What brands/companies do you boycott?

[Looger]

Originally posted by arsenal@Feb 9 2005, 02:18 AM
Ah... Pennylane ent guy i see
Yah.. I hate all his establishments. The only good things about Cowboys is the waitressess.
...

that's what he said!

<seriously>

a quick look at the financing of vickers entertainment tells you all you need to know aboot their racial profiling at the door.

[Neeper]

Originally posted by arsenal@Feb 8 2005, 07:18 PM

How does Vickers become a racist becuase the bouncer didn't let you in?

Because Vickers tells them not to let coloreds in!! He's even admitted it on TV. I don't wanna get into this. Screw his establishment, I will never spend a dime in them.

[BaronInEdmonton]

Buying CD's. You telling me it cost $15 to press, and ship them. Actual retail cost of a CD should be like 75 cents.

Diet Cola. Who are you fooling?

PETA.

[JiriHrdina]

Originally posted by BaronInEdmonton@Feb 8 2005, 10:51 PM
Buying CD's. You telling me it cost $15 to press, and ship them. Actual retail cost of a CD should be like 75 cents.

Diet Cola. Who are you fooling?

PETA.

Are you kidding me?

CDs are one of the best values out there. For 15 dollars you get someone's art, something they've poured their heart and soul into (assuming its a good artist and not a hack). You get something that you can enjoy time and time again for years. In contrast you spend almost the same amount of money to go to a movie, something that is over and done in 2 hours.

Really - CDs are the best deal around. The hard cost of producing the CDs is irrelevant. Its about the value of what is being produced.

[flmsfan2004]

Originally posted by habernac+Feb 8 2005, 06:25 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (habernac @ Feb 8 2005, 06:25 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin-Mean Mr. Mustard@Feb 7 2005, 11:08 PM
Oh those livestrong bracelet things, good cause, but do people really know the cause or do they see some celebrity wearing one.

I know about the cause. I've bought a case of the things because I believe in the cause. Everyone asks me about mine and then want one after I tell them about it.[/b][/quote]
I think it is a great cause. My mom has cancer and I wear one to support her and all those who battle cancer. I like it when I see people wearing them, it rasises awarness and support. If people wear them because they think its cool, that's their prerogative, and the money still goes towards a good cause.

[Mean Mr. Mustard]

Two things, sorry about your mom first and formost and I hope she gets better, and secondly I just don't like it when people jump on a bandwagon because they see a celebrity wearing one. While I agree that the money helps, at the same time the message isn't getting across. Is it rasing awareness of cancer, or yellow plastic bracelets.

[Flame Of Liberty]

Originally posted by Ro@Feb 7 2005, 09:58 PM
Wal-Mart- Biggest clothing retailer in North America, which uses cheap, outsourced labor in third world countries. Enough said, really. I do not want to knowingly and willingly support goods/clothing manufactured in the EPZs companies like Wal-Mart, The Gap, and Nike use, because the human inequality and abuse found there is just staggering. Oh yeah, they're also destroying small business and the fabric of small towns/cities everywhere.

Enough said really? How does it help those cheap laborers when you boycott products they make? And how is it bad when businesses which cannot compete go out of business?

[Flame Of Liberty]

Originally posted by Agamemnon+Feb 8 2005, 04:21 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Agamemnon @ Feb 8 2005, 04:21 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Sammie@Feb 8 2005, 07:15 AM
I'm boycotting the CBC and the Liberal Party of Canada. It's become very apparent they believe Communism is a right-wing conspiracy and a dangerous threat to social engineering and the creation of a new, more tolerant Canada.

The Liberal Party believes Communism is a 'right-wing conspiracy'?

I would _love_ for some expansion on this point, it sounds interesting... and supremely puzzling. [/b][/quote]
Well Sammie worded it pretty strangely but I think what he was trying to say is that romantic leftists like you, CBC and LP cannot stomach when socialism of all shades is branded for what it is – a criminal ideology.

[transplant99]

Enough said really? How does it help those cheap laborers when you boycott products they make?

Yeah i was gonna stay way outside this thread, but this question was the first that popped in my mind as well.

So you boycott those companies that use cheap labor to produce goods. Said manufacturer then sees sales drop, hence laying off employees/shutting down plants. Ergo, those sweatshop employees now are in even worse shape.

