Research shows Neanderthals may have talked

[blankall]

Originally Posted by JohnnyB

There is no conclusive evidence, only speculation, which is largely built around Neanderthal brain size being greater than that of modern humans.

I believe Neanderthals and modern humans had fairly similar brain size to body mass ratios, which would indicate similar intelligence and makes the question of Neanderthal language more interesting. If humans and Neanderthals were equally intelligent, but Neanderthals were much more physically dominating than humans, it would suggest that humans had an additional evolutionary advantage. A prominent theory is that our evolutionary advantage is having a vocal tract that enables more effective and efficient vocal communication.

It's quite plausible that Neanderthals were slightly more intelligent than humans, but failed to survive in conflict with humans because of inferior vocal communication.

I've heard other explanations for our dominance as well. One was a greater affinity for art and abstract thinking. Another was a greater tendency to organize into large bands. Another has to do w/ the increased muscle mass of the neanderthals. They would have needed more caloric intake to sustain that and, thus, been more succeptable to famine. Anyway, I find the whole thing pretty interesting.

[AC]

Originally Posted by blankall

I've heard other explanations for our dominance as well. One was a greater affinity for art and abstract thinking. Another was a greater tendency to organize into large bands. Another has to do w/ the increased muscle mass of the neanderthals. They would have needed more caloric intake to sustain that and, thus, been more succeptable to famine. Anyway, I find the whole thing pretty interesting.

Agreed. I've actually written a couple of papers on the subject of what happened to the Neanderthals.

Recent studies into stable isotope ratios of carbon and nitrogen has yielded results which indicate Neanderthals relied heavily upon meat for their diets. Theres also little evidence to indicate Neanderthals engaged in much active scavenging, but relying on hunting as their primary mode of acquiring meat.

Taking these concepts into account, it’s quite reasonable to accept that when competing against better adapted modern humans, Neanderthals found themselves unable to obtain the meat they required.

And perhaps most interesting, there have been findings that have shown that the Neanderthals likely had cannibalistic tendencies. These sites indicate that the reason behind the bone breakings was to acquire meat, and not as a form of ritual.

So likely, the competition between the two was simply too much for the Neanderthals to handle.

[JohnnyB]

Originally Posted by blankall

I've heard other explanations for our dominance as well. One was a greater affinity for art and abstract thinking. Another was a greater tendency to organize into large bands. Another has to do w/ the increased muscle mass of the neanderthals. They would have needed more caloric intake to sustain that and, thus, been more succeptable to famine. Anyway, I find the whole thing pretty interesting.

Yeah, I've read those as well, and I'm sure that whatever the failure of Neanderthals was it was probably a combination of many factors. There is likely some validity to many of the theories about Neanderthal extinction. Personally, I think the art/abstract thinking theories are pretty much bunk, or at least putting the cart before the horse, but I suppose we just don't know.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by JohnnyB

Yeah, I've read those as well, and I'm sure that whatever the failure of Neanderthals was it was probably a combination of many factors. There is likely some validity to many of the theories about Neanderthal extinction. Personally, I think the art/abstract thinking theories are pretty much bunk, or at least putting the cart before the horse, but I suppose we just don't know.

Yeah, the art/abstract theory has come under a lot of pressure lately. I guess they found a hollowed out bone at a neandethal site that people think may be a flute of some kind, plus more evidence of ritual burial and artwork. But yeah your right most likely a combination of many factors. It's still kind of cool to think of an alternate species existing so close in time to our own.

Some of the more outlandish theories I've read are that the ginger gene is actually from neanderthals, but most sources say that its unlikely the two species were ever capable of producing anythign more than a sterile "mule".

[AC]

Originally Posted by blankall

Some of the more outlandish theories I've read are that the ginger gene is actually from neanderthals, but most sources say that its unlikely the two species were ever capable of producing anythign more than a sterile "mule".

Yeah, from what I've been taught, it's highly unlikely the two species interbred.

DNA analysis from Neanderthal findings have shown a vast difference between the two species, so its unlikely Neanderthals were simply a sub species within Homo sapiens.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by AnthonyCook

Yeah, from what I've been taught, it's highly unlikely the two species interbred.

DNA analysis from Neanderthal findings have shown a vast difference between the two species, so its unlikely Neanderthals were simply a sub species within Homo sapiens.

Is the stuff you've learnt on neanderthals part of a some kind of anthro degree/masters?

[AC]

Originally Posted by blankall

Is the stuff you've learnt on neanderthals part of a some kind of anthro degree/masters?

No, though I'm considering majoring in anthropology. I've just taken three courses on physical anthropology. It's really fascinating.

[JohnnyB]

Originally Posted by AnthonyCook

Yeah, from what I've been taught, it's highly unlikely the two species interbred.

However unlikely it may be that they bred productively, I would not be the least surprised at interspecies rape.

[redforever]

and for what it's worth, apparently they had red hair too.

http://video.msn.com/?mkt=en-us&bran...5930&GT1=10450