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Old 07-07-2022, 10:14 AM   #5901
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Originally Posted by PeteMoss View Post
Also - its obvious no one has any information on Gaudreau either. They are all just speculating based on what has happened at this point. I'm sure they are asking his friends, family etc but no one has any real information beyond that he's had an offer for a long time and hasn't signed anything.
It probably points towards the rumors of Gaudreau being undecided as true. Can’t have any information, if there is no information to be had.
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Old 07-07-2022, 10:14 AM   #5902
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I have this tiny unlikely nuggets of hope that the johnny deal us done. And it's just not announced due to BT trying to quietly move out sone big contracts.

But that thought or hope is probably just the devil messing with me.
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Old 07-07-2022, 10:15 AM   #5903
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That is not going to go over well with the negative/drama queen posters like Lanny.
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Old 07-07-2022, 10:18 AM   #5904
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It would be nice if at least one of the two of them got back to Treliving with some idea of their intentions before the draft starts….

Treliving:
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Old 07-07-2022, 10:25 AM   #5905
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It would be nice if at least one of the two of them got back to Treliving with some idea of their intentions before the draft starts….

Treliving:
Well, that doesn’t sound great.
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Old 07-07-2022, 10:28 AM   #5906
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Well, that doesn’t sound great.
Yeah I also read that grimly.
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Old 07-07-2022, 10:28 AM   #5907
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Kinda sounds like the org keeps begging them to stay and they keep holding out saying maybe.
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Old 07-07-2022, 10:29 AM   #5908
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It would be nice if at least one of the two of them got back to Treliving with some idea of their intentions before the draft starts….

Treliving:
Why would they do that? The GM is trying to squeeze value and has now lost the battle by not getting a deal done ahead of time. Their best option now is to test the market (Gaudreau) and/or wait until the other signs or walks (Tkachuk).

I have never been his biggest fan, but at this point, if Treliving pulls this off and retains both players long term, I will be seriously impressed because it's looking very grim at this point.
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Old 07-07-2022, 10:32 AM   #5909
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Doesn’t sound very good at this point of the game. I was optimistic that both would get done but starting to get the realization that may not be the case anymore.
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Old 07-07-2022, 10:32 AM   #5910
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Well, that doesn’t sound great.
I don't know about that. It's one thing to say you've made long term proposals, but another to say they've tabled their best possible offer.

If Treliving made that comment, then you could worry.
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Old 07-07-2022, 10:33 AM   #5911
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Johnny Gaudreau quickly becoming Johnny (you coulda told us!!) Tavares.
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Old 07-07-2022, 10:35 AM   #5912
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I don't know about that. It's one thing to say you've made long term proposals, but another to say they've tabled their best possible offer.

If Treliving made that comment, then you could worry.

Sure, but the fact there has been no discussion on the initial offer tells you a lot. Someone committed to staying would probably be working hard over the last month hammering out terms that work for both sides so that they are happy and they are sure that the team can remain competitive.

We can all hope this is a case of him simply wanting to see what's out there like Stamkos or Landeskog(?) but those cases are pretty few and far between.
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Old 07-07-2022, 10:36 AM   #5913
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If the rumours are true and Johnny was offered $9.5M x 8, you can't be surprised that he's going to test the market. I also think Tkachuk and his family have the desire to get that kid every dollar possible in his career. It's a family biz.

I believe both of them when they say they love Calgary, but they don't love it enough to take discounts.
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Old 07-07-2022, 10:37 AM   #5914
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So which way are you going?
It was a general statement in response to another.

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They didn't understand?
They ignored it?
A little bit of both? It looks like Treliving ignored the invocation of the limited NTC, believing he would have leverage over the player and be able to get a deal done. He gave up the only point of leverage he had over the player and handed all control over to the player and his representatives. When you give up those control factors you lose most negotiations. Tactical error on the part of the GM. The contract issue should have been resolved before the limited NTC kicked in as that was when all control was lost. With the successful season the player now has even more control as there is interest from a much larger number of suitors.

