Teen killed with Pickaxe in Queensland

[flylock shox]

Originally Posted by Azure

What about if a witness is brought to court....does he have to answer any questions the defense or persecution might have?

How come 'pleading the 5th' is ringing a bell here?

I'll go look it up.

If a witness is compelled to testify, he or she must give "the whole truth, and nothing but the truth." In the US, there is an escape clause which allows a person to remain silent to avoid incriminating him/herself. In Canada, there is no such clause. The witness must testify completely and truthfully. However, any incriminating statements made by a witness in Canadian courts cannot be used against them in subsequent proceedings.

Simply put, in the US you don't have to testify where your testimony might incriminate you. In Canada, you do, but your testimony can't be used against you.

And again, no prosecutor would call a witness unless they were fairly certain of what information that witness has, and that the witness would testify truthfully. But again, it sounds like there are ample witnesses to this crime, and the police only need anonymous information now.

[MelBridgeman]

this type of scenario happened to me about 12 years ago, a car full of people were not let into a party out in springbank - they came back with 20 more friends and crashed the place with thick iron rods and swung at anyone they could, threw my buddy in the large burning fire pit etc....lots of people were hurt, but no one was killed....

I still get fired up over this, stupid little punks...

I hope they catch the guy and toss him in jail, in fact toss his parents in jail too, if he is underage they should be held responsible too.

[Cube Inmate]

I went to a few house parties in the olden days...even some up in the dreaded northeast Calgary!...but never ran into anything that got out of hand.

I think I'm going to start saving news clippings so that when my future kids decide that they're smarter than me and they want to go to a crazy house party, I can show them some of the more interesting consequences.

Screw this town anyhow... I'm getting out as soon as I can.

[urban1]

Its a formality in the sense that this is going to end up in court and you need an official cause of death. Otherwise you could have a defense attorney argue this kid die from a fall down some stairs or that he was drunk and fell or any other number of scenarios if you dont have an official cause of death.

Originally Posted by Schultzie

I don't quite understand why they would preform an autopsy, though. I mean, it seems pretty obvious to me why he died. Is it just for formality's sake?

[urban1]

As for Queensland, I didnt now this was a bad part of Calgary. I never go that far down in the SE. I google mapped the address and saw that this was near Fish Creek and assumed it was a decent area of town.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by urban1

As for Queensland, I didnt now this was a bad part of Calgary. I never go that far down in the SE. I google mapped the address and saw that this was near Fish Creek and assumed it was a decent area of town.

It is decent.
The problem with Calgary is that decent areas are the ones producing the violent youth as middle class gangsters. Violent teens are coming from Calgary's nicest areas.
I don't what it is, but so many teens in this city are little pieces of sh*t. Every high school is full of little thugs.

[I-Hate-Hulse]

Originally Posted by Cube Inmate

Screw this town anyhow... I'm getting out as soon as I can.

I honestly don't think it's Calgary, so much as it is a shift in societal behaviors. Running to a smaller city won't change much either, as evidenced by Halifax's latest gem:

http://www.cbc.ca/cp/Atlantic/070928/t092821A.html

Media reports have suggested the attack, which occurred in a wooded area behind John Martin Junior High School, lasted about two hours. In that time, three girls, age 14, 15 and 18, allegedly beat the victim unconscious, reviving her repeatedly to batter her again, according to reports.
The 14-and 15-year-old girls are facing charges under the Youth Criminal Justice Act. The 18-year-old is charged as an adult.
According to unnamed sources quoted in local papers, the victim was rolled down a hill, made to walk up it without socks or shoes and then kicked and punched.
The young woman, who fled while her alleged assailants stopped for a cigarette break, suffered a fractured eye socket, broken nose and bruises on her face.
She also had cigarette burns inside her ears and on her tongue. Sources also told one paper that the girl's hair was set alight.

[llama64]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

It is decent.
The problem with Calgary is that decent areas are the ones producing the violent youth as middle class gangsters. Violent teens are coming from Calgary's nicest areas.
I don't what it is, but so many teens in this city are little pieces of sh*t. Every high school is full of little thugs.

