[PGT] Flames Win Again: Calgary 7 - San Jose 3

[dino7c]

it doesn't help they light up the empty seats so they stand out

fair weather fans

[Classic_Sniper]

Yep, as I said in the previous thread, Lucic certainly still has the ability to surprise people. I think he got himself a little bit of redemption on all those that thought he was a useless bum. The dude is no Matthew Tkachuk, but he hasn't lost the smarts or the deft hands for a big man.

Personally, I still think he's got a little bit left in the tank. Just put him on the right line and he can still be a factor. He can't be that 4th line guy trying to drive a line, that's not him. He's a complementary player who can make the occasional slick pass, play strong below the hashmarks and crowd the crease. Good on him for taking advantage tonight, dude has had a rough month.

[getbak]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

Has attendance been that bad all season in San Jose? I don't know what the "official" numbers were, but that arena looked 2/3rd empty for the whole game. Is the fanbase there that fair weathered?

Or was this just a case of it being a weekday game, against a Canadian team, less than a week before Christmas when people are too busy?

Tonight was 10,431. Their average this season is 13,640, which is only ahead of Arizona.

[CGY12]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

Do you actually contribute anything about the game or just go around policing anything negative said about the Flames and just chase the posters around and using your posts to call them out while not offering anything of substance.

You will get used to it if you stick around long enough.

[topfiverecords]

Somebody turned old today.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

Has attendance been that bad all season in San Jose? I don't know what the "official" numbers were, but that arena looked 2/3rd empty for the whole game. Is the fanbase there that fair weathered?

Or was this just a case of it being a weekday game, against a Canadian team, less than a week before Christmas when people are too busy?

Just over 10000 announced for this game. They've had worse, I've seen a few in the 8-9k range.

[Dion]

[Hockey_Ninja]

The team definitely needed these two games. I know the California teams suck with the exception of LA, but they might as well get the easier points and build off of them for when they start playing the tougher teams

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by dino7c

it doesn't help they light up the empty seats so they stand out

fair weather fans

Lol, at fair weather fans. NHL fans are so misinformed sometimes on southern teams. Their arena holds 17500ish fans, it opened in 1993.

The Sharks were abysmal for a lot of their history, yet their average attendance since 1993? Amazing.

93 - 16537
94 - 17190
95 - 17190
96 - 17420
97 - 17111
98 - 16903
99 - 17290
00 - 17468
01 - 17422
02 - 17350
03 - 15835 (ironically when they went to the finals)
05 - 16831
06 - 17422
07 - 17411
skip...bunch of 17+
2018 - 17266
2019 - 16428
2021 - 12574 (pandemic capacity restrictions)
2022 - 13640 (pandemic capacity restrictions)

Sorry for the long form, attendance laden post, but I get triggered by canadian fans flippantly writing off southern US fans as fair weather when they're often not at all.

The Sharks fan base is knowledgable, loud and there in numbers throughout their history, even through the first decade when they were a laughing stock. You know what happened when the Flames were a laughing stock in a hockey mad country? You couldn't give away tickets, and the building was less than half full in terms of butts in seats a lot of nights. So if they're fair weather do you agree that Flames fans after fair weather, as well, Dino?

San Jose has hit a perfect storm of Covid fallout, inflation and uncertainty and a team that has made it clear that they went all in with major, boat achor contracts and can't complete for a few years at least.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

DOPS going to suspend the entire Flames team after this beat down.

lol this comment deserves appreciation

[jayswin]

Hell, even the Flames last year had many games 2000 under capacity and we were a top NHL team in a hockey market!!!! I despise the flippant comments towards southern team's fans sometimes on this board, when as Canadians that love the game of hockey we should be celebrating hot weather cities that embrace hockey.

I love hockey and I know for a fact I'd go to way less hockey games if it was 20-25 degrees outside every day.

[getbak]

Are there still COVID capacity restrictions in California?

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by getbak

Are there still COVID capacity restrictions in California?

No. I wasn't suggesting Covid restrictions were to blame this year, just that Covid/inflation/job loss have had a huge affect on attendance across all leagues, plus San Jose going into a pretty hopeless few years.

My contention was the absurd idea that San Jose fans are fair weather when they are quite literally the exact opposite of that over their history.

[SebC]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

I think tonight shows why save % is an overrated stat.

Originally Posted by TrentCrimmIndependent

tonight exemplifies the importance of the W/L stat for goalies

high quality shots against, so 3 get by him, but he shut the door when the game was on the line

end of the day not a glowing sv% but one of the key reasons they won

you can still consider it a good performance

One anomaly does not invalidate the general principle that SV% is the better measure of goaltending.

Advanced stats that account for shot quality may be better than SV% but W/L certainly isn't.

[FlamesAddiction]

I didn't say anything about southern markets. I don't really consider San Jose to be all that southern. Nor did I suggest that anywhere can't have fair weather fans. I was actually surprised to see attendance so low because I always considered it a prime market. I just noticed that the poor attendance this season also seems to be coinciding with a year that the team is awful.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by SebC

One anomaly does not invalidate the general principle that SV% is the better measure of goaltending.

Advanced stats that account for shot quality may be better than SV% but W/L certainly isn't.

And “advanced” stats just group shots by location and context

It’s better than shot counts but does not take in to account shot placement

One guy puts it in to the goalie’s logo, another goes over his shoulder past his ear bar down and statistically they have the same contribution to ‘advanced’ stats outside of outcome

Otherwise, sv% has a huge team contribution independent of individual contribution

Manny Fernandez and Dwayne Roloson agree

W/L is a macro stat that is simply a measure of GF vs GA on a per game basis

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by jayswin

San Jose has hit a perfect storm of Covid fallout, inflation and uncertainty and a team that has made it clear that they went all in with major, boat achor contracts and can't complete for a few years at least.

It doesn't help that the tech sector has taken a bit of a beating this year. San Jose has more or less been a permanent boom town since the 1980s, but lately they're having troubles just like the rest of us.

[CrazyCaper]

Originally Posted by dino7c

7 pounds 3 ounces?

Actually 8lbs 1oz but I thought that was asking alot Haha

[Tsawwassen]

Postgame links
https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/games/2466156/
https://www.espn.com/nhl/recap/_/gameId/401459103
https://stats.cbc.ca/hockey/nhl/recap/146133


The Flames sweep this mini series 2-0 and also win on aggregate 12-5.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

And “advanced” stats just group shots by location and context

It’s better than shot counts but does not take in to account shot placement

One guy puts it in to the goalie’s logo, another goes over his shoulder past his ear bar down and statistically they have the same contribution to ‘advanced’ stats outside of outcome

Otherwise, sv% has a huge team contribution independent of individual contribution

Manny Fernandez and Dwayne Roloson agree

W/L is a macro stat that is simply a measure of GF vs GA on a per game basis

The biggest thing that shot quality/high danger stats don’t count is the ability of the shooter. High danger (or even longer range) from Stamkos, Laine, Ovie etc is a little different than from other guys.