How do we overcome voter apathy?

[ken0042]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

I see why you think you should vote. I don't see why you think I should vote.

Do I vote on platform? Promises? Their resume?
To that response, as I stated before, the majority of parties tow the center line to capture more votes. Promises are worthless since they never carry through.

Then pick one issue and vote based on that. In post #144 I outlined my reasons for voting the way I did based on one issue; auto insurance. I would be willing to bet that more than 90% of us drive, and more than 99% of us ride in motor vehicles or walk down the street. In that case that issue should apply to you.

And that issue has the potential to cost people hundreds of dollars per year as a best case scenario; tens of thousands for worst case. All based upon a policy.

[kermitology]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

Why? Give me a reason. Hopefully more substance besides "if you don't vote, you should be a lab rate."

There is always going to be an issue in your riding that one of the party representatives is going to have a stand on that impacts you. You have to take the time to figure that out.

Democracy only REALLY works if we take it seriously. If you leave it up to other people, like you've said you would, then you reject your ability to have a choice. Democracy is about giving you a choice of options. In my opinion being too lazy to give a crap about making a choice is not what democracy is about.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally Posted by FanIn80

If you think me not voting out of protest is a problem, maybe someday we can discuss the effects of mindless sheep all lining up to be a part of the problem simply because it's their "responsibility" to vote. Perhaps if only 2% turned up to vote in the next election, we might see an overhaul in the political system.

You can't be bothered to do the bare minimum and the people who do are the mindless sheep? How do you figure?

How do you see this overhaul working? When the population willingly gives all the power to a very small group of determined people they usually don't like to give it back. You'd prefer things to be that way?

Protest non-vote my ass. Did you know the candidates names?

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by ken0042

Then pick one issue and vote based on that. In post #144 I outlined my reasons for voting the way I did based on one issue; auto insurance. I would be willing to bet that more than 90% of us drive, and more than 99% of us ride in motor vehicles or walk down the street. In that case that issue should apply to you.

And that issue has the potential to cost people hundreds of dollars per year as a best case scenario; tens of thousands for worst case. All based upon a policy.

Is that voting for the sake of voting?

As a voter who does have vested interests, how do you feel about a another voter(s) with far less vested interest to be voting with a similar vote weight?

[Salt Water Cowboy #10]

maybe we could vote by having someone go door to door with a ballet for each resident. Then all those people that were too lazy or didn't care could submit a vote. Though I'm not sure it would affect the overall outcome anyway.

Many people are turned off voting for such reasons as:

1. we've been lied to in the past by both major parties involved.

2. we've had $ scammed by corrupt greedy politicians.

3. corrupt greedy politicians don't end up going to jail for stealing our $. Even though we as citizens surely would if we had done the same crime.

[redforever]

Originally Posted by Salt Water Cowboy #10

maybe we could vote by having someone go door to door with a ballet for each resident. Then all those people that were too lazy or didn't care could submit a vote. Though I'm not sure it would affect the overall outcome anyway.

Many people are turned off voting for such reasons as:

1. we've been lied to in the past by both major parties involved.

2. we've had $ scammed by corrupt greedy politicians.

3. corrupt greedy politicians don't end up going to jail for stealing our $. Even though we as citizens surely would if we had done the same crime.

Well, it is my opinion that while some of that might have been true in the past, both federally and provincially, not much of that is true anymore, times are changing and everyone is asked to be accountable, you and I, our financial institutions, big business, politics, there is a demand for accountablity now.

Lots of politicians, executives of major companies etc are now either in jail or headed to jail for their misuse of funds, power, whatever.

And it is my opinion that most politicians are honorable people, the vast majority. At least I prefer to look at it that way. I think it is yet another cop out to say, oh they are all corrupt, and things wont change anyhow.

It is up to YOU to make politicians accountable. Yes, they should be accountable automatically, but some are not, that is part of the human failing. If you do not exercise YOUR powers to make them accountable, then all of the things that you are concerned about will continue. If everyone takes the mindset that I can do nothing, leave it up to the next guy, then how do you ever expect to see change?

And here is some earth shattering news. Change usually takes time, lots of time, especially at the national level. But you know what? When the citizens get fed up, change comes quickly.

You sound fed up. Why aren't you exercising YOUR POWERS to force changes? Yeah right, we should do all your work for you and you will just sit there and say, I am not inspired, nothing will change anyhow, they are all corrupt and it will go on forever.

[FanIn80]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

You can't be bothered to do the bare minimum and the people who do are the mindless sheep? How do you figure?

