Valentine's Day thread

[GreatWhiteEbola]

Originally Posted by Flameschick

Actually, they do know the score and they're cool with it. They do the same thing, as do most guys I imagine which is ok.

Don't see what the problem is. Maybe it's a generational thing?

Maybe a geographical thing? Wait your not from Bountiful... NM.

[Flameschick]

Originally Posted by GreatWhiteEbola

I know I wouldn't want to be one of "those guys". When men do it they're called philanderers. When women do it the are called...

Lol, seriously, I love the hypocrisy. Really, it's perfectly fine for either gender to partake in such a lifestyle as far as I'm concerned. I'm never going to have a problem with a guy checking out some other gal when I'm with him as long as he's the same way with me checking out other guys. It's a natural instinct to always be on the lookout for something better/different. Anyways, I find only older/religious/insecure/jealous people seem to have a problem with that kind of attitude/lifestyle.

[GreatWhiteEbola]

Originally Posted by Flameschick

Lol, seriously, I love the hypocrisy. Really, it's perfectly fine for either gender to partake in such a lifestyle as far as I'm concerned. I'm never going to have a problem with a guy checking out some other gal when I'm with him as long as he's the same way with me checking out other guys. It's a natural instinct to always be on the lookout for something better/different. Anyways, I find only older/religious/insecure/jealous people seem to have a problem with that kind of attitude/lifestyle.

My friends and family think I'm a philanderer, but when I start having a sexual relationship I stop dating others. I think that you, Flameschick, may be missing out on finding the man who can be your hangout, sex, and social event man by dividing your time with one dimensional men.

BTW I'm recently single so what do I know.

[FireFly]

Originally Posted by Flameschick

I don't get the concept of "serious" dating or monogamy. Myself and most of my girl friends have 2-3 guys that we "see" and we flip through them depending on what mood we're in: 1 guy to escort us to a function; another for nooky; another to just chill with, etc. Why latch on to one guy? It's like buying a car and holding on to it when you know a newer and better model is going to come out next year. You have fun with it, then dump it or exchange it and move on when something better comes along.

Plus, it's inevitable that your gf/bf/husband/wife cheats or at least is in the stage before that happens where she or he finds herself/himself attracted to someone else and wishes she/he were with that person. Don't think they should be penalized for that. It's human nature to be curious and experiment. The only people who view seeing more than one person as immoral are those who have a rather naive pristine view of what a relationship should entail and take the concept way too seriously. That's my early-to-mid 20's Gen-Y take on things anyway.

This reminds me of a song actually...

However, what if you find a guy you want to escort you, chill with and have nooky with? That's the idea of a relationship... It's inevitable that eyes wander, that doesn't mean you have to cheat. It's not a Gen-Y thing, it's pessimistic.

Back to the topic at hand though... I'd rather cook a meal together and chill on the couch with a bottle of wine and a movie than 'get' anything for Valentine's Day. Flowers are best when they're least expected.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by Flameschick

Actually, they do know the score and they're cool with it. They do the same thing, as do most guys I imagine which is ok.

Don't see what the problem is. Maybe it's a generational thing?

I doubt it, seeing as how I'm 21. I'm not saying it's wrong because quite frankly I've always been the type to downplay monogamy and such. It really depends on the person you're with. The other part that bothers me is there's a bit of a double-standard with my girlfriend. If I so much as make a joke about a menage a trois, I get a very disapproving look, but yet she doesn't seem to get why I don't want a guy she used to fool around with staying at her house for a week while I'm out of town.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by FireFly

However, what if you find a guy you want to escort you, chill with and have nooky with? That's the idea of a relationship...

Exactly. FireFly put it in way better words than I could've.

[Flameschick]

Well, chacun a so gout, I guess, but 50% of marriages end in divorce with by far the most frequent reason given being cheating. You then have to wonder why marriage and long-term relationships are held in such esteem when they come with a built-in flaw: the expectation of monogamy which is unrealistic. It's like expecting priests to be celibate.

Another issue is a lot of people only view themselves as being socially worthy if they're in a relationship. Seems like they view it as more a personal accomplishment, something they can brag about to their friends, or a marker of self-worth than of a union of two souls or whatever esoteric ideal society views it as being. It's not much different than guys in an internet forum bragging about how many girls they've scored. You're "coolness" or social worth if you've scored a lot goes up in the eyes of your peers. Yay...