Probably has something to do with the morons who are their parents. Parents have lost the concept of teaching and dicipline, and have handicapped the school system by limiting what they can do. This is a situation that is just gonna get worse.

<places curmudgeon hat on>

[4X4]

Wow. My grandma used to live on queen alexandra.

Whoever did this had to be on drugs. Acid or something.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally Posted by 4X4

Wow. My grandma used to live on queen alexandra.

Whoever did this had to be on drugs. Acid or something.

Probably booze.

[4X4]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

Probably booze.

You think? Yikes. I've been pretty drunk before, but never pickaxe-weilding drunk.

[Ford Prefect]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

It is decent.
The problem with Calgary is that decent areas are the ones producing the violent youth as middle class gangsters. Violent teens are coming from Calgary's nicest areas.
I don't what it is, but so many teens in this city are little pieces of sh*t. Every high school is full of little thugs.

I can hazard a guess as to why there so many rotten teens in Calgary, particularly from nice, middleclass neighbourhoods. We lived in Calgary up until our kids were in grades three and one respectively. They went to one of the better rated public schools in a newer NW community, so typical of the type of area you describe ... middle class, nice area. I was completely unimpressed with the teachers in that school and the fundamental policies of the school. It was one of those touchy, feely new age systems where kids weren't graded properly, let alone failed, because it might hurt their self esteem. Couldn't have that. Instead everyone was a winner and praised for every little thing possible ... "How wonderful you are Johnny, you tied your shoes. Here, put a big sticker in your agenda." The result? The kids all thought they were first round draft picks and deserved to be treated like little princes and princesses. In one extreme case I saw a kindergarten kid being escorted down the hallway by the principal, yelling obscenities at the principal and making threats. Did the little snot get any punishiment? Not a chance ... it could have given him a negative impression of himself.

And the teacher's had no prefessional committment ... they showed up for work 15 minutes before class, and were gone about 5 minutes after classes were over. In the classroom, many of them were just going through the motions. Many of them were openly hostile to the students, although I probably would have been too given the system in place and the way the little monsters were responding to it. Our son has suffered throughout his entire school career (he's now in grade 9) because of a grade one teacher he had who hated and was openly hostile to ALL little boys for no other reason than they were little boys. He went into grade one loving school and came out hating it. It has been a struggle ever since to get him to apply himself to learning. He's not dumb, but after grade one he tuned out and does the minimum required to get by. Bullying was also a major problem in that school. Sure, the school has a written policy of "Zero Tolerance" towards bullying. But it wasn't backup up with supervision or enforcment. Kids were getting beat up on the playground all the time. Knives were even present ... with kids as young as 8! There was no bullying in the school though according to the ostriches in charge.

The school in the small town we moved to (Drumheller) has a more old-school approach to learning. Students aren't automatically treated as if they're gifted prodigies. They have to earn their marks, and if they don't they actually fail the course or grade (gasp!). If they misbehave they're punished, with punishment ranging up to expulsion from the school. And the teachers are more committed to the kids and the community, largely because many of them are locals or have lived here for a long time, so they feel an obligation to the community and their own personal reputations. Many of these teachers actually volunteer to coach or supervise after school programs in sports, mucis, outdoor education, etc. I can't recall teachers in the Calgary school our kids attended volunteering for extracurricular acitivities.

The differing result between the two approaches can be seen in the way the kids behave as teens. We still keep in touch with some of the parents of the kids our kids went to school with in Calgary. Many of their old classmates are into drugs ... including three or four crackheads. One girl got pregnant and dropped out of school at 15. Others have been charged with petty crimes like theft, B&E and vandalism. A select few, those with strict parents, are still on the straight and narrow. The worst thing I've heard of any our kids' classmates here in Drum doing is getting liquored up and spewing all over the washroom at a high school dance. I wonder, do high schools in Calgary even host teacher chaperoned high school dances still?