How do you see this overhaul working? When the population willingly gives all the power to a very small group of determined people they usually don't like to give it back. You'd prefer things to be that way?

Protest non-vote my ass. Did you know the candidates names?

For future reference, the term "mindless sheep" does not usually refer to well-informed and decisioned people. It does refer to people who line up to fill in an empty ballot with whomever they think is prettier, handsomer, dresses cooler, smokes more pot or isn't the scariest - all because they feel it's their responsibility to vote. Those are the people that I am speaking of.

As for the rest of it, you've done what the politicians do: you've neglected to actually discuss my issue, instead opting for pointing fingers, side-stepping the issue and hoping to illicit a positive backing from other like-minded people.

By the way, please don't confuse my lack of tact or my penchant for bluntness as any kind of a personal attack. I am only attacking (in my opinion) what I see is the primary problem with our political system.


...and how can I not know the candidate's names when they call me every night at supper time to ask for my support?

[JohnnyFlame]

Pretty simple. I've been around long enough to find them nothing but out and out liars. They are full of crap saying whatever it is they need to get elected. Then padding their pockets and their buddies once they are in. IMO it's not those who don't vote that are slow. It's those who keep getting taken in with the same bulldung.

Could anything be a bigger waste of time? PT Barnum had it right!!!!

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally Posted by FanIn80

Look, here's my point:

If either party were to just focus on identifying relevant issues and then communicating valid solutions, I would vote for them in a second. Instead, we get Liberals focusing on what PC has done wrong and PC focusing on what Liberals would do wrong if they got in.

Okay, this simply is not true. Sure they point fingers, but every party dropped something in my mailbox that went far beyond "they suck and we don't".

Originally Posted by FanIn80

It's like politics isn't even about the issues anymore, it's all about blame and popularity. It's a frickin sport now. It’s a competition. I hear things all the time on the radio about how Party B will challenge Party A's proposal because it's a smart political move that will give them a better chance of gaining power in the next election. What the heck happened to not supporting it because it's not a very good proposal? Even better, what happened to actually supporting it because it's a good proposal, even though it'll cause you to lose power in the next election?! When did everything they do start to be more about winning and losing than about the actual issues themselves? More importantly, when did it become our "responsibility" to accept this version of a "Democratic" society?

It's not your responsibility to accept this version of a democratic society, but it is your responsibility to try to get it changed if you don't like it. You've made a perfectly valid complaint about the state of things but instead of doing anything about it you ignore it. The more you ignore it the more it won't go away. It'll get worse, because as far as anyone can tell you are happy with the way things are. If you weren't happy, you'd vote. But instead of taking advantage of the one simple and free opportunity to make any statement, you don't say anything.

[Bring_Back_Shantz]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

Is that voting for the sake of voting?

As a voter who does have vested interests, how do you feel about a another voter(s) with far less vested interest to be voting with a similar vote weight?

The part that blows me away about your attitude is that you don't seem to think you have a vested interest.

Do you pay taxes?
Do you use public roads?
Do you go to school, or do you have children that go to school?
Do you have any thoughts about how we should be treating the environment?

If you answered yes to any of these questions then you do have a vested interest, and should make at least a little effort to pick a side.

[FanIn80]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

It's not your responsibility to accept this version of a democratic society, but it is your responsibility to try to get it changed if you don't like it. You've made a perfectly valid complaint about the state of things but instead of doing anything about it you ignore it. The more you ignore it the more it won't go away. It'll get worse, because as far as anyone can tell you are happy with the way things are. If you weren't happy, you'd vote. But instead of taking advantage of the one simple and free opportunity to make any statement, you don't say anything.

Now there's an excellent point. This was the first time I've ever opted to not vote, and your point has reminded me of why I've voted every other time but this one.

See? Sometimes message boards really aren't the debil.

[mac_gurl]

I didn't vote, because last time I went to vote it was very un-organized. It took us nearly 2 hours to vote. Until they change the way things are done at my polling station, i doubt I will be back soon.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally Posted by mac_gurl

I didn't vote, because last time I went to vote it was very un-organized. It took us nearly 2 hours to vote. Until they change the way things are done at my polling station, i doubt I will be back soon.

Where do you live? I've voted in a few different places in Calgary/Alberta and I've never even had to stand in line.