Anyway, to me it's a choice between being single and free to shop around versus being constrained by someone else's unrealistic expectations. My 20-something girlfriends and I at least definitely subscribe to being in the former state more than the latter, and I'm sure most girls and guys, and judging by the skyrocketing divorce rates, even the married ones, do as well.

[Cowboy89]

Originally Posted by Flameschick

I don't get the concept of "serious" dating or monogamy. Myself and most of my girl friends have 2-3 guys that we "see" and we flip through them depending on what mood we're in: 1 guy to escort us to a function; another for nooky; another to just chill with, etc. Why latch on to one guy? It's like buying a car and holding on to it when you know a newer and better model is going to come out next year. You have fun with it, then dump it or exchange it and move on when something better comes along.

Plus, it's inevitable that your gf/bf/husband/wife cheats or at least is in the stage before that happens where she or he finds herself/himself attracted to someone else and wishes she/he were with that person. Don't think they should be penalized for that. It's human nature to be curious and experiment. The only people who view seeing more than one person as immoral are those who have a rather naive pristine view of what a relationship should entail and take the concept way too seriously. That's my early-to-mid 20's Gen-Y take on things anyway.

Very good angle Flameschick! Way to strip everything in life right down to Just in Time delivery for all your basic needs all from different suppliers. That can be very fun and satisfies our innate human biological needs.

However, if you've been paying attention to the differences between Humans and animals,we have been blessed with rational thought. Human's have been able to build dominion over this Earth because they have the ability to see beyond the moment at hand and take action (or inaction) for the longer term good. Sometimes this means resisting whimsical urges.This is why anarchy has been balanced with law and order in our most developed societies.

Monogamy in a way is a test of a person's overall worth as a human being in the eye's of their partner. It's a remarkable quality to be able to see past the moment and commit to something greater over a longer period of time. This is why it's an important quality for people. Thus some people try to find one person that can satisfy all three of those 'urges' and when an off night/week (or in the case of married or more devoted couples maybe months/years) occurs, they give them the benefit of the doubt and resist the urge to hump whatever walks by next. Ultimately they see long-term value and that's more important to them. When one partner in such a relationship breaks down and cheats then they've failed the test and a new more worthy partner must be sought after.

While not espousing to monogamy certainly isn't 'immoral' in my eyes, it's rather a sign of character flaw.

[FireFly]

Originally Posted by Flameschick

Well, chacun a so gout, I guess, but 50% of marriages end in divorce with by far the most frequent reason given being cheating. You then have to wonder why marriage and long-term relationships are held in such esteem when they come with a built-in flaw: the expectation of monogamy which is unrealistic. It's like expecting priests to be celibate.

Another issue is a lot of people only view themselves as being socially worthy if they're in a relationship. Seems like they view it as more a personal accomplishment, something they can brag about to their friends, or a marker of self-worth than of a union of two souls or whatever esoteric ideal society views it as being. It's not much different than guys in an internet forum bragging about how many girls they've scored. You're "coolness" or social worth if you've scored a lot goes up in the eyes of your peers. Yay...

Anyway, to me it's a choice between being single and free to shop around versus being constrained by someone else's unrealistic expectations. My 20-something girlfriends and I at least definitely subscribe to being in the former state more than the latter, and I'm sure most girls and guys, and judging by the skyrocketing divorce rates, even the married ones, do as well.

Perhaps the skyrocketing divorce rates have more to do with people getting into bad relationships than being in them at all? Also the idea that you CAN just trade your spouse in for a newer model if things get tough certainly contributes. Relationships are seen as a throw away commodity. Is that the fault of the institution or of the people within the relationship?

What I've found is that of my friends/family who have/will end up divorced is that they thought they could change the other person instead of loving them for who they are. They love the idea of being in love more than they love their spouse. But I think that if you find the right one, then you'll love them more than being in love, and you'll do what it takes to make it work. If that makes sense.

Sure, by all means, shop around. I did and am still. However, when I find the one, I will settle down.

Here's the question though... if you don't believe in monogamous relationships, what the hell are you shopping for anyway?

