[News] Monahan on LTIR with season ending surgery. Kylington day to day. Mackey called up

[TheIronMaiden]

The same people kicking Monahan on the way down, can't be the same people who complain that UFA's don't want to play here, or RFA's wont take a deal.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Harry Lime

I don't think that we have seen enough of Mackey in the NHL yet, but judging from his history in the NCAA and AHL, he is probably the better overall defenseman if he gets enough ice to get used to the NHL speed. He has all of the tools and the hockey IQ to be a staple second or third pairing guy for a very long time.

Stone is decent in his own end, but the element that he brings to the table is definitely his shot. That adds a look to the defense that isn't there without him. (Andersson being the closest)

Stone really just has the shot advantage, and it's not that much of an advantage unless it gets through. When that happens it's great. But when his time is limited and he gets blocked, or if he misses for a self-clear, not so great. Stone has experience advantage - he's not going to be overwhelmed, but I haven't seen panic in Mackey's game.

[CroFlames]

Taking abuse in the slot, IMO, is the toughest aspect of the game. Monahan continually fought through it letting off absolute snipe after snipe and scoring goals.

Taking a body check (or giving one) is no where as punishing as being hacked, chopped, slashed, and otherwise brutalized in the front of the net and slot.

I still maintain Holmstrom (Wings dynasty for you youngins) is one of the toughest men to ever play the game in an age when defensemen were especially violent.

Monahan will always have my respect, and I am not counting him out yet. It would not shock me if he has a resurgence next year and people are talking about him as a key cog and extension discussions abound.

[MikeMc]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Probably Monahan, if I'm being honest. Despite narrative, Monahan won a lot of puck battles. More than his share. He had a good stick and often managed to put his larger frame between opposition and puck, whether it was aggressive or not. And Mangiapane often wound up on his butt. In fairness to Mangiapane, as a winger his puck battles are often up higher on the boards, where you need to be first to the puck to have a shot. Monahan's were mostly behind the red line.

Ok let's put this another way.

Which player would you want to 'go to war with' over a seven games playoff series?

Mangiapane would be an easy answer for me. Even if Monahan was the Monahan from a couple years ago.



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[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by MikeMc

Ok let's put this another way.

Which player would you want to 'go to war with' over a seven games playoff series?

Mangiapane would be an easy answer for me. Even if Monahan was the Monahan from a couple years ago.



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Well, recently, of course Mangiapane. But we were talking about board battles. You are moving the goalposts. And even a couple years ago Monahan was fighting injury.

But 2019 Monahan versus 2022 Mangiapane? No contest.

[tinkering]

I feel bad for being on Monahan's case for so long. It looked like he wasn't trying or he was disinterested, or scared of something. His skating didn't look right somehow but now it might make sense. He looked too 'upright' not bent at the knees enough. I think he was skating that way because of his hip and whatever else. All this time he was playing through injury and ailment like a trouper. I hope he has good success next season.

[redforever]

Originally Posted by CroFlames

Taking abuse in the slot, IMO, is the toughest aspect of the game. Monahan continually fought through it letting off absolute snipe after snipe and scoring goals.

Taking a body check (or giving one) is no where as punishing as being hacked, chopped, slashed, and otherwise brutalized in the front of the net and slot.

I still maintain Holmstrom (Wings dynasty for you youngins) is one of the toughest men to ever play the game in an age when defensemen were especially violent.

Monahan will always have my respect, and I am not counting him out yet. It would not shock me if he has a resurgence next year and people are talking about him as a key cog and extension discussions abound.

Yup, Joe Nieuwendyk will verify that. He got so hacked up that Bearcat Murray made him some king of flack vest to wear to protect his back from all the slashes he got.

[Flamesfan05]

Originally Posted by CroFlames

Monahan will always have my respect, and I am not counting him out yet. It would not shock me if he has a resurgence next year and people are talking about him as a key cog and extension discussions abound.

He deserves credit for the early years with Johnny but it would be shocking if he can return to form, short of a miracle.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

He deserves credit for the early years with Johnny but it would be shocking if he can return to form, short of a miracle.

Dude scored 22 goals without Gaudreau, as an 18 year old. Getting only 16 minutes per game. With guys like Sven, Colborne and Stempniak.

[TheScorpion]

Don't slag Stempniak on my watch, he rocked.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

Don't slag Stempniak on my watch, he rocked.

He did, but he was no Johnny Gaudreau.

