I've lost all sympathy for street people

[Regorium]

Originally Posted by flameswin

Don't bring this crap into the thread. You heard the other posters, if people have arms and legs that work, there is no reason for them to not be working.

pffft, growing up in abusive family's, being thrown on the street with no loved one's and no hope, what junk, everyone should be emotionaless robots and just work.

/sarcasm

And of course, every single homeless person has gone through that exact situation. Yes, please just put blanket statements on one side, while villifying the other. That'll surely strengthen your argument!

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by jar_e

So where do we draw the line? I'm going to put a strong guess that there are more people with mental illness and/or addiction problems working and with a home than homeless and jobless. There has to be another factor.

That's just it, a lot of times it's the one's who who have as supportive family and a place to live that can get over it and live a bareable lifestyle.

When I took psychology, we had a few speakers that came in and talked about mental illnesses. When these people are given a chance by loved one's or at least someone who cares, they often find ways to live with their illness, when they are either rejected, or just don't have family, and don't have a home, and no one cares about them then how the hell are they supposed to live with whatever they have? It's really tough, and apparantly just as tough to understand, based on this thread.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by 4X4

Nice contribution. Did he say anything about homeless? He said that it grinds his gears that people are asking for free money when there are plenty of jobs available.

And yeah, it's true that alot of these poeple aren't employable. But alot of them are. Like that guy that walks up and down the median by anderson station with a sign asking for money. Both legs work. Both arms work. Get a job.

I was going over the top on purpose, plus it was comments like this one I quoted that I was responding to. If you don't know someone and you don't know the person's history or what's going in inside him, then don't be the judge of what he's capable of, or what he should be doing.

[kdoir345]

Originally Posted by flylock shox

Boy. Some ugly comments in this thread. A lot of posters so far come across to me (and, I would think, to most outside observers) as likely being arrogant and ignorant; coming from privileged backgrounds with healthy families, who were given plenty of opportunities to succeed, and simply don't care to try to understand how the other half lives.

I don't think a lot of people on this board understand what it's like to grow up in a household with an alcoholic (and usually absent) father and a heroin-addicted mother - parents who've kicked you out on the street when you were 14 or so, or who effectively got you involved in the drug world when you were a kid, or who sexually abused you. And I doubt most people posting here understand just how bad things can be when you find yourself unloved by anyone, alone, poor, and living in a situation where you can't see a way out. Some of the people you're criticizing deserve credit for at least one thing - they haven't committed suicide in circumstances where a lot of people would have done. A lot of the people you're describing have never been given any reason to hope for anything better in their lives, and it's a minor miracle they've held on to what they've got.

In fact, the number of people you're talking about who are homeless or poor because they have a mental illness is actually very small. The number of people who have a mental illness because they're homeless or poor on the other hand, is much larger.

There are, among this population, an exceptional sub-group who are, in fact, making a lifestyle choice. For them, I have no sympathy.

But seriously, the blanket statements... yeesh...

Okay, I have got to say one thing on this. So that is basically saying that these people have had a crappy life and because of this reason, they dont want anything better? And thats a good thing? And is reason for the rest of the "normal" people to feel sorry for them and give them handouts, give me a break. There are a lot of people that have had a hard life growing up in tough situations with alcoholic parents and what not that turn out to be a productive person, but to say that these people deserve sympathy because they had a rough life is absurd. I havent had the smoothest ride growing up, especially with death in my immediate family when I had just turned 16. I have worked since I was in high school, after high school I worked two jobs so that I could afford to go to college. And still while my friends travel the world and have school paid for I dont feel the need to feel sorry for myself and have others feel sorry for me.

Youre a human being, you should have the desire to succeed and if you dont, then I dont feel for you.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by kdoir345

Okay, I have got to say one thing on this. So that is basically saying that these people have had a crappy life and because of this reason, they dont want anything better? And thats a good thing? And is reason for the rest of the "normal" people to feel sorry for them and give them handouts, give me a break. There are a lot of people that have had a hard life growing up in tough situations with alcoholic parents and what not that turn out to be a productive person, but to say that these people deserve sympathy because they had a rough life is absurd. I havent had the smoothest ride growing up, especially with death in my immediate family when I had just turned 16. I have worked since I was in high school, after high school I worked two jobs so that I could afford to go to college. And still while my friends travel the world and have school paid for I dont feel the need to feel sorry for myself and have others feel sorry for me.

