Canadian Federal Politics Thread v5

[Doctorfever]

Originally Posted by Johnny Makarov

Trudeau is pure crap and one of the top 3 worst PMs of all time!

But if PP becomes our PM he will be the worst PM of all time. Eff YOU Reform Party!

What do you mean “if”? I’m pretty sure you have stated PP will NEVER be PM. So how can he be the worst PM of all time if he NEVER gets elected?

[Azure]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Elections typically aren’t about a groundswell of popularity for a party or leader. They’re a referendum on the governing party. If the voting population is happy with the incumbents, they’re voted back in; if they’re unhappy, they turf the incumbents. The policies of the opposition don’t play much of a role.

When the NDP won the Alberta election in 2015, it wasn’t because Albertans fell in love with the NDP and their platform. It was because voters were sick of the PCs. It will be the same if the CPC win the next federal election.

What federal NDP supporters should be asking themselves is why the collapse of the Liberals has seen all that support shift to the CPC, and not to the NDP. Why haven’t the NDP capitalized on the unpopularity of the Liberals?

And despite this being true for decades in Canada, I have realized that NDP worshippers STILL don't get that people are literally going to vote PC even though they can't stand PP, and its only because the NDP is TRASH.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by MrSector9

Because the NDP have done nothing right since Layton basically... this last run they might as well be the Liberal party anyway. The population are seeing what we are receiving from the NDP/Liberal coalition nowhere nears the amount of losses through having a system where there is zero opposition (that matters with votes) and that Singh has less of a backbone than Trudeau when it comes up to legitiamtly standing up for Canadians.

It is bad when you start to see the NDP constituents distance themselves from the federal party in order to try to remain popular in their local riding for a hope to be re-elected.

Its actually amazing to watch.

The NDP could have distanced themselves from the Liberals, brought some actual NDP policies to the table, and likely would have gained seats in the upcoming election.

But their attachment to the Liberal death train is resulting in them likely to not gain anything at all.

Its literally a game of forehand / backhand, and the morons running the NDP keep wanting to play and don't understand why they keep getting slapped in the face.

And then we have Rube telling everyone 'omg why can't you give the NDP a chance, whine/sob/cry.'

[Johnny Makarov]

Originally Posted by Doctorfever

What do you mean “if”? I’m pretty sure you have stated PP will NEVER be PM. So how can he be the worst PM of all time if he NEVER gets elected?

True. Lib attack ads will doom him in Toronto.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

PP has promised a lot, does it get you excited? Do you believe him?

Some highlights.

Cutting income tax and eliminating carbon tax
Building homes - force municipalities to comply or else take away funding
Reducing federal budget/defunding govt programs/corruption
Fighting crime - "Jail not bail"
Increasing military to 2% of GDP

The only thing that PP is likely going to do is cut the carbon tax and kill CBC.

Both I agree with.

Outside of that I don't expect anything at all, nor is he likely to deliver on anything at all.

Immigration as an example is not going to be properly dealt with.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by belsarius

The only one that gets me even close to excited would be less corruption.. but that's a promise every politician makes, and knowing the Reform party, its the one I trust the least to actually happen.

- Our services can't survive with less income tax, and cutting the carbon tax is stupid too. The whole point of the carbon tax is to make things more expensive to force the market to bring alternatives.

- Any plan that "forces" someone to do something "or else" isn't a good plan.

- Reducing the budget in conservative terms is dropping off services for people that need them and giving to those who don't. (See Alberta UCP)

- "Jail not bail" is a populist ideal of how a complex system should be working without looking at all of the nuances of it. I don't like that there are more crimes being committed by people on bail, but I have neither the expertise or the knowledge to judge the current system - so this plank is useless.

- Increase military to 2% would be nice, but ultimately how is he going to square that with less taxes and less government budget. I know, lets cut the CBC and replace it with jet fighters than do nothing because Russia just threatens nukes anyways.

So honestly, no, nothing about what PP says makes me excited to see him in government.

This is actually something I agree with Singh about. Its an arbitrary number we agreed to with NATO, but is it really rational? Does it make sense?

I don't know. Maybe thats low. Maybe thats too high. Has anyone actually done any due diligence on that figure?

Besides...GDP is a fluctuating number, what genius tied defense spending to a number that changes all the time?

What if it drops? Do we have to sell stuff?

[Zulu29]

Originally Posted by Locke

This is actually something I agree with Singh about. Its an arbitrary number we agreed to with NATO, but is it really rational? Does it make sense?

I don't know. Maybe thats low. Maybe thats too high. Has anyone actually done any due diligence on that figure?

Besides...GDP is a fluctuating number, what genius tied defense spending to a number that changes all the time?

What if it drops? Do we have to sell stuff?

2% is the floor

[belsarius]

Originally Posted by Locke

This is actually something I agree with Singh about. Its an arbitrary number we agreed to with NATO, but is it really rational? Does it make sense?

I don't know. Maybe thats low. Maybe thats too high. Has anyone actually done any due diligence on that figure?