This benefits who? The consumer, because he has a clear conscience that he is not supporting some corprorate giant any longer? The worker because he doesnt have to work in horrid conditions any longer, but in exchange, has no income?

I don't get it.

[Agamemnon]

Originally posted by Flame Of Liberty+Feb 9 2005, 02:44 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Flame Of Liberty @ Feb 9 2005, 02:44 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>

The Liberal Party believes Communism is a 'right-wing conspiracy'?

I would _love_ for some expansion on this point, it sounds interesting... and supremely puzzling.

Well Sammie worded it pretty strangely but I think what he was trying to say is that romantic leftists like you, CBC and LP cannot stomach when socialism of all shades is branded for what it is – a criminal ideology. [/b][/quote]
Really? Cause that's not even close to what he said, so either you're taking a massive leap, or he worded his phrase completely wrong, and didn't correct it.

You also show your lack of ability to 'debate' a topic when you 'brand all shades of Socialism' as a 'criminal ideology'. Talk about beyond biased.

Thats the biggest load of BS I've seen come out of you. At least debate the issue, instead of spouting that crap.

[Agamemnon]

Originally posted by transplant99@Feb 9 2005, 02:51 PM

Yeah i was gonna stay way outside this thread, but this question was the first that popped in my mind as well.

So you boycott those companies that use cheap labor to produce goods. Said manufacturer then sees sales drop, hence laying off employees/shutting down plants. Ergo, those sweatshop employees now are in even worse shape.

This benefits who? The consumer, because he has a clear conscience that he is not supporting some corprorate giant any longer? The worker because he doesnt have to work in horrid conditions any longer, but in exchange, has no income?

I don't get it.

Seems pretty obvious. Companies get around labour rights and human rights in North America by going to places where those rights dont' exist. If you're hurt here, or die on the job, you're entitled to compensation. You're also protected from wrongful firing, like your boss hitting on you and then canning you. In fact, there are hundreds of little 'socialist benefits' that all of you (in N. America) are taking advantage of right now, whether you like it (or know it) or not.

I suppose if you think you're entitled to these benefits and protections, and other peoples in other places aren't, then there's no conscience issue here. For you.

[Looger]

Originally posted by JiriHrdina@Feb 9 2005, 05:11 AM
CDs are one of the best values out there. For 15 dollars you get someone's art, something they've poured their heart and soul into (assuming its a good artist and not a hack). You get something that you can enjoy time and time again for years. In contrast you spend almost the same amount of money to go to a movie, something that is over and done in 2 hours.

Really - CDs are the best deal around. The hard cost of producing the CDs is irrelevant. Its about the value of what is being produced.

red flag!

until a band sells 150,000 albums they don't even get a slice of every CD purchase. in fact one huge reason there's so many one-hit wonders is because the record companies have figured out how to milk a band for all its short-term good before they get any real rights.

bands get signed on this pretty standard deal and get paid what the record company thinks they should be.

bands that are huge have clout but that's like 1 in 100.

i'd even go so far as to say that purchasing CDs hurts most small bands, there are many ways nowadays that bands skirt the record companies and go on indie labels etc.

a few years ago the record copanies had a chance to see the future and band together to start selling CD's for ten bucks or less. that time has passed and their profits have dwindled. also the huge bands (like metallica) have suffered because they are also part of that big-company framework.

i'd buy a lot more CD's if they were 7.99 but at twenty-plus quite often, maybe 5-10 CD's a year.

[transplant99]

Seems pretty obvious. Companies get around labour rights and human rights in North America by going to places where those rights dont' exist. If you're hurt here, or die on the job, you're entitled to compensation. You're also protected from wrongful firing, like your boss hitting on you and then canning you. In fact, there are hundreds of little 'socialist benefits' that all of you (in N. America) are taking advantage of right now, whether you like it (or know it) or not.

Who said any different?

I suppose if you think you're entitled to these benefits and protections, and other peoples in other places aren't, then there's no conscience issue here. For you

That's a heck of a leap in logic from what I actually posted....but i expect no less.

Now back to what i said...how does boycotting these companies that use sweatshop labor....help the sweatshop laborer?

Putting his employer (as heinous as he may be) out of business helps them how?

[Agamemnon]

Originally posted by transplant99@Feb 9 2005, 04:24 PM

Who said any different?