Youre a human being, you should have the desire to succeed and if you dont, then I dont feel for you.

Well, then you are a strong person, and you dealt with your problems in a positve way. I guess what it comes down to is compassion. Sure, we don't HAVE to feel compasion or sympathy for anyone for any reason, and it would be awesome if everyone could just learn to overcome whatever problems they have and just work and not complain, but the problem is, we're not robots, we're humans, and everyone has emotions and ways of dealing with it.

personally I feel that just because you were able to move on and succeed, that isn't a reason to turn around and feel no sympathy for anyone who wasn't able to deal with their problems as well as you did. but that's just me.

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by flameswin

That's just it, a lot of times it's the one's who who have as supportive family and a place to live that can get over it and live a bareable lifestyle.

When I took psychology, we had a few speakers that came in and talked about mental illnesses. When these people are given a chance by loved one's or at least someone who cares, they often find ways to live with their illness, when they are either rejected, or just don't have family, and don't have a home, and no one cares about them then how the hell are they supposed to live with whatever they have? It's really tough, and apparantly just as tough to understand, based on this thread.

The problem is people don't know what mental illness is like, so they just assume a person is lazy, or made a choice to live on the street. It affects they way people think, behave, deal with situations. Even a minor mental illness can turn a person's world upside down, and as you said, if they don't have the support structure to deal with it, they can start sinking really fast, and get caught in a pit of dispair. Its not as easy as saying, "I don't wanna be homeless anymore, I'm gonna go get a job"...a lot of these people aren't fully capable of making a decision like that.

[JiriHrdina]

Weird thread. A little tough to distinguish at times between the sarcasm and the extreme legitimate opinions.

I think its a mistake to pretend to know what circumstances someone went through tah resulted with them to be on the street - you can talk all you want about tough times you had - but that's just one situation.

I also think people forget that a lot of homeless people are working. The working poor is one of the biggest problems in this city....folks can get a job but how are they supposed to save up the damage deposit+2 months worth of rent to land an apartment IF they are even lucky enough to find one and get approved.

You can choose to either help, or not help - up to you - but to look down on these people is remarkably arrogant.

[DESS]

Originally Posted by Igottago

The problem is people don't know what mental illness is like, so they just assume a person is lazy, or made a choice to live on the street. It affects they way people think, behave, deal with situations. Even a minor mental illness can turn a person's world upside down, and as you said, if they don't have the support structure to deal with it, they can start sinking really fast, and get caught in a pit of dispair. Its not as easy as saying, "I don't wanna be homeless anymore, I'm gonna go get a job"...a lot of these people aren't fully capable of making a decision like that.

Here's the problem - a lot of people on this thread are saying because some have mental problems and are unable to work, we should treat them as though they all have mental problems and are unable to work. The fact is, some people don't have mental problems, and are able to work but don't. These are the people that are complete low-life losers.

As for the mental problem thing - a lot can still work but don't. That is just reality.

[flylock shox]

Originally Posted by kdoir345

So that is basically saying that these people have had a crappy life and because of this reason, they dont want anything better? And thats a good thing?

No to both questions.

Among the many things it occurs to me to say in response to your post, I'll just say this: there's a difference between not wanting anything better and not believing or feeling that anything better is possible.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Igottago

The problem is people don't know what mental illness is like, so they just assume a person is lazy, or made a choice to live on the street. It affects they way people think, behave, deal with situations. Even a minor mental illness can turn a person's world upside down, and as you said, if they don't have the support structure to deal with it, they can start sinking really fast, and get caught in a pit of dispair. Its not as easy as saying, "I don't wanna be homeless anymore, I'm gonna go get a job"...a lot of these people aren't fully capable of making a decision like that.

Exaclty, and if you read some of the respones in this thread, you can tell how society as a whole views these people.

