Official 07/08 UEFA Champions League Discussion Thread - Page 4 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

jofillips · 03-11-2008, 09:11 AM

lol english players don't get it that bad! in fact missing penalties seems to benefit english players (+management) in the long run; stuart pearce, southgate, beckham...

far worse is to be colombian and then miss penalties (actually just losing is enough for death threats)

Locke · 03-11-2008, 12:28 PM

Liverpool vs. Inter. Here we go!

Locke · 03-11-2008, 02:54 PM

Oh man, Inter just got screwed. That was a pretty weak second yellow for Burdisso. Inter down to 10, yet again.

Thunderball · 03-11-2008, 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Locke

Oh man, Inter just got screwed. That was a pretty weak second yellow for Burdisso. Inter down to 10, yet again.

Doesn't bug me at all... the FIGC and Italian Refereeing Association roll out the red carpet for Inter at home. Gazzetta Dello Sport did a report on ref "errors," ambiguous spot kicks, and surprising overlooked penalties, and found that if games were reffed properly, Inter would not even be in first place.

In other words, Go Liverpool!

Locke · 03-11-2008, 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thunderball

Doesn't bug me at all... the FIGC and Italian Refereeing Association roll out the red carpet for Inter at home. Gazzetta Dello Sport did a report on ref "errors," ambiguous spot kicks, and surprising overlooked penalties, and found that if games were reffed properly, Inter would not even be in first place.

In other words, Go Liverpool!

This one is essentially in the books for Liverpool now.

Woohoo!!

CFENT · 03-11-2008, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thunderball

Doesn't bug me at all... the FIGC and Italian Refereeing Association roll out the red carpet for Inter at home. Gazzetta Dello Sport did a report on ref "errors," ambiguous spot kicks, and surprising overlooked penalties, and found that if games were reffed properly, Inter would not even be in first place.

In other words, Go Liverpool!

What happens in Serie A should not be an excuse for the UEFA ref to hand the game to Liverpool. I have noticed a lot of subpar reffing in the round of 16 so far.

Truthfully though, I blame the loss more on Inter's lack of finishing than a bad ref.

The better team lost today.

Locke · 03-11-2008, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CFENT

What happens in Serie A should not be an excuse for the UEFA ref to hand the game to Liverpool. I have noticed a lot of subpar reffing in the round of 16 so far.

Truthfully though, I blame the loss more on Inter's lack of finishing than a bad ref.

The better team lost today.

Inter have really not looked good at all in either of these Champions League games.

This red card was a bit of a raw deal, but Materazzi's in the first leg was pretty much unquestionable.

I'd have to say that Liverpool has been the better team in this series.

kdogg · 03-11-2008, 03:49 PM

Does anyone know when the next stag draw will be?
________
CHILD ZOLOFT

Thunderball · 03-11-2008, 04:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CFENT

What happens in Serie A should not be an excuse for the UEFA ref to hand the game to Liverpool. I have noticed a lot of subpar reffing in the round of 16 so far.

Truthfully though, I blame the loss more on Inter's lack of finishing than a bad ref.

The better team lost today.

It shouldn't be an excuse, its more karma. Get all the breaks at one level, get screwed at another.

Seriously, FIFA has a crisis emerging when it comes to officiating. Its affecting the credibility of the game globally.

jofillips · 03-12-2008, 10:10 AM

i agree thunderball - sepp blatters comments don't help either, he recently threatened players with criminal charges if they tackle and injure someone....

Thunderball · 03-12-2008, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jofillips

i agree thunderball - sepp blatters comments don't help either, he recently threatened players with criminal charges if they tackle and injure someone....

I think more often than not, its the leadership at the top of leagues, and main associations like FIFA that are part of the problem. They are afraid to take real steps to weed out foul play, corruption and incompetence.

Take Serie A for instance. Juventus (and to a lesser extent AC Milan, Lazio and Fiorentina) get hammered for apparently match-fixing (the Italian media was not convinced by the evidence or what they called a showtrial, but regardless) and were penalized (and in Juve's case relegated). Everyone is essentially back now and served their penalties, so status quo has resumed despite Juventus and Lazio being significantly weakened from the experience. Yet no actual regulations changed.

They claimed they purged football of these evil elements and that the game is now transparent and fair, but lo and behold, nothing changed. In fact, the Italian media now claims that this season has the largest discrepancy due to "referee error." Sure Juve, Milan, Fiorentina and Lazio were purged of some directors, but the main people in the league and the referee association are still there.

Rather than clean house and increase accountability... they make poor decisions and destroy credibility. Maybe no one actually fixed any games... maybe they just have a group of incompetent refs that get overwhelmed in big games? Perhaps local refs are biased to their beloved teams and either influence the game for them, or influence a different game to help them? Could it be the one big team owned by the same person who owns the phone company who found all the now illegal wire taps that somehow no one pointed any fingers at and "inherited" two league championships, despite being in third place both years was somehow responsible? Who knows? Because the administration at the top is so poorly run, any number of those things are possible as well as some other variables.

Italy is not the only example of this, it happens in most leagues... this situation is just the most topical and well-known, especially with Calciopoli occuring right after WC2006 and now Inter falling to "ref errors" in CL, but thriving on them in Serie A.

jofillips · 03-13-2008, 05:10 AM

italian football is notorious for paying off refs, from what i've read it was common-practice in the 90's and i guess hasn't changed a bit.
Add-on to this the behaviour of their fans, and you can't help but think how much FIFA protects the serie A.
Italy is without doubt the 'sickman' of europe right now, none of their teams should be in any european competition right now...