That's a heck of a leap in logic from what I actually posted....but i expect no less.

Now back to what i said...how does boycotting these companies that use sweatshop labor....help the sweatshop laborer?

Putting his employer (as heinous as he may be) out of business helps them how?

Well, thats sort of why I brought up the concsience issue.

If you knew a guy who was a real bas**rd... say... he raped someone, but he sells DVD's real cheap, cheaper than anyone else... would you buy from him? Wouldn't you have an issue with that, even though the value of the DVD's are completely separate from the negative acts this person has committed?

I suppose its seen in the same light. If you don't agree with the practise itself, then why support an indirectly related product, _purely_ based on price?

Like I said, if you don't believe that corporate exploitation of cheap labour in the 3rd world is 'bad', then you dont' have a problem, Wal-Mart away. I'm not here to pass judgement, you do what's good for you, and I'll do the same.

Seeing things a different way isn't a crime, it just comes down to what matters most to you, saving 30 cents or feeling good about your choice. Clearly the poster who avoids Wal-Mart 'feels good' about their choice. I don't see the problem. Do you?

[transplant99]

Seeing things a different way isn't a crime, it just comes down to what matters most to you, saving 30 cents or feeling good about your choice. Clearly the poster who avoids Wal-Mart 'feels good' about their choice. I don't see the problem. Do you?

Again, "avoiding Wal-Mart" because of them using products produced by cheap labor, hurts no one...except the cheap laborer.

I understand the concept of wanting to line the big corporations wallets because they use standards unacceptable to most. What i don't grasp is how the very heart of the matter (using cheap labor to produce goods) is affected by this decision.

there is only one real big loser in the whole thing...the guy thats being exploited in (insert 3rd world country) already. Now you wish to take away his only (albeit meager and grossly unfair) income in order to prove a point to a huge multi-national that wont blink twice by missing your business?

A case of the "hopeful" ends, justifying the means?

I guess this logic is OK here, but not in Iraq? (Just had to throw that in there)

[Agamemnon]

Again, "avoiding Wal-Mart" because of them using products produced by cheap labor, hurts no one...except the cheap laborer.

Well... if a lot of people did it, it would 'hurt' Wal-Mart. Boycotts of businesses/products aren't new.

I understand the concept of wanting to line the big corporations wallets because they use standards unacceptable to most. What i don't grasp is how the very heart of the matter (using cheap labor to produce goods) is affected by this decision.

Well, I'll point to my rape example again. Buying cheap DVD's from the rapist in no way helps the rape victim (who is basically completely removed from you), and it DOES get you cheap DVD's. Why not buy from him, right? The rape has already been committed, there's nothing you can do to help now... so why not save a few bucks, right? I see the situations as more or less parallel.

You're right, not buying DVD's (shopping at Wal-Mart) from rapist won't do a thing for the rape victim. But wouldn't you feel like an ass for supporting the guy? Maybe you wouldn't...

there is only one real big loser in the whole thing...the guy thats being exploited in (insert 3rd world country) already. Now you wish to take away his only (albeit meager and grossly unfair) income in order to prove a point to a huge multi-national that wont blink twice by missing your business?

Sure, but I think there's an assumption out there that these people were 'losers' before we came along, and we're responsible for injecting a little financial happiness into their lives.

I may be wrong here, but I'm fairly sure these peoples weren't living in desperate poverty since the time of Christ, just waiting for Wal-Mart and Nike to come along and alleviate their misery. Thats not the way it was.

I don't think Wal-Mart and Nike sweatshops are a _requirement_ to develop your nation.

The big criminals here are generally the governments who conspire with these corporations. The governments should be legislating labour rights for their own people, but tend to drop the ball salivating over the meager corporate taxes they're promised in return for granting a good deal to the businesses.

A case of the "hopeful" ends, justifying the means?

I guess this logic is OK here, but not in Iraq? (Just had to throw that in there)

Don't really know what this means. I have no idea how someone boycotting Wal-Mart for unfair labour practises = support for an invasion of Iraq. While both ideals are probably Utopian, thats about as far as I see the correlation going. Maybe you could go further w/ it, or is that for another thread?

