British Columbia adopts ambitious Carbon Tax

[Wookie]

Sweet, hopefully BC people drive less, use less gas thus making it less expensive for me to drive my SUV!

[Wookie]

Originally Posted by Hack&Lube

To be honest, it's quite elitist, the condescending attitude that global warming and carbon regulation activists have toward alternative views. The attitude is often presumptive and self-righteous to the point of a religious squabble where one side thinks they are absolutely right (global warming activists) and that everybody else is ignorant or greedy or reckless about the environment when it is not so. They are just using reason and thinking for themselves to question something foisted upon them in the mainstream that is still very grey in the area of science...to the point where governments seeking easy policies and political support direct more funding and voice to those scientists that support this cause while opposing scientists are silenced.

I find the whole idea of being enthusiastic about carbon regulation and paying more taxes and fees for credits and carbon use to governments is absolutely preposterous. What makes them authorities on this issue? What guarantees they will spend that income properly or that it will curb usage? What benefit does it bring to one jurisdiction of people? It only increases the economic disparity between zones. This is an emergent field and it is unpredictable.

[Table 5]

Good on B.C. for taking the initiative. I know most conservatives like MelBridgeman simply refuse to even look into the details of such a thing because it's easier to stick your head in the sand, but in the end all it's making people responsible for their actions.

this is simple pay to play....you want to drive that big SUV...go nuts, but atleast this way you will pay your share of the burden you create. people who take the bus are paying their share. do drivers think that road infrastructure is not massively subsidized? In the US, a gas tax covers only FIVE percent of keeping up the roadway network. The rest comes from general taxes. Talk about subsidizing! Doesn't sound like a conservative mindset to me!

[MelBridgeman]

Originally Posted by Table 5

Good on B.C. for taking the initiative. I know most conservatives like MelBridgeman simply refuse to even look into the details of such a thing because it's easier to stick your head in the sand, but in the end all it's making people responsible for their actions.

this is simple pay to play....you want to drive that big SUV...go nuts, but atleast this way you will pay your share of the burden you create. people who take the bus are paying their share. do drivers think that road infrastructure is not massively subsidized? In the US, a gas tax covers only FIVE percent of keeping up the roadway network. The rest comes from general taxes. Talk about subsidizing! Doesn't sound like a conservative mindset to me!

Right cause the only people who gets tagged with the higher tax, is buddy in his SUV, but in the bigger picture its a horrible idea, that will not do what it is intended to do, in the long run...oh wait..it will offset the high costs of the Olympics, so maybe it will...conservative, ha nice assumption...

[Dan02]

Originally Posted by Table 5

In the US, a gas tax covers only FIVE percent of keeping up the roadway network. The rest comes from general taxes. Talk about subsidizing! Doesn't sound like a conservative mindset to me!

Weird, i live in Canada. Any chance you might know the % of roadways maintainence/infrastructure that is covered by our gas taxes in Canada?

[Wookie]

Why should the amount of gas your car uses have anything to do with taxes that pay for infrastructure?

I don't see my car using the road anymore than a prius.

[Table 5]

Originally Posted by MelBridgeman

Right cause the only people who gets tagged with the higher tax, is buddy in his SUV, but in the bigger picture its a horrible idea, that will not do what it is intended to do, in the long run...oh wait..it will offset the high costs of the Olympics, so maybe it will...conservative, ha nice assumption...

Mel, you're starting to ramble. how about you put a few coherent thoughts together and then come back. Is this olympics rant really the only thing you have got to put forward? The Carbon Tax is a world-wide call to action supported by a lot of people out there...is everyone holding a fricking olympics or something?

Stick with the topic at hand. Please tell me how driving today is not a subsidized activity already. Aren't conservatives like yourself enemies of subsidizing?

[Table 5]

Originally Posted by Wookie

Why should the amount of gas your car uses have anything to do with taxes that pay for infrastructure?

I don't see my car using the road anymore than a prius.

You're right, a Prius takes up just as much roadspace as a Hummer, and should be taxed accordingly as well. I'm not a huge believer in hybrid's changing the world because in the end, they still require the same road. We have to work to make transportation more efficient and encourage other forms of transportation for people (ie, make public transportation dirt cheap etc)

However, a prius still releases quite a bit less carbon emissions then that Hummer, and in the end, causes a smaller carbon footprint on our planet. It takes energy to drill, process, transport all that oil don't forget.

[Wookie]

Originally Posted by Table 5

You're right, a Prius takes up just as much roadspace as a Hummer, and should be taxed accordingly as well. I'm not a huge believer in hybrid's changing the world because in the end, they still require the same road. In the end, we have to work to make transportation more efficient (ie, push public transportation etc)

However, a prius still releases quite a bit less carbon emissions, and in the end, causes a smaller carbon footprint on our planet. It takes energy to drill, process, transport all that oil don't forget.

Oh yeah, I completely agree with that!

[Bend it like Bourgeois]

Originally Posted by Dan02

Weird, i live in Canada. Any chance you might know the % of roadways maintainence/infrastructure that is covered by our gas taxes in Canada?

Considering the bulk of that goes to the feds, who in turn spend close to nothing...the answer is ...close to nothing.

[Table 5]

They key is to make sure that gas-tax goes to a good cause. For example, I would take a good chunk of that gas-tax money, and subsidize the public transport system....build more train lines, more frequent service...and make them dirt cheap (as opposed to what Calgary Transit is doing and raise rates for passengers, who cause way less strain on our infrastructure). We need to make the earth-friendly modes of transportation stupidly attractive.