Anyway, that's my long-winded reponse to the question you and others raised about what's wrong with the teens in Calgary today ... especially the middleclass kids from nice areas. It's not all the schools' fault I realize. Parents who are too busy to get involved with parenting their own kids are to blame too, but they already get their fair share of the blame. The Calgary school system tends to get let of the hook though, and based on my experience and observations they're a major part of the problem.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by 4X4

Wow. My grandma used to live on queen alexandra.

Whoever did this had to be on drugs. Acid or something.

Put me down for alcohol, and maybe something like cocaine. Cokeheads act aggressively, but I have never seen someone on acid act that way. If anything, people on acid act like peace loving hippies.

There is a 19 year old on myspace from Calgary with the name Matt McKay. I wonder if that was the guy.

[urban1]

Im not making excuses for anyone or justifying this but I imagine a scenario somewhat like this: Ive heard different numbers for the amount of people in the garage but imagine 20 or 30 or 40 people squeezed into a garage. People start pushing, punches get thrown, maybe someone else picks up a bat or a stick and starts swinging. Someone else grabs for the nearest item that could be used as a weapon and picks up the axe and starts swinging. Clearly not a good idea but in the heat of the moment where people are fighting in a tight space and probably a lot of commotion, nobody probably is thinking straight.

If a suspect gets arrested, my guess is he will be charged with manslaughter and not murder. It would be one thing if this guy brought a pick axe with him and carried it around with the intent of using it as a weapon. But if a fight broke out in a garage where this thing was laying around, I can see it even being argued as self-defense. If Im a small guy and theres a group of guys threatening to assault me, is it reasonable force to swing around a pick axe? Our liberal courts might let this guy walk with time served if he sits in jail while awaiting trial.

[ken0042]

Originally Posted by 4X4

You think? Yikes. I've been pretty drunk before, but never pickaxe-weilding drunk.

So, I'm guessing you aren't a rye drinker then?

[Slava]

Ford, I usually agree with a lot of what you say...but this time I don't entirely. The teachers are simply not the major difference over the past 15 years...its the parents. My wife used to teach, and the problem was the adults! Neither the administrators nor the parents of the children would allow you to discipline the kids.

It was either some misguided system as you describe I guess, or more commonly the parents who thought that their children were little angels and couldn't have possibly done what they were being punished for.

I don't think that it should come as a surprise that with more two income families and less parenting in general that kids lose their bearings!

[JohnnyB]

Originally Posted by Ford Prefect

I can hazard a guess as to why there so many rotten teens in Calgary, particularly from nice, middleclass neighbourhoods. ...

I'm genuinely sorry to hear about your and your kid's experiences with that one school in Calgary Ford. I don't think it's at all fair to generalize that experience as the standard among Calgary schools though. I'm confident there are still good schools in Calgary, with committed and professional teachers who volunteer a lot of time to help kids with extracurriculars. I'm sure whatever problems there are in Calgary are far more complicated than crappy schooling.

[4X4]

Originally Posted by ken0042

So, I'm guessing you aren't a rye drinker then?

You are correct. The only times I've been 'mean' drunk is when I've consumed a few too many rye & gingers. I don't do that anymore. I'll still have one or two, but if the night is about drinking, it's strictly beer or red wine or caesers...

But, you do make a very good point. The hard liquor in a young person's system. I suppose I could see a violent attack like that especially if the guy has alot of enemies. Or had.

[Ford Prefect]

Originally Posted by JohnnyB

I'm genuinely sorry to hear about your and your kid's experiences with that one school in Calgary Ford. I don't think it's at all fair to generalize that experience as the standard among Calgary schools though. I'm confident there are still good schools in Calgary, with committed and professional teachers who volunteer a lot of time to help kids with extracurriculars. I'm sure whatever problems there are in Calgary are far more complicated than crappy schooling.

Yes, I agree, the problems are more complicated than just crappy schools. I think the schools are a part of the problem that many overlook though. I guess that's the point I'm trying to make.

[SeeGeeWhy]

Queensland is one of those areas that 'looks nice enough' on the surface and is surrounded by nice areas, but has a pretty bad drug problem crawling under its skin.