[Bill Bumface]

For those who were asking for more detail on the Paul Vickers issue, here it is:

Anyone who has been to Cowboys, the drink/tantra, coyotes etc will notice a real lack of colour in the places. Being a white guy myself, I never have troubles getting in, but once inside its a fricken whiteout. There seems to be a couple scattered token minorities, but its deffinately not a representative population in there. Its not just because of the cowboy hick music either, as I've seen many minorities in line that can't get in (unless they are with about 10 white friends, then they stand a chance). The bouncers will say either they don't meet the dress code, or that its 25 and over that night (as they let in a bunch of 16 year old girls that went straight to the front of the line) or ask them for 8 pieces of government issued photo ID.

I really don't care if its Vickers' personal decision or not, all of his establishments employ these policies, so I don't go to them. When you start to throw in the alleged biker gang links (including a shooting of a biker gang member outside of one of his clubs a while back) and I want to stay even further away. My money doesn't go to criminals or racists.

EDIT: P.S. I heard the chophouse sucks too

[MarchHare]

CDs are one of the best values out there. For 15 dollars you get someone's art, something they've poured their heart and soul into (assuming its a good artist and not a hack). You get something that you can enjoy time and time again for years. In contrast you spend almost the same amount of money to go to a movie, something that is over and done in 2 hours.

Really - CDs are the best deal around. The hard cost of producing the CDs is irrelevant. Its about the value of what is being produced.

CDs are terrible value. I once saw a comparison that showed the soundtrack for the film Chicago only cost about $3 less than the DVD, which included the film (and all the songs on the soundtrack), liner notes, cast and crew commentary, and many other of the standard DVD bonus features. The CD, on the other hand, just had the songs and liner notes. Great value indeed.

And let's not even get into the issue of most CDs these days consist of one or two good songs and then 10 songs of crappy filler.

[arsenal]

Originally posted by Agamemnon@Feb 9 2005, 09:50 AM

Well... if a lot of people did it, it would 'hurt' Wal-Mart. Boycotts of businesses/products aren't new.

Well, I'll point to my rape example again. Buying cheap DVD's from the rapist in no way helps the rape victim (who is basically completely removed from you), and it DOES get you cheap DVD's. Why not buy from him, right? The rape has already been committed, there's nothing you can do to help now... so why not save a few bucks, right? I see the situations as more or less parallel.

You're right, not buying DVD's (shopping at Wal-Mart) from rapist won't do a thing for the rape victim. But wouldn't you feel like an ass for supporting the guy? Maybe you wouldn't...

Sure, but I think there's an assumption out there that these people were 'losers' before we came along, and we're responsible for injecting a little financial happiness into their lives.

I may be wrong here, but I'm fairly sure these peoples weren't living in desperate poverty since the time of Christ, just waiting for Wal-Mart and Nike to come along and alleviate their misery. Thats not the way it was.

I don't think Wal-Mart and Nike sweatshops are a _requirement_ to develop your nation.

The big criminals here are generally the governments who conspire with these corporations. The governments should be legislating labour rights for their own people, but tend to drop the ball salivating over the meager corporate taxes they're promised in return for granting a good deal to the businesses.

Don't really know what this means. I have no idea how someone boycotting Wal-Mart for unfair labour practises = support for an invasion of Iraq. While both ideals are probably Utopian, thats about as far as I see the correlation going. Maybe you could go further w/ it, or is that for another thread?

Ag, drawing a comparason between a sweatshop and a rapist is a long shot... at best. Even in a sweatshop, the conditions could be horrendous, long hours, etc, but at the end of the day, the worker has helped both themselves and their family. A rapist helps noone but themselves.

Large businesses hire less fortunate/handicapped people all the time. They probably pay them minimum wage, or maybe less. The government would probably chip in a bit as well to bring up the total wage. But the business is in fact, getting cheap labor. Are you going to boycott those establishments as well, becuase they are exploiting the handicapped? Not paying them what they should be getting paid? They are giving the opportunity for them make a living.

At a place i used to work at, they would hire high school students to come in and gain "work experiance". They would be paid less than minimum wage, for doing sh*t work. That could be considered exploitation as well.

[Ace]

Originally posted by moon@Feb 7 2005, 11:39 PM
I have never had a problem with Telus. In fact the only problem that I have found with their customer servie is that they call too often and bug me with question about my satisfaction.

Try calling and asking a question about your bill. 'IF' you can get ahold of someone within 30min, i'd be suprised...