[Bend it like Bourgeois]

Originally Posted by fotze

The last two points are the most important, as long as the government doesn't touch a penny of it, is a big step in the right direction. i.e. spending it 100% on actual reduction problems.

Given the BC governments celebrated history of effective spending this ought to be a slam dunk.

Everyone in BC should drive out to the old Mag Can plant in high river and see what's going to be under their christmas tree.

[MelBridgeman]

Originally Posted by Table 5

Mel, you're starting to ramble. how about you put a few coherent thoughts together and then come back. Is this olympics rant really the only thing you have got to put forward? The Carbon Tax is a world-wide call to action supported by a lot of people out there...is everyone holding a fricking olympics or something?

Stick with the topic at hand. Please tell me how driving today is not a subsidized activity already. Aren't conservatives like yourself enemies of subsidizing?

Why can't you lefties stop the name calling everytime you encounter someone who doesnt like your opinion...its like taking candy from a little kid.

Taxation is not a solution. It never will be and it never has been. The GST was introduced to pay down the national debt...that debt has risen.

Cutting carbon is a global issue, having a carbon tax in BC is not going to do a damn thing to solve anything.

[Calgaryborn]

Originally Posted by Table 5

They key is to make sure that gas-tax goes to a good cause. For example, I would take a good chunk of that gas-tax money, and subsidize the public transport system....build more train lines, more frequent service...and make them dirt cheap (as opposed to what Calgary Transit is doing and raise rates for passengers, who cause way less strain on our infrastructure). We need to make the earth-friendly modes of transportation stupidly attractive.

You live in the city don't you?

Why should your cost for taking a bus be subsidized by some senior on a fixed income who has to drive 5 or 6 hours to get the same medical care you enjoy at no extra cost?

The fact is that Canada is a big country. Traveling is a necessary part of life and business. This tax will increase the cost of every product moving through B.C. and the largest effect will be felt in the interior.

If the pulp mill in Skookumchuck can't afford the extra cost of transporting wood chips in and their product out they will close down and their carbon imprint will be gone. Not forever however. A pulp mill will be built somewhere in South America with a greater initial and on going impact on the environment. Good paying jobs are lost in B.C. Poor paying and dangerous jobs are created in South America. The same loss of trees occur in B.C. as before but, what would have gone to wood chips now go for hog fuel{burnt to generate electricity) and the price of a 2by4 goes up to make up the considerable loss of revenue from the chips. South America cuts trees down to feed their pulp mill and unlike B.C. don't replant. I don't see the positives here.

[flamey_mcflame]

Originally Posted by Calgaryborn

I hate my government!

This money will be going into general revenues like all the rest. They will plant s few million trees and point to that as offsetting carbon but, the truth is those trees would have to been planted anyways because of the pine beetle. They will feed some of our taxes to green companies who in turn will finance the liberals when the provincial elections come around. They will give themselves raises.

One day the earth will start to cool and not because of the B.C. government but, because that is how the weather goes: In cycles. When that day comes and this sham is over all that will remain is the taxes.

Ironicly I was just commenting to a friend today how nice it was that the government was starting to give families a little relief. The rising personal exemptions and the addition of ones for kids have been nice to see. The fitness tax credit for kids and child care expenses deduction has helped as well. Now the provincal government comes along and "offsets" any benefit the federal government has given.

MOD EDIT: Removed needless off topic taunting.

In terms of cycles, you should really research how timespans work. Ice ages and Global warming happen over thousands of years unless there is a catastrophic event(i.e. large meteors, major volcanoes). And go to a greenhouse and ask the owner how he/she can keep the temperature so warm there. Billions of people consuming an ever-increasing amount of resources is a variable that 94 percent of the IPCC has a significant effect on the environment. You have heard of scientists right??, the people who are much smarter than you or I. They actually conduct tests and do research on these things. However, we may not fear at all, God might come and move us to a new planet where everything is pristine and clean.

[flamey_mcflame]

Wow, was doing some research on youtube, and I found the the truly definitive statement on global warming. Check out what this authority has to say on global warming. Case closed.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=RSsJ19sy3JI

[Cube Inmate]

I know it's a futile effort, but as long as governments keep trying to tax us into submission, I'll do my best to burn my campfires as HOT and SMOKY as possible. How much CO2 is released by burning 150 pounds of birch??

Can't wait until they add a "campfire tax" to my campground fees...or an "outhouse tax" to offset all the methane produced by my ... processed steak.

[Agamemnon]

Interesting idea, I can't wait to see how it works out. Seems like a step in the right direction!

[burn_baby_burn]

This is a tax grab plain and simple. The tree hugging commies in BC will applaud it as their government is a world leader in reducing emissions and thus the leaders in saving the world from global warming. The provincial government is just using a popular trendy theme as an excuse to steal more money from its citizens.

[Table 5]

Originally Posted by MelBridgeman

Why can't you lefties stop the name calling everytime you encounter someone who doesnt like your opinion...its like taking candy from a little kid.

ok, mel, show me one example where i called you a name. you're still just rambling on with your cliches and not adding any sort of substance.

Cutting carbon is a global issue, having a carbon tax in BC is not going to do a damn thing to solve anything.

ok, so how about you propose some solutions if you don't like this one. It's easy enough to not do anything and complain about it...but what would you do to cut carbon emissions?