Coyotes Tempe Entertainment District/Arena photos

[Ducay]

It looks like a 50/50 blend of Calgary's proposal and Edmonton's starship. Perhaps a good middle ground in aesthetics, but for me it just reminds me of how uninspired Calgary's design & location are.

[Jordan!]

Originally Posted by topfiverecords

Oh I’m not bothered. I and others just like giving him a hard time. Like a nephew or a little brother.

This was fun in 2002, I'm 40 now with a career and a family. lol

I haven't had a wine cooler in a decade+

I honestly don't mind it, and like someone above said. Calgarypuck is the best hockey community online in my opinion. I honestly have opened up to being a Flames fan and follow the team more than i have used to and if the Yotes move away. I can't really imagine following another NHL team but The Flames.

[Jordan!]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

I wonder if having the arena unavailable for 40+ nights a year was locking them out of other better options (concerts etc.).

That was the issue with the Aeros in Houston. The owner of the arena was sick of having prime weekend dates booked by a tenant who wasn't paying top dollar, even though it was giving them some occupancy.

Cliffnotes: it wasn't..

Footprint/Suns arena has always been the prefered concert destination while being a turd.. it is now renovated and even more popular.

Glendale paid an economist to look into it and their data, which isn't public is suspect to assume that 20 events are better than 40+ Coyotes games.. But good luck securing 20+ events during a pandemic that will likely draw on for another 2-3 years.. why not just get more rent from the Coyotes and secure a tennant during those years?

Glendale is run by total morons who have no clue.. huge reason why the team will never see it viable without considering the location. Any agreement with that town isn't worth the paper it's written on.

[The Familia]

Here are the issues with the new arena from my point of view. First, there is no point arguing the style of the arena as that is subjective. Some people really like futuristic arenas like Vegas or Edmonton, while some prefer more subtle or traditional arenas like Detroit or Nashville/Columbus. With that said, here is a list of deficiencies with Calgary's proposal and how to fix it.

1. Parkade. The attached parkade is literally the biggest issue in my mind. It takes up much needed space from a lot that is already super small and tight at best. This forces the arena to shrink its usable floor space and place restrictions on its design. The parkade provides zero benefit to the general public as it will be used exclusively by the team/management and a few rich patrons who can afford it. There is no shortage of parking in the area. There is a new $80 million dollar parkade a couple blocks north in addition to the multiple surface lots in and around Victoria Park. Don't forget the actual Stampede grounds themselves! As these lots develop over time, the completion of the Green Line should alleviate any issues by removing drivers. A reduced arena capacity also reduces the number of vehicles. If the Flames are hell bent on a parkade, why not build it on the small parcel of land immediately to the south and build some retail into the base?

2. Building Transparency. The arena looks like a bunker with only a small percentage of its exterior being windows. This automatically makes the arena feel hostile to the pedestrian realm, especially when it is supposed to be one of two anchors of an entertainment district. People want to see inside the arena. The arena should be inviting and open to the street. The west side appears to do a decent job of this with the restaurants/patios and team store along this stretch. This side is transparent and built with a human scale in mind. The north, east, and south are hostile and uninviting. Blank walls, a parkade, and loading docks litter all three sides. There is nothing to see and no reason to stay or linger. Solution? Remove the parkade. Loading docks and back of house should remain on the east side. Duplicate the west side treatment to the north and south. If there is no room to do both, prioritize the north and southwest corner.
The upper window wall treatment which they have on the northwest side should continue down the entire length of the west side and wrap around the southwest corner. It should also be applied to the entire north side as well. This will open up the building and make it feel more transparent and part of the urban fabric.

3. Public Plaza. The southwest plaza is too small. It should be expanded if possible and include the entire intersection and part of the small lot to the south. There should also be a larger plaza/entry on the northwest corner as that will be a primary entrance for people coming from the Green Line, East Village, and the new hotel proposed across the street. Again, removing the parkade should provide more room to accomplish some of this.

I spoke with a project manager who works with CMLC and is on the project management team of the BMO center renovation. While they are not directly involved in the arena project, they did say the Flames have always been the driver of the actual arena design and CMLC was more of the driving force behind keeping it pedestrian friendly and integrating it with pedestrian realm. Contrary to what Pepsi has been saying, CMLC was not a driver behind the actual design. I guess we should be thankful that we are at least getting some retail on the west side. It could be much worse.

[PepsiFree]

Excuse me sir, this is an Arizona Wendy's.

[topfiverecords]

[Monahammer]

Originally Posted by The Familia

Here are the issues with the new arena from my point of view. First, there is no point arguing the style of the arena as that is subjective. Some people really like futuristic arenas like Vegas or Edmonton, while some prefer more subtle or traditional arenas like Detroit or Nashville/Columbus. With that said, here is a list of deficiencies with Calgary's proposal and how to fix it.

1. Parkade. The attached parkade is literally the biggest issue in my mind. It takes up much needed space from a lot that is already super small and tight at best. This forces the arena to shrink its usable floor space and place restrictions on its design. The parkade provides zero benefit to the general public as it will be used exclusively by the team/management and a few rich patrons who can afford it. There is no shortage of parking in the area. There is a new $80 million dollar parkade a couple blocks north in addition to the multiple surface lots in and around Victoria Park. Don't forget the actual Stampede grounds themselves! As these lots develop over time, the completion of the Green Line should alleviate any issues by removing drivers. A reduced arena capacity also reduces the number of vehicles. If the Flames are hell bent on a parkade, why not build it on the small parcel of land immediately to the south and build some retail into the base?

