In 1903-1904, under orders from the Viceroy of India, Lord Curzon, he, jointly with John Claude White, the Political Officer for Sikkim, led a military mission to Tibet as a result of disputes over the Sikkim-Tibet border; the mission controversially became a de facto invasion and British forces occupied Lhasa.[2] During this brutal campaign[2] on the way to Lhasa, Younghusband slaughtered 1,300 Tibetans in Gyangzê.[2] The British force was supported by King Ugyen Wangchuck of Bhutan, who was knighted in return for his services.

Penn & Teller on the Dalai Lama:

http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fu...ideoID=4328870

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christo...4th_Dalai_Lama

In 1998, Hitchens lambasted Tenzin Gyatso, 14th Dalai Lama for a number of reasons, including: the Dalai Lama's acceptance of "45 million rupees, or about 170 million yen" from Shoko Asahara the leader of the Supreme Truth cult which released sarin nerve gas in the Tokyo Subway system; the Dalai Lama's proclamation that Steven Seagal is "a reincarnated lama and a sacred vessel or 'tulku' of Tibetan Buddhism"; the persecution of "supporters of the Dorge Shugdendeity -- a 'Dharma protector' and an ancient object of worship and propitiation in Tibet -- [who] have been threatened with violence and ostracism and even death following the Dalai Lama's abrupt prohibition of this once-venerated godhead"; the Dalai Lama's specified sexual norms, which ban oral and anal sex, masturbation and explain the proper way to pay for prostitution; and, most importantly, the Dalai Lama's "support of the thermonuclear tests recently conducted by the Indian state."[9] Although, in contrast, the World Tibet Network News service later claimed that the Dalai Lama was "saddened to hear about the series of nuclear tests conducted by India," and was "fundamentally against the existence and stockpiling of any wapons [sic] of mass destruction."[10]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tenzin_...Lama#Criticism