[GreatWhiteEbola]

Originally Posted by Flameschick

Well, chacun a so gout, I guess, but 50% of marriages end in divorce with by far the most frequent reason given being cheating. You then have to wonder why marriage and long-term relationships are held in such esteem when they come with a built-in flaw: the expectation of monogamy which is unrealistic. It's like expecting priests to be celibate.

Another issue is a lot of people only view themselves as being socially worthy if they're in a relationship. Seems like they view it as more a personal accomplishment, something they can brag about to their friends, or a marker of self-worth than of a union of two souls or whatever esoteric ideal society views it as being. It's not much different than guys in an internet forum bragging about how many girls they've scored. You're "coolness" or social worth if you've scored a lot goes up in the eyes of your peers. Yay...

Anyway, to me it's a choice between being single and free to shop around versus being constrained by someone else's unrealistic expectations. My 20-something girlfriends and I at least definitely subscribe to being in the former state more than the latter, and I'm sure most girls and guys, and judging by the skyrocketing divorce rates, even the married ones, do as well.

Have you ever considered a relationship for its financial benefits, or wait is that why you date 3 men at once?

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by Flameschick

</snip>

I agree with you on most if not all of those things, but at the same time it's also nice to know that you have something and you don't have to go looking for it.

[Thunderball]

Originally Posted by Cowboy89

Very good angle Flameschick! Way to strip everything in life right down to Just in Time delivery for all your basic needs all from different suppliers. That can be very fun and satisfies our innate human biological needs.

However, if you've been paying attention to the differences between Humans and animals,we have been blessed with rational thought. Human's have been able to build dominion over this Earth because they have the ability to see beyond the moment at hand and take action (or inaction) for the longer term good. Sometimes this means resisting whimsical urges.This is why anarchy has been balanced with law and order in our most developed societies.

Monogamy in a way is a test of a person's overall worth as a human being in the eye's of their partner. It's a remarkable quality to be able to see past the moment and commit to something greater over a longer period of time. This is why it's an important quality for people. Thus some people try to find one person that can satisfy all three of those 'urges' and when an off night/week (or in the case of married or more devoted couples maybe months/years) occurs, they give them the benefit of the doubt and resist the urge to hump whatever walks by next. Ultimately they see long-term value and that's more important to them. When one partner in such a relationship breaks down and cheats then they've failed the test and a new more worthy partner must be sought after.

While not espousing to monogamy certainly isn't 'immoral' in my eyes, it's rather a sign of character flaw.

Wow... I don't think I could say it better.

People all about the BBD very often find themselves without a chair when the music stops. Somehow I think that "Gen Y polygamy" and "Emo" are not as mutually exclusive as one would think. Both are typically selfish, self-righteous and in the end, accomplish very little. There's always a woman with nicer legs, or fuller boobs, or a firmer ass... same with men. Its an eternal search for El Dorado, all while being a declining investment to that person. That's also only 1 out of at least 3 categories that should be important. That's part of our nature... find someone that attracts us physically, emotionally and romantically, bond with them, procreate, and live a full life together. While simple in theory, its one of the most difficult things for two people to do. That's why divorce is so high. Classic case of the disposal society and like Cowboy89 says, a serious character flaw.

I also think a real man would never share a woman. We're territorial creatures by nature, if a man won't protect his company and stand up for what's his then the emasculation is complete.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by Thunderball

I also think a real man would never share a woman. We're territorial creatures by nature, if a man won't protect his company and stand up for what's his then the emasculation is complete.

I agree. From my experiences, most women want their man to be territorial (within reason) about them.

[FurnaceFace]

I get a free pass, it's my birthday. Birthday trumps all.

[Flameschick]

Originally Posted by Cowboy89

Very good angle Flameschick! Way to strip everything in life right down to Just in Time delivery for all your basic needs all from different suppliers. That can be very fun and satisfies our innate human biological needs.

However, if you've been paying attention to the differences between Humans and animals,we have been blessed with rational thought. Human's have been able to build dominion over this Earth because they have the ability to see beyond the moment at hand and take action (or inaction) for the longer term good. Sometimes this means resisting whimsical urges.This is why anarchy has been balanced with law and order in our most developed societies.