If even ONE of those charges was levelled at the premiership, british clubs would be banned from europe for five years in a flash - thats why i hate sepp blatter, he seems to have utter hatred for british football and only wants to protect the 'stars'.

oh, and as far as i know pretty much none of the italian teams were relegated: the way the charges were brought down to nothing over about 2 months was incredibly indicative of how corrupt italian football is.

VANFLAMESFAN · 03-13-2008, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kdogg

Does anyone know when the next stag draw will be?

Quarter and Semi draw is on Friday morning our time.

Thunderball · 03-13-2008, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jofillips

italian football is notorious for paying off refs, from what i've read it was common-practice in the 90's and i guess hasn't changed a bit.
Add-on to this the behaviour of their fans, and you can't help but think how much FIFA protects the serie A.
Italy is without doubt the 'sickman' of europe right now, none of their teams should be in any european competition right now...

If even ONE of those charges was levelled at the premiership, british clubs would be banned from europe for five years in a flash - thats why i hate sepp blatter, he seems to have utter hatred for british football and only wants to protect the 'stars'.

oh, and as far as i know pretty much none of the italian teams were relegated: the way the charges were brought down to nothing over about 2 months was incredibly indicative of how corrupt italian football is.

The charges were brought down because they were absolutely ridiculous. None of the teams were deemed guilty of Section 6 (proven match-fixing, bribery or foulplay)... they were deemed guilty on Section 1 (suspicion of foul play and unsportsmanlike conduct). The maximum penalty for this is supposed to be a fine and point penalties. Rather, they relegated three teams, one down TWO divisions, with massive point penalties. Naturally, the appeal court had to reduce them, lest the whole thing be thrown out on a misapplication of the Sporting Laws. Juventus was still punished severely for a Section 1 violation, having been relegated, stripped of two titles (that is apparently back in courts), and having a 17 point penalty in Serie B (and still winning that league without half their stars).

Its notorious for allegations of paying off refs, but there are only two cases where it was proven. Once in the 1980s, and once with Genoa in 2005.

Its also important to note that its not just Italy... England, Spain, Germany and France have all had allegations of foul play and proven allegations of foul play. There was a BBC report in 2006 that 6-8 Premiership managers would (or possibly have already) accepted "illegal payments" (bribes) for favorable player transfers. There are allegations in Spain that Real Madrid has favored referees, but the liga refuses to take action at risk of destroying the league's credibility. France has had ref bribing scandals, and Germany had a proven one in the 1970s, and insider betting just recently.

As for Italy getting special treatment... its interesting to note that when Juventus threatened to take the FIGC to civil court over the allegations and punishment, that is when UEFA threatened to pull Italy and its member clubs from all European competitions for five years. Essentially making Juve Italy's most hated club forever and restoring their honor, or taking the hit for Italy and stability.

Funny they don't want foulplay, but when a team tries to air everybody's dirty laundry in a binding legal court... they freak out.

Liverpool got a nice favor from UEFA by being allowed to defend their title... so I wouldn't say they're completely biased against England.

I think where we'll agree is that its the responsibility of UEFA and FIFA to crackdown on foul play in a strong way, as well as the football associations... especially when there's suspicion of cronyism and bias at those levels. However, Blatter and Platini are not exactly the types that can do this... especially Blatter.

Pagal4321 · 03-14-2008, 09:23 AM

Arsenal vs. Liverpool
Manchester United vs. Roma
Chelsea vs. Fenerbahce
Barcelona vs. Schalke

Ohhh, Arsenal vs. Liverpool will create quite the havoc in my house!!

united · 03-14-2008, 09:26 AM

Well hopefully we can replicate our performance against Roma at Old Trafford last year...one can dream

As much as I would have enjoyed crushing Fenerbache or knocking out the scousers I think Roma is a good match up for us and see us going through.

Jagger · 03-14-2008, 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by united

Well hopefully we can replicate our performance against Roma at Old Trafford last year...one can dream

As much as I would have enjoyed crushing Fenerbache or knocking out the scousers I think Roma is a good match up for us and see us going through.

Just think how you would have felt when Liverpool knocked you lot out instead though. Not pretty eh! That would have added a new wrinkle to the 18+4 chants.......

Saving the meeting until the final is better in any case!

Locke · 03-14-2008, 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pagal4321

Arsenal vs. Liverpool
Manchester United vs. Roma
Chelsea vs. Fenerbahce
Barcelona vs. Schalke

Ohhh, Arsenal vs. Liverpool will create quite the havoc in my house!!

I'm okay with the Arsenal draw. I knew that Liverpool would get another English team, but its okay. I think in Champions League Action the Reds are up for it.

Based on watching most of the Italian teams lately, I think Man U gets off easy with the Roma draw, but maybe they'll bring their A game and make a fight out of it.

Barca should roll over Schalke without too much trouble.

I look forward to Fener dropping Chelsea. I dont think Chelsea can handle a team with the intensity of Fenerbahce.

As much as I dont really like Italian teams, I hope Roma knocks out Man U. Fener beating Chelsea is do-able.

Schalke is pretty much screwed.

Liverpool can take Arsenal, it just depends on which Liverpool team turns up.

Pagal4321 · 03-14-2008, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Locke

Liverpool can take Arsenal, it just depends on which Liverpool team turns up.

Now that's where your post went alll wrong!!

Jagger · 03-14-2008, 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pagal4321

Now that's where your post went alll wrong!!

Ha! No he was entirely correct, it all depends which team turns up. Liverpool can beat anybody on their day. Trouble is, they can also lose to anybody too, as witnessed by the might of Barnsley.

I fancy that Arsenal are in for a heck of a battle. Torres is on a different level now.