Besides...GDP is a fluctuating number, what genius tied defense spending to a number that changes all the time?

What if it drops? Do we have to sell stuff?

And CC made a good point a few post ago about how derelict our forces have become than even with 2% spending, we need a massive capital infusion to get our readiness up to the point where the 2% even matters.

[PepsiFree]

Guys please stop deflecting from the latest Liberal scandal.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by belsarius

- "Jail not bail" is a populist ideal of how a complex system should be working without looking at all of the nuances of it. I don't like that there are more crimes being committed by people on bail, but I have neither the expertise or the knowledge to judge the current system - so this plank is useless.

I agree "jail not bail" is populist rhetoric. But you not having knowledge or expertise doesn't make criminal justice reform useless - it just means you aren't qualified to judge whether the specific action plan is a good idea or not.

I mean, I'm not either, so I'm not saying the CPC plan is a good idea, but whether either of us individually understand it doesn't determine whether it's a good idea.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by belsarius

And CC made a good point a few post ago about how derelict our forces have become than even with 2% spending, we need a massive capital infusion to get our readiness up to the point where the 2% even matters.

My understanding is that we're not even at the 2% floor, I thought we were at 1.6% or somewhere thereabouts.

And I agree that our military could use an infusion of cash. I think that goes without saying.

However, I'm still not convinced that our military spending should be tied to GDP. Tying spending to a fluctuating number doesn't make sense to me. Thats not proper budgeting.

[Johnny Makarov]

Easy solution. Just order 15 million drones. Done!

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Johnny Makarov

Easy solution. Just order 15 million drones. Done!

The thing is, and I know this is ridiculous, but I just think of my Greyhound story about the fans.

We buy a bunch of stuff to be in compliance but we just throw it into storage.

"Technically" we're good. But really? We've accomplished nothing.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Locke

My understanding is that we're not even at the 2% floor, I thought we were at 1.6% or somewhere thereabouts.

And I agree that our military could use an infusion of cash. I think that goes without saying.

However, I'm still not convinced that our military spending should be tied to GDP. Tying spending to a fluctuating number doesn't make sense to me. Thats not proper budgeting.

I think the 2%, arbitrary or not, is for our NATO commitments. I don’t know if it’s the right or wrong number but if as a country you commit to doing something then you should follow through on that commitment to your allies. My understanding is that there is a lot of grey in how that spending is calculated, for example I don’t believe any of the money/equipment being donated to Ukraine right now counts towards that spending(someone who knows more specifics may be able to correct me on that) even though it has a benefit to NATO but that’s something that should be addressed through NATO and not by avoiding the required commitments you’ve made.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by Azure

Its actually amazing to watch. The NDP could have distanced themselves from the Liberals, brought some actual NDP policies to the table, and likely would have gained seats in the upcoming election.

Well, no. If they hadn't engaged in their current faustian bargain, the election would have already happened, the party wouldn't have the funds to effectively compete, and they would have gotten massacred. This was always, first and foremost, about delaying until they could rebuild the coffers.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

I think the 2%, arbitrary or not, is for our NATO commitments. I don’t know if it’s the right or wrong number but if as a country you commit to doing something then you should follow through on that commitment to your allies. My understanding is that there is a lot of grey in how that spending is calculated, for example I don’t believe any of the money/equipment being donated to Ukraine right now counts towards that spending(someone who knows more specifics may be able to correct me on that) even though it has a benefit to NATO but that’s something that should be addressed through NATO and not by avoiding the required commitments you’ve made.

Oh I know it is.

I'm just saying that tying a commitment to a fluctuating number is stupid.

Maybe its too high. Maybe its not high enough? Who knows?

[belsarius]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

I agree "jail not bail" is populist rhetoric. But you not having knowledge or expertise doesn't make criminal justice reform useless - it just means you aren't qualified to judge whether the specific action plan is a good idea or not.

I mean, I'm not either, so I'm not saying the CPC plan is a good idea, but whether either of us individually understand it doesn't determine whether it's a good idea.

For sure, but that is also why I say it doesn't make me excited, and not me saying I disagree with the idea of reform. What I really disagree with is the idea that reform is "Jail not bail". I'm not saying that reform might not be necessary, but for me to get me excited for it as a change, I need some kind of backup reasoning being the anecdotal issues that are occurring.

Maybe once the election cycle starts he'll provide more meat to chew on and I can come back to it then.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by Azure

The only thing that PP is likely going to do is cut the carbon tax and kill CBC.

Both I agree with.

Outside of that I don't expect anything at all, nor is he likely to deliver on anything at all.

Immigration as an example is not going to be properly dealt with.

The key to immigration reform is closing the international student loophole.

[calgarygeologist]

Labour Minister Seamus O'Regan is stepping down from his Cabinet role.

[Firebot]

Quite unfortunate for PepsiFree, Liberals making breaking news again

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/ore...inet-1.7267551

With Freeland also being speculated to be getting booted from finance minister with the upcoming cabinet meeting, and Trudeau trying to woo Mark Carney, is Carney actually joining now instead of waiting for the election?