The idea that Monahan could only score with Gaudreau feeding him pucks is like a zombie. No matter how times you kill it, it just won't go away.

[gvitaly]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Dude scored 22 goals without Gaudreau, as an 18 year old. Getting only 16 minutes per game. With guys like Sven, Colborne and Stempniak.

He was also an unknown in the league. Teams didn’t game plan for him as much. He had an easier time getting lost in coverage, all while getting shelter minutes, and PP time. If i’m not mistaken it was also Hartley’s team, and those teams were more known for sacrificing defense for a quick transition and rush chances, but I can’t remember if it was a factor.

It was still an awesome accomplishment, but you also need to have some perspective when waiving the 22 goal flag.

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by gvitaly

He was also an unknown in the league. Teams didn’t game plan for him as much. He had an easier time getting lost in coverage, all while getting shelter minutes, and PP time. If i’m not mistaken it was also Hartley’s team, and those teams were more known for sacrificing defense for a quick transition and rush chances, but I can’t remember if it was a factor.

It was still an awesome accomplishment, but you also need to have some perspective when waiving the 22 goal flag.

You could make nuanced arguments like this about every player in the league at any moment in time.

- Wayne scored 92 in a season... yeah but he played in the 80s.
- Mathews might top 65 this year... yeah but scoring is up league-wide.
- Johnny is going to get 100+ points... yeah but he's playing with two other stars.

Fact is, Monahan scored 22 in the NHL as a rookie, playing on a crappy team and without Johnny. The league quickly took notice of him yet he still improved year over year until injuries took their toll.

[GioforPM]

So was Monahan nothing without Gaudreau or someone trans should have game planned for at age 18?

[gvitaly]

Originally Posted by CroFlames

You could make nuanced arguments like this about every player in the league at any moment in time.

- Wayne scored 92 in a season... yeah but he played in the 80s.
- Mathews might top 65 this year... yeah but scoring is up league-wide.
- Johnny is going to get 100+ points... yeah but he's playing with two other stars.

Fact is, Monahan scored 22 in the NHL as a rookie, playing on a crappy team and without Johnny. The league quickly took notice of him yet he still improved year over year until injuries took their toll.

You missed my point. What I'm saying is that next year it will be harder for Monahan to score 22 than in his rookie year. Obviously it's an opinion, it takes into account the partial information we all have about his injuries usage and so on. At this point hoping for any sort of production out of Monahan next season is wishful thinking.

How do you guys expect Monahan to score goals if he and his line can't get the puck in the offensive zone? I get trying to be positive, but what part of Monahan's game makes you think he will rebound? I get defending Monahan the person, he sounds like a great guy, but Monahan the player has been a replacement level player for the last 2 seasons.

[dustygoon]

How did he not get put on LTIR before the trade deadline to make room for another significant addition?

Team doctors didn't know seriousness? Monahan hid it and waits until after the deadline to fess up? Just kind of strange.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by CroFlames

Fact is, Monahan scored 22 in the NHL as a rookie, playing on a crappy team and without Johnny. The league quickly took notice of him yet he still improved year over year until injuries took their toll.

He also had 12 assists for a whopping 34 points.

Then came Johnny and his points basically doubled.

Let’s not pretend he was some offensive juggernaut before Johnny.

Monny would have been a good player without Johnny (or a Patrick Kane type), but he wouldn’t have been nearly as productive.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by dustygoon

How did he not get put on LTIR before the trade deadline to make room for another significant addition?

Team doctors didn't know seriousness? Monahan hid it and waits until after the deadline to fess up? Just kind of strange.

Calgary likely wouldn’t have made another significant addition as they wouldn’t have wanted to spend anymore draft capital required.

[The Yen Man]

For all you Monahan doubters, if he does end up getting bought out, nothing would make me happier than to see him score 30+ again on another team and prove all the haters wrong. I'd be cheering for whichever team (other than the Oilers) he goes to. Yes, that includes the Leafs and the Canucks.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by The Yen Man

For all you Monahan doubters, if he does end up getting bought out, nothing would make me happier than to see him score 30+ again on another team and prove all the haters wrong. I'd be cheering for whichever team (other than the Oilers) he goes to. Yes, that includes the Leafs and the Canucks.

Alas, for me, when a player leaves I kind of put them aside. From Gilmour to Iggy to Bennett. Monahan will be no exception. In fact, I've kind of already done it since I see no way for him to be on the team next year, even fully recovered, because of Gaudreau, Mangiapane and Tkachuk.