[Mickey76]

I vote when it might actually matter or I feel strongly about a particular person or issue. For instance I ALWAYS vote in municipal elections. Our county councilors pass or do not pass by-laws that affect my life and living in a rural area there can often be less than 300-400 votes total. Wouldn't miss one of those. I also voted in the PC party election because I strongly believed in Ted Morton. If I lived in the US I would have gone out and voted for Ron Paul in the primaries. However the idea that I am "protecting democracy" is laughable. The parties are free to break election promises (they all do, libs cons independents), break constitutional laws, and be outright crooks and they get away with it. Thinking your vote will change any of that is naive. So why bother. Especially in the parliamentary system where essentially your vote doesn't count. A conservative vote in Quebec or a NDP vote in Alberta is a wasted vote. If there was a system where the whole country voted and each party got a directly proportional # of seats to the number of votes they had I would get out in every election.

On a more positive vote that fact that so few people go out and vote can be interpreted as a positive. For all the griping we do things are great in this country and that fact has been true wether we have had liberal or conservative governments. Our country is so great even Trudeau, Mulrony and Chretien couldn't destroy it. That is truly amazing.

One final note It absolutely drives me crazy this "just get out and vote" nonsense. The notion that a crackhead marking an X beside names he doesn't know and doesn't care about is somehow good I don't understand.

[dubc80]

Originally Posted by Bring_Back_Shantz

The part that blows me away about your attitude is that you don't seem to think you have a vested interest.

Do you pay taxes?
Do you use public roads?
Do you go to school, or do you have children that go to school?
Do you have any thoughts about how we should be treating the environment?

If you answered yes to any of these questions then you do have a vested interest, and should make at least a little effort to pick a side.

I've read through this whole thread. Interesting discussion!

I think the post above (and the one with the car insurance example) illustrates why people do not vote. It's because they have trouble relating the parties and various platforms to the potential impact it may have on their everyday life.

People in general are very un-educated on politics. Global News did a survey on Stephen Ave and very few people could recognize the faces of the party leaders. If they cannot recognize the faces, do you think they will know what "left wing" and "right wing" is, and the associated differences? Do you think they will go do research to find out what the PC party platform is, or what NDP's stance on the O&G royalty regime is? HELL NO!!! Thus, people don't show up at the polls. They don't know, don't care!

I think if they could link how a change in political party will have an impact on people's every day lives, voter turnout would increase.

A facetious example:
eg) PC party has "x" stance on auto insurance and liability claims. If they remain in power, your auto insurance will increase to "X" dollars in 2010 and if you get rear ended on the Deerfoot next winter, the max you can get is X dollars.

eg) Liberals have a "y" stance on auto insurance and liability claims. If they get majority vote, your auto insurance will increase to X dollars in 2010 and if you get rear ended on the Deerfoot next winter, the max you can get is X dollars.

Ridiculous example, but I think you know what I'm getting at.

To increase voter turnout, someone needs to "dumb things down" about 900 notches so the everyday Joe pays attention and can relate.

[FlamesAddiction]

Maybe instead of just voting for the party that you want to form the government, you could also vote for the party that you hate the most. Then when they tally up the votes, they could find the party that Canadians find the least offensive to the majority of people, and give the leader of that party a high-up government position, like Speaker or Governor General.

[ken0042]

Originally Posted by Mickey76

One final note It absolutely drives me crazy this "just get out and vote" nonsense. The notion that a crackhead marking an X beside names he doesn't know and doesn't care about is somehow good I don't understand.

Who said anything about getting the crackheads out to vote? We're talking about people we know, people we talk to every day.

About 59% of the elligible voters did not vote. I seriously doubt that a significant percentage of those non-voters are the crackheads you speak of.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by Bring_Back_Shantz

The part that blows me away about your attitude is that you don't seem to think you have a vested interest.

Do you pay taxes?
Do you use public roads?
Do you go to school, or do you have children that go to school?
Do you have any thoughts about how we should be treating the environment?

If you answered yes to any of these questions then you do have a vested interest, and should make at least a little effort to pick a side.

No
I take the bus once a week, does that count? I cross the road to school too. (I did drive a couple months ago, but no enough to have any opinion.)
I go to the university, not as big of an issue.
No

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

No
I take the bus once a week, does that count? I cross the road to school too. (I did drive a couple months ago, but no enough to have any opinion.)
I go to the university, not as big of an issue.
No

What exactly do you learn at this university?

Every party has different ideas about how to fund post-secondary. One of them even wanted a cap on tuition. Is that an issue for a university student, or is that something else you don't care about?

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

What exactly do you learn at this university?

Every party has different ideas about how to fund post-secondary. One of them even wanted a cap on tuition. Is that an issue for a university student, or is that something else you don't care about?

I have no opinion on a capped tuition either. Unless they raised it by over 20% (extreme values) I don't have an argument to raising tuition.