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Do you think Treliving just went rogue?
No, I think he put into play a faulty strategy that did not address the larger risk and maintain control over the team's future. Worse, he did not consider this outcome and pushed in as many chips as he could at the deadline. There was obviously a disconnect between what Treliving thought and what his coach thought about the team's chances based on actions and commentary of each. Going rogue? No. Just not having a well thought out strategy to keep the team competitive long term.

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You just love the negative drama so much ...
This isn't negative nor drama. It's the reality that managers have to understand and have plans in place for all possible outcomes. Allowing your best player to get to the point of walking for nothing, and another player able to force his way to UFA status just by accepting a qualifying number you negotiated, is just brutal management. He set up a possible worst outcome for the team and it is coming to fruition. It's awesome that he's talking tough to the usual "insiders" and giving the impression they are intent on signing both players, but the team has zero control over what is about to take place. That is just bad management.

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The management group talked to Gaudreau through last summer and didn't get a deal done. They would have kept the ownership group apprised at all times on how those talks were going. Ultimately the ownership group would have signed off on the plan to let it ride, and they did.
I don't buy this "kept ownership apprised at all times" narrative. Ownership hired Treliving to do a job and gave him the budget to surround himself with capable hockey people. If the owners are on speed dial for every decision that has to be made, that is indicative of them NOT having faith in Treliving's judgment. I think they have their regular communications sessions with ownership for updates, but I don't believe they are involved in every facet of contract negotiations. The team would be extremely difunctional if that were the case.

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There's nothing new today. There's no realization of having painted themselves into a corner without knowing it.
I think Treliving has a pretty good idea just how well he painted himself into a corner. He's now standing there and realizing just how much paint he put down and now is left with the only option he has, which is to wait for the paint to dry because he has no other course of action. He has no other control mechanisms at his disposal.

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If anything the season went better than expected with winning a division and a playoff series, so if they were comfortable going for it last summer they are likely prepared for whatever happens now.
Which is pretty bad management IMO. The future of the team is not within their control.
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Old 07-07-2022, 10:38 AM   #5915
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If the choice is between rebuilding or spending 20 million aav on two wingers...
Gaudreau is not your regular winger. He's too small to play centre, but he does all the playmaking and puck carrying that a centre usually does. Gaudreau is a legit franchise player.
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Old 07-07-2022, 10:40 AM   #5916
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Dang, I know it's eklund but he's noted gaudreau's rights are potentially being discussed with Philly and separately that teams are apparently lurking to make offers for tkachuk if gaudreau isn't re-signed.
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Old 07-07-2022, 10:42 AM   #5917
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They are known in business as "side letters" and they happen ALL the time. They don't form part of the main agreement for one reason or another...but they're still memorialized in writing.
They happen in business, but a side deal like that here would breach the CBA. So it wouldn't be in writing.
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Old 07-07-2022, 10:44 AM   #5918
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Is there anything that has been preventing Treliving from giving other teams permission to speak with Johnny before he's a UFA? Any regulation that prevents this?
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Old 07-07-2022, 10:44 AM   #5919
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Dang, I know it's eklund but he's noted gaudreau's rights are potentially being discussed with Philly and separately that teams are apparently lurking to make offers for tkachuk if gaudreau isn't re-signed.
Eklund is only useful for Philly stuff. But also only from philly side. Likely the source of this rumor is that philly has offered something for Gaudreau's rights.
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Old 07-07-2022, 10:44 AM   #5920
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It's not like that is a low ball offer. Every other team would be offering $10.85m just to match it over 7 years. I'm sure those teams exist but It's also been said that was just Calgary's initial offer "with room for negotiation".

His silence is more him and his wife mulling over where they want to spend the next 7 or 8 years of their life. He's earned that right to make that decision.
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