[Rumour] Flames still trying to re-sign Russell

[Strange Brew]

I agree that none of these mistakes are giant mistakes. On Engelland I just believe we are paying too much for a "locker room guy" who is a healthy scratch periodically. I believe the guy would pass through waivers unclaimed tomorrow.

To add fuel to the fire, and it is pure speculation on my part - I bet Glencross was offered a three year deal at $3+ million per before he was traded. How would that look today?

Anyway let's see how BT does over the next 12 months. For me, I will really be watching the contracts he hands out.

[Badgers Nose]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

No it doesn't.

They signed those guys when they thought they were going to sucking.

That does not mean they will keep doing that.

The problem is born of the teams success. I agree.

We did not think they would be good this quick.

Average goaltending for the first 20 and flames we be 2-3 in the playoffs with games in hand.

So they dont need the filler anymore, and that problem will take care of itself or BT will fix it even sooner.

As long as they dont sign anymore filler contracts. I think Russell fits into the filler category. Let him cash in somewhere else. A shot blocker will be valuable at the deadline.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by Badgers Nose

The problem is born of the teams success. I agree.

We did not think they would be good this quick.

Average goaltending for the first 20 and flames we be 2-3 in the playoffs with games in hand.

So they dont need the filler anymore, and that problem will take care of itself or BT will fix it even sooner.

As long as they dont sign anymore filler contracts. I think Russell fits into the filler category. Let him cash in somewhere else. A shot blocker will be valuable at the deadline.

This good? They aren't good. They did well last year. This year's team had one good stretch on home ice but have been terrible besides that. You can blame the goaltending for the start of the year. In the last month with normal goaltending - they've gone 5-6-1.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

No it doesn't.

They signed those guys when they thought they were going to sucking.

That does not mean they will keep doing that.

They are evidently trying to sign Russell which is again the same thing after signing Bouma to a 3 year contract this summer.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by PeteMoss

They are evidently trying to sign Russell which is again the same thing after signing Bouma to a 3 year contract this summer.

How could it be? Different players, different positions, potentially different cap amounts, different terms. Why are you trying to equate them?

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

I agree that none of these mistakes are giant mistakes. On Engelland I just believe we are paying too much for a "locker room guy" who is a healthy scratch periodically. I believe the guy would pass through waivers unclaimed tomorrow.

Well you can believe that all you want, it isn't reality. Veteran defensemen are more valuable than you think. We traded a 3rd for Staios a few years back. Engelland is very similar in role and contract. Depth defensemen have value to playoff teams.

He's a healthy scratch periodically only because we're sitting another legit top 6 defenseman in Smid who needs playing time too. If our defense wasn't as deep Engelland would never be a healthy scratch.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by PeteMoss

This good? They aren't good. They did well last year. This year's team had one good stretch on home ice but have been terrible besides that. You can blame the goaltending for the start of the year. In the last month with normal goaltending - they've gone 5-6-1.

If they started the season 5-6-1 after 12 games they would be in a spot with games in hand

Goal tending isnt the only issue but it has certainly cost the team 5 or so games...thats 10 facking points

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by dino7c

If they started the season 5-6-1 after 12 games they would be in a spot with games in hand

Goal tending isnt the only issue but it has certainly cost the team 5 or so games...thats 10 facking points

It also gave them a home winning streak. If they lose a few in the middle of that they're tied with Columbus. They are who their record says they are at this point

[AltaGuy]

Before the season, I would've wanted to re-sign Russell, but our team needs some work, and I think collecting some extra pieces at the deadline is probably the better play given where we find ourselves this season.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

How could it be? Different players, different positions, potentially different cap amounts, different terms. Why are you trying to equate them?

They are both bottom of the roster players (or should be when the team is good).

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Badgers Nose

The problem is born of the teams success. I agree.

We did not think they would be good this quick.

Average goaltending for the first 20 and flames we be 2-3 in the playoffs with games in hand.