Monogamy in a way is a test of a person's overall worth as a human being in the eye's of their partner. It's a remarkable quality to be able to see past the moment and commit to something greater over a longer period of time. This is why it's an important quality for people. Thus some people try to find one person that can satisfy all three of those 'urges' and when an off night/week (or in the case of married or more devoted couples maybe months/years) occurs, they give them the benefit of the doubt and resist the urge to hump whatever walks by next. Ultimately they see long-term value and that's more important to them. When one partner in such a relationship breaks down and cheats then they've failed the test and a new more worthy partner must be sought after.

While not espousing to monogamy certainly isn't 'immoral' in my eyes, it's rather a sign of character flaw.

Well, kudos for such a thoughtful and articulate defense of monogamy. You definitely make a persuasive case for the "for" side citing the admirable traits in people that enable them to go against their biological imperatives. I tend to have a less exalted view of humanity and believe that there's nothing wrong with going with one's natural animalistic tendencies. Also, the divorce rate has me thinking that your standards for what defines a worthy human being in terms of being able to stay in a relationship despite being tempted might be a little high. Lots of people are failing your test, and perhaps it's not a flaw in character on their part as much as it is the standards being unreasonably rigid.

Anyways, as I said before, to each their own and it takes all kinds of people to make the world go round etc. so it's all good.

[Flameschick]

Originally Posted by GreatWhiteEbola

Have you ever considered a relationship for its financial benefits, or wait is that why you date 3 men at once?

Actually, as an almost doctor I'll soon have the good fortune to exist in a state of relative financial independence so I don't really want or expect the guy to treat me to anything. Whatever dough the guy earns, he should rightfully expect to be able to spend as much of it as he can on himself to further or enhance his own existence, I think. Same with women.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by Flameschick

Actually, as an almost doctor I'll soon have the good fortune to exist in a state of relative financial independence so I don't really want or expect the guy to treat me to anything. Whatever dough the guy earns, he should rightfully expect to be able to spend as much of it as he can on himself to further or enhance his own existence, I think. Same with women.

If it's working for you then more power to you. I used to be single and really don't have any worries about being single again so I'm not in a relationship because I'm scared to be alone like a lot of people are, but at the same time I feel like I'm with someone who compliments as an individual and provides me with all the things you've listed in one person, as opposed to three different people. It's very beneficial for time-management purposes.

[Flameschick]

Originally Posted by rubecube

I feel like I'm with someone who compliments as an individual and provides me with all the things you've listed in one person, as opposed to three different people...

Well congratulations on finding someone you feel is your ideal mate. I'll just say that the divorce rate indicates that people are often misguided in thinking that the person they're with is actually going to offer everything they are looking for. People think they've found their most ideally complementary person only to find out years later and after they've invested so much time and energy into the relationship that they're wrong. You can end up wasting a significant portion of your life trying to keep together something that never was to begin with. Hate to be negative, but there it is. If you take monogamy and relationships seriously, this is what you can end up with.

Throw away the expectations and the standards. Date different people, and you get a composite of your complete guy/girl, kind of like being a vegetarian and having to eat several different sources of protein like corn, rice, and beans to get a complete protein, not to mention the fun that comes with the variety and novelty of trying different things. Paul Newman asked, "Why go out for a burger when you have steak at home?" I say, well, what if you feel like samosas or curry or spanakopitas, etc.?

[rubecube]

LOL...I'm not talking about a soulmate or anything cheesy like that or even considering this as something really longterm. I'm not a guy who's been known to do longterm relationships (anything over 6 months would shock the hell out of me) but if you agree to commit to someone, temporary or longterm, then you should either be with that person or have the balls to walk away like a man (or woman).

Now if you just want to go for the occasional roll in the hay with said person then by all means do it. As long as both people are upfront about what they want from the other person and nobdoy's getting hurt then I don't see a problem.

[The Fonz]

I see no problem with what you're doing Flameschick, just as long as the other people involved are all aware of this.

Personally, I enjoy being in a relationship. Obviously I still check out other girls, that's natural, but I never have and never will cheat on my gf. There is absolutely no reason too....she's gorgeous, nice, fun, smart, positive, and she doesn't hold back in the sack If I messed this up, I'd be the biggest idiot in the world.

Can I ask you though, have you ever fallen for one of the guys you fool around with? If you found 1 guy, who had everything that the 3 guys you're with right now had, would you start a relationship with him, and ditch the others?