2. Building Transparency. The arena looks like a bunker with only a small percentage of its exterior being windows. This automatically makes the arena feel hostile to the pedestrian realm, especially when it is supposed to be one of two anchors of an entertainment district. People want to see inside the arena. The arena should be inviting and open to the street. The west side appears to do a decent job of this with the restaurants/patios and team store along this stretch. This side is transparent and built with a human scale in mind. The north, east, and south are hostile and uninviting. Blank walls, a parkade, and loading docks litter all three sides. There is nothing to see and no reason to stay or linger. Solution? Remove the parkade. Loading docks and back of house should remain on the east side. Duplicate the west side treatment to the north and south. If there is no room to do both, prioritize the north and southwest corner.
The upper window wall treatment which they have on the northwest side should continue down the entire length of the west side and wrap around the southwest corner. It should also be applied to the entire north side as well. This will open up the building and make it feel more transparent and part of the urban fabric.

3. Public Plaza. The southwest plaza is too small. It should be expanded if possible and include the entire intersection and part of the small lot to the south. There should also be a larger plaza/entry on the northwest corner as that will be a primary entrance for people coming from the Green Line, East Village, and the new hotel proposed across the street. Again, removing the parkade should provide more room to accomplish some of this.

I spoke with a project manager who works with CMLC and is on the project management team of the BMO center renovation. While they are not directly involved in the arena project, they did say the Flames have always been the driver of the actual arena design and CMLC was more of the driving force behind keeping it pedestrian friendly and integrating it with pedestrian realm. Contrary to what Pepsi has been saying, CMLC was not a driver behind the actual design. I guess we should be thankful that we are at least getting some retail on the west side. It could be much worse.

Aye! I agree with all of this. And what I stated last page when I compared the two projects.

[Jordan!]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Excuse me sir, this is an Arizona Wendy's.

Pretty sure John Chayka is managing several Wendy's restaurants right now during his NHL exile.. i'm not joking, so this applies

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Jordan!

Cliffnotes: it wasn't..

Footprint/Suns arena has always been the prefered concert destination while being a turd.. it is now renovated and even more popular.

Glendale paid an economist to look into it and their data, which isn't public is suspect to assume that 20 events are better than 40+ Coyotes games.. But good luck securing 20+ events during a pandemic that will likely draw on for another 2-3 years.. why not just get more rent from the Coyotes and secure a tennant during those years?

Glendale is run by total morons who have no clue.. huge reason why the team will never see it viable without considering the location. Any agreement with that town isn't worth the paper it's written on.

Well if what you’re saying is accurate I kind of get their logic. I’ll take my shot at 20 events vs the Coyotes. I have no clue how well run the city of Glendale is, but we’re talking about the Coyotes here.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

Aye! I agree with all of this. And what I stated last page when I compared the two projects.

Agreeing with Familia on arena topics is like agreeing with Ricardo on Flames topics. You're playing a dangerous game, man.

Plus he said I suggested CMLC was driving the design, when that was you who said they were in charge of the project. He's insulting you, man. He got you, bro.

[Gordies Elbow]

Originally Posted by The Familia

1. Parkade. The attached parkade is literally the biggest issue in my mind. It takes up much needed space from a lot that is already super small and tight at best. This forces the arena to shrink its usable floor space and place restrictions on its design. The parkade provides zero benefit to the general public as it will be used exclusively by the team/management and a few rich patrons who can afford it. There is no shortage of parking in the area. There is a new $80 million dollar parkade a couple blocks north in addition to the multiple surface lots in and around Victoria Park. Don't forget the actual Stampede grounds themselves! As these lots develop over time, the completion of the Green Line should alleviate any issues by removing drivers. A reduced arena capacity also reduces the number of vehicles. If the Flames are hell bent on a parkade, why not build it on the small parcel of land immediately to the south and build some retail into the base?

If this is important to signing free agents (secured, attached parking,) does that impact how important it is?

[The Familia]

Not at all. If a free agent decides not to sign here because their parking garage is a block away than there are deeper issues at play. Poor spoiled millionaires can’t park across the street. Why does my tax money have to go to build their parkade? Again, I support the arena and have no problem using some tax dollars to fund it, but it must provide a return to the general public. An elitist parkade does not do that.

[sureLoss]

You know the parkade has nothing to do with player parking. They have their own parking spots in the loading dock next to the dressing rooms.

[Strange Brew]

The free agent comment was a joke. I laughed at least.

Hopefully the players can get early bird rates if they arrive before 8:00 AM.

[GioforPM]

The parking issue is controversial. I remember that much from CalgaryNext where there was not much parking and some complained, some said good.

[Sidney Crosby's Hat]

Originally Posted by Jordan!

This was fun in 2002, I'm 40 now with a career and a family. lol

I haven't had a wine cooler in a decade+

I honestly don't mind it, and like someone above said. Calgarypuck is the best hockey community online in my opinion. I honestly have opened up to being a Flames fan and follow the team more than i have used to and if the Yotes move away. I can't really imagine following another NHL team but The Flames.

Everyone drinks wine coolers now. They just call them hard seltzers.

[Jordan!]

Originally Posted by Sidney Crosby's Hat

Everyone drinks wine coolers now. They just call them hard seltzers.

#normalizecoolers

Pronouns: Cooler/Seltzer

[Gordies Elbow]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

You know the parkade has nothing to do with player parking. They have their own parking spots in the loading dock next to the dressing rooms.

The reason I raised it was that many players, particularly wealthy star players, may have security concerns. It wasn't meant as a dig.

That said, as at best, it looks like Calgary is building a Costco, parking in the loading dock sounds suitable - now, that's a dig. ;-)

[sureLoss]

nm

[PepsiFree]

Today I learned parkades are elitist.