So they dont need the filler anymore, and that problem will take care of itself or BT will fix it even sooner.

As long as they dont sign anymore filler contracts. I think Russell fits into the filler category. Let him cash in somewhere else. A shot blocker will be valuable at the deadline.

I think "this good" means exactly where they are now. The expectation a couple years ago was that they'd be a lottery team last year, maybe a mid level non PO team this year, and into the POs next year, followed by having a very competitive team for long post season runs for several years. By that standard, the Flames are still ahead of the curve.

[Lil Pedro]

I don't know why but I would still like to see him re-signed if the dollar and term are right. I think he brings stability to the second pairing as he has worked well with Hamilton. Would love to get rid of Smid, Engellend and/or Wideman but those contracts will be way too for most teams to even consider. Thank god they are all in their last years of their respective deals next year

[burnitdown]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

I think "this good" means exactly where they are now. The expectation a couple years ago was that they'd be a lottery team last year, maybe a mid level non PO team this year, and into the POs next year, followed by having a very competitive team for long post season runs for several years. By that standard, the Flames are still ahead of the curve.

By this standard, we're dangerously looking like we're behind the curve as it's more likely we're a lottery team this year as opposed to a playoff team. If it wasn't for our crappy division, we'd be way out of the mix.

[cam_wmh]

I'd rather they keep Russell, and find a way to trade Wideman, & maybe Smid too.
Nekladal deserves a look imo, and there is a logjam of 5/6/7 defensemen, whom are only holding the job due to tenure and contract status.

[Poe969]

I think a lot of people would rather trade our over paid guys and sign Russell to a reasonable deal but I don't think teams are lining up to take the guys we want to get rid of so since we're forced to keep some guys, we're going to have to let other guys go.

[Demetric]

should not resign russel, he is a possession black hole, end of story

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

Bollig is kind of irrelevant move IMO. His salary and term isn't big enough to handicap us. Gave us another good vet and a guy who could help protect kids. I don't think anyone should get worked up about that signing because it just doesn't really impact us going forward negatively.

Bollig for a 3rd wasn't irrelevant, it was awful. I'm not up in arms about it though because I only hold the expectation that you have to win more trades than you lose, and you can't lose when trading prime assets. It definitely wasn't irrelevant though, it would sure be nice to have an extra prospect instead of one the worst forwards in the NHL. I agree with the rest of your post though.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

Well you can believe that all you want, it isn't reality. Veteran defensemen are more valuable than you think. We traded a 3rd for Staios a few years back. Engelland is very similar in role and contract. Depth defensemen have value to playoff teams.

He's a healthy scratch periodically only because we're sitting another legit top 6 defenseman in Smid who needs playing time too. If our defense wasn't as deep Engelland would never be a healthy scratch.

I wouldn't use the Staios trade to support your argument. The Flames were fleeced in that deal and way overpaid.

Engelland is a periodic healthy scratch on a bad team. He was no better with the Penguins which is why many people were shocked to learn that $2.9 million was the AAV on his deal, not the total cost. Treliving almost immediately started rationalizing why he paid so much.

I don't believe our defense is as good as you think it is. The 7th defensemen on the Flames is no much better than the 7th d-man on other teams. If Engelland gets traded for a 3rd round pick though, or something similar, I will happily eat my words.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by burnitdown

By this standard, we're dangerously looking like we're behind the curve as it's more likely we're a lottery team this year as opposed to a playoff team. If it wasn't for our crappy division, we'd be way out of the mix.

I'm not sure that's true. We're 6-5 vs the central this year, but 4-8-2 vs Pacific. We're over .500 against non Pacific teams

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

I wouldn't use the Staios trade to support your argument. The Flames were fleeced in that deal and way overpaid.

I guess you must sit there on trade deadline day every year and think, wow every single veteran defencemen that moved was overpaid for. At some point maybe you should consider that the value of depth veteran defencemen near the deadline is higher than you think.