Man claims to have gun, is killed by the cops, turns out its a hairbrush - Page 3 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

Teh_Bandwagoner · 11-13-2007, 02:35 PM

I agree that the shooting isn't the issue here. If a man is claiming to have a gun (regardless of any mental illness) and I had a gun in my hand, and the guy comes at me, I'm gonna try shooting him first. The main controversy comes from the victim being black man in a poor neighbourhood.

I think a lot of people up here in Canada badly underestimate the difference in classes between the general white population and general black population in the US. It is severe! And unfortunately, it probably won't change anytime soon. I think if this incident were to occur up here, the fact that the victim is black would probably not come into play very much. But down there, the moment a poor black man gets shot, regardless of the situation, all hell breaks loose.

It's really sad and frustrating because like hulkrogan was saying, it's all pretty self-perpetuating. Poverty and lack of education in the black community seems transfer from generation to generation, and it seems like the longer it happens, the more willing the remaining population is to sweep it under the rug and pretend the problem doesn't exist. I have no idea where you would start fixing the problem.

It's like a really really sad episode of Boondocks, really :P

Sainters7 · 11-13-2007, 02:37 PM

Thank God this thread went in the direction it did. When I read the story of what happened and saw this thread was three pages, I thought it was going to be a bunch of people thinking the cops shouldve waited and held fire to realize it was a comb(which wouldve been ridiculous). I see nothing wrong with what they did, that very easily couldve been a gun and any hesitation in a similar type situation couldve lead to an officer(or more) being needlessly killed.

11-13-2007, 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dion

I disagree. Having someone trained in mental illness might make a difference. That person would at least have some understanding as to why this suspect is acting they way they are. The cop that dealt with my now deceased friend knew what was going on and was able to calm him down. If it was any other officer at the scene i have no doubt he would been shot and killed.

For sure the cops were looking for other means to neutralise the suspect. In this case I agree the cops ultimately made the right descion.

Having someone trained to deal with people with mental illness, doesn't change a lethal force encounter.

In the case of your friend, that level of force wasn't justified.

Dion · 11-13-2007, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bent Wookie

Having someone trained to deal with people with mental illness, doesn't change a lethal force encounter.

Can it not help to prevent a situation from growing to a lethal force encounter?

Quote:

In the case of your friend, that level of force wasn't justified.

I'm not going to post all the details here so we will agree to disagree on that.

Locke · 11-13-2007, 03:03 PM

Does anyone else recognize the irony of this thread being right above the "American Gangster" thread?

The irony slays me.

Jayems · 11-13-2007, 03:26 PM

Quote:

Police involved in the shooting death of a teen, who turned out to be carrying a hairbrush, Tuesday released tapes of his mother's 9-1-1 call. Police said it recorded Khiel Coppin saying, "I've got a gun." New York Police Commissioner Raymond Kelly said that when officers later confronted Coppin, he yelled: "Come get me. I have a gun. Let's do this."

Front page of CNN.com now

MaxPower · 11-13-2007, 03:50 PM

Cops did the right thing based on the info they had. 20 shots seems pretty crazy though.

11-13-2007, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dion

Can it not help to prevent a situation from growing to a lethal force encounter?

Sure, there a lot of things that could possibly help someone out with whatever mental illness they suffer from. I don't think a police officer is appropriately trained nor an expert of assessing and assisting with mental illness. Police are a band-aid when it comes to mental illness.

If you are saying that if someone on a scene where a lethal force encounter is occurring, had indepth training on dealing with mental illness,that the outcome would have been different, I will disagree. If the encounter starts as lethal force or escalates to lethal force, that IS the only option.

My point is, is that police deal with mentally ill people all the time. Are they treated different in the eyes of the law because of their mental illness- absolutely. Are they treated differently when they are a LETHAL threat to others- absolutely NOT.

Dion · 11-13-2007, 04:23 PM

nm

Language · 11-13-2007, 04:36 PM

Most of you have already brought up the points I was going to mention. The cops had a reasonable suspicion that the man had a weapon, and in thinking so, took the right steps.

I just hope Al Sharpton doesn't come onto Larry King Live and preach police negligence, which I'm sure he or someone else is going to do. There's already been protests by African Americans in front of New York Police Department Precinct, as though this is some sort of race issue.

But there have been documentations of police brutality towards African Americans, especially in New York,, so it's not a stretch to think that some think all of this is some sort of deliberate attempt to harm them or something.

Bill Bumface · 11-13-2007, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leonk19

But there have been documentations of police brutality towards African Americans, especially in New York,, so it's not a stretch to think that some think all of this is some sort of deliberate attempt to harm them or something.

Exactly. Even if the police forces in question completely clean up their act, it will take time for the black community to trust them, which is fair enough.

It's just like how GM and Hyundai made some really ty cars in the early 90s, and even though both now do quite well in the reliability department, people are still nervous to buy their cars.

metallicat · 11-13-2007, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flames_Gimp

LOL thinning out the herd.

Pretty much. Stupid ing idiots in this world, I'll tell ya.

psicodude · 11-13-2007, 08:23 PM

Add me to the "the cops were justified" camp.

If you think shooting a hand gun is easy, head down to The Shooting Edge on blackfoot and ask to fire off a few rounds with a Glock 9mm. I, like all of my movie watching buddies, thought it would be easy. Wow, were we wrong. The weight and recoil of the gun were insane. One of my friends actually shot the ground in front of him by mistake once. Lol.