It's funny because this thread is kind of representative of what life is like for people living with mental illnesses. They are misjudged by people all the time, and that really doesn't help an already crappy situation.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by DESS

Here's the problem - a lot of people on this thread are saying because some have mental problems and are unable to work, we should treat them as though they all have mental problems and are unable to work. The fact is, some people don't have mental problems, and are able to work but don't. These are the people that are complete low-life losers.

As for the mental problem thing - a lot can still work but don't. That is just reality.

But you are the one who made a blanket statement about homeless people, basically saying that they are all lazy bums because you aparantly deal with them at work.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally Posted by DESS

Here's the problem - a lot of people on this thread are saying because some have mental problems and are unable to work, we should treat them as though they all have mental problems and are unable to work. The fact is, some people don't have mental problems, and are able to work but don't. These are the people that are complete low-life losers.

As for the mental problem thing - a lot can still work but don't. That is just reality.

I've seen how homeless people live and it seems to me that anyone who has decided to live that life -- "they can work but don't" -- then, well, that's a mental problem right there.

Being homeless would be an extremely unpleasant and humiliating position to be in. I really can't believe that a large percentage of homeless people just one day said "aaah screw it, working sucks, I wanna live on the street".

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by flylock shox

No to both questions.

Among the many things it occurs to me to say in response to your post, I'll just say this: there's a difference between not wanting anything better and not believing or feeling that anything better is possible.

That is definitely true.

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by DESS

Here's the problem - a lot of people on this thread are saying because some have mental problems and are unable to work, we should treat them as though they all have mental problems and are unable to work. The fact is, some people don't have mental problems, and are able to work but don't. These are the people that are complete low-life losers.

As for the mental problem thing - a lot can still work but don't. That is just reality.

Whatever man. I've met people with corporate high paying jobs who in my eyes are low life losers too. And i've met people with illegitimate jobs (drug dealers etc) who don't need to ask you for money, but make more money than normal hardworking people by taking advantage of people. I think its arrogant and ignorant to point at homeless people in general and say they are the lowest scum on the earth, as you have. They are in a crappy position, through whatever factors contributed to it. Being in that situation is probably like living life in hell, and it can't be easy to get up every day in a dumpster and think "today is my day, im gonna go out and succeed"...the position that many homeless people are in is probably fairly paralyzing.

Ones job, or lack of job doesn't neccessarily define what kind of person they are.

[burn_baby_burn]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

I've seen how homeless people live and it seems to me that anyone who has decided to live that life -- "they can work but don't" -- then, well, that's a mental problem right there.

Being homeless would be an extremely unpleasant and humiliating position to be in. I really can't believe that a large percentage of homeless people just one day said "aaah screw it, working sucks, I wanna live on the street".

Especially in the winter.

[Neeper]

One guy asked me for change one day, I said no, but I would buy him a coffee. He took the coffee and didn't even thank me.

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by Neeper

One guy asked me for change one day, I said no, but I would buy him a coffee. He took the coffee and didn't even thank me.

That sure doesn't help. I often take a similar approach and offer to buy them food instead of giving them change. It's a little annoying when they seemed dissapointed with that.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

That sure doesn't help. I often take a similar approach and offer to buy them food instead of giving them change. It's a little annoying when they seemed dissapointed with that.

I think that is what so many people here don't like.

If a homeless person were truly there because of conditions they can't control, and they need food to survive, shouldn't they LOVE you for providing them with something to eat?

Don't get me wrong...lots will appreciate it....but it seems like there are more who want money and nothing else. Which obviously shows to me that they need money to support whatever habit they have.

[Fire]

Originally Posted by Teh_Bandwagoner

A friend of mine once had a homeless guy approach him with a box of sandwiches, asking him to buy one because he was sooooo hungry.

lol, too funny.

[4X4]

Originally Posted by flameswin

I was going over the top on purpose, plus it was comments like this one I quoted that I was responding to. If you don't know someone and you don't know the person's history or what's going in inside him, then don't be the judge of what he's capable of, or what he should be doing.

Whatever man. For a looong time that guy showed up every day and did the same damn thing. If he can do it there, he can do it at a construction site or at McDonalds.