Friedman: Flames have begun extension talks with Gaudreau & Eichel speculation

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

And the problem is that there are a lot of roster filler that simply did not work out

Czarnik. About to pop. Amounted to nothing. Leivo, Nordstrom, Simon, Nesterov, Rinaldo, etc.

Like I said, and you ignored this, I don’t put it all on Czarnik. As Roof mentioned, they pursued and didn’t even play the guy. So there was some sort of mismanagement, whether it was talent identification or player development / handling.

You can’t seriously call me out for pointing out a single roster filler signing that didn’t work out. Because there are several. That’s kind of the bigger problem.

When we are looking back fondly at Czarnik as a good off season signing we are getting in to Oiler territory.

My original point was that some off season moves were exciting at the time but didn’t work out. Off season excitement doesn’t always matter
You, as always, want to use that as a launching point to criticize the gm
Which you are welcome to do
I just don’t have much interest in discussing that with you.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

It's actually hard to understand what point you're trying to make.

Go ahead and re read it.

I had no idea what Jiri’s point was either. Czarnik is either an example of an exciting off season acquisition, about to pop, or a trivial signing for which Tre shouldn’t be questioned

Start there

[Jiri Hrdina]

Again I was speaking about how it was perceived at the time

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

My original point was that some off season moves were exciting at the time but didn’t work out. Off season excitement doesn’t always matter
You, as always, want to use that as a launching point to criticize the gm
Which you are welcome to do
I just don’t have much interest in discussing that with you.

Then you shouldn’t, I suppose (?)

The Czarnik signing was exciting. Sure. I was sold. Then they didn’t play him. What the heck happened?

Is it the same strategy they used developing Bennett? Haha. Keep him bottom line in the regular season and keep the contract down, knowing he’ll be there in the playoffs?

Why are you interested in giving credit for the moves based on potential, but uninterested in looking at how they turned out and why? And assessing whether that optimism was justified or whether you were sold a bag of goods.

That’s the thing they need to figure out. Why these exciting moves flopped, and how to make moves that won’t.

Like Estrada said earlier, I too am interested in problem solving and not repeating the mistakes of the past

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Again I was speaking about how it was perceived at the time

Classic Oilers. On top of the world in early October

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

Classic Oilers. On top of the world in early October

That also wasn't my point. I don't know how to explain it better.

You make this site less enjoyable for me. Don't bother replying to me going forward as you're going on ignore.

First poster for me. Congrats.

[RT14]

I don’t understand what you two are even arguing at this point but I don’t think DeluxeMustache deserves to be Jiri’s first ever block. He may not even be on the original point anymore but he sometimes contributes to the site.

That said, my take on Czarnik given how much effort was put into securing his rights, is that even though he was persuaded in part by the coach at the time, I feel like the Flames often reward your ice time not on how you’ve been playing relative to everyone else but instead how you’ve been playing relative to what they expect from you based on the bar they have set in their minds from seeing a small sample.

So maybe the GM and coach saw a certain skill set before he signed and when he couldn’t replicate that in the highest level of hockey in the world right away, instead of giving him more opportunity to achieve it they punished him until he did. It’s an approach that might work for some and definitely wouldn’t for others, ex. Bennett.

And when you think about it, maybe the players it works for are the legit players that you want to build around and the players that the tough love doesn’t work with, aren’t necessarily the ones that lead you to greater achievements.

[jjgallow]

Originally Posted by Britflamesfan

You are right the team waited far to long to trade Iggy and I fear the same thing has happened with JG. I was all for trying to keep MT until he threw a childish tantrum last season. Needs to go because I am not paying 9m for nonsense like that.

I don't disagree with you, but unfortunately it's worse than that, because there was some validity to his tantrum.

He was basically mad at the Flames for being a bunch of unloyal non-committal cowards on the ice.

He isn't wrong.

Two wrongs don't make a right, they just make a mess.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

That also wasn't my point. I don't know how to explain it better.

You make this site less enjoyable for me. Don't bother replying to me going forward as you're going on ignore.

First poster for me. Congrats.

I don’t understand the sentiment, but if you are having a bad day I hope tomorrow is better.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

The baffling thing about Czarnik to me is that Tre and Peters flew to see him and convince him to sign with the Flames. They targeted the kid and went all out to get him.

Then Peters barely played him.

Because, as it turns out, he wasnt very good at much more than being a fast skater.

Every team take a chance on players all the time, some work out, most don't.

Not sure why this would be a point of contention with the Flames. It's SOP league wide.

[Huntingwhale]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Because, as it turns out, he wasnt very good at much more than being a fast skater.

Every team take a chance on players all the time, some work out, most don't.

Not sure why this would be a point of contention with the Flames. It's SOP league wide.

He also played exactly 4 games for the Islanders last season. Too lazy to lookup if he was injured or something. But that hardly screams Flames' mismanagement to me. More like, the player wasn't as good as was originally hoped. This upcoming season of his contract is likely his last in the NHL at the rate he's going.

Czarnik is the typical do well in the AHL (PPG) but can't transfer it over to the NHL. The league has had hundreds of players throughout it's history like that who just can't take the next step to be a consistent NHLer. Frustrating for all parties involved, for sure.

[Moneyhands23]

Ahhhhhahaha!

Wow can you ever tell this is late August on CP!

Austin f'n Czarnik!

[Lanny_McDonald]

This is going to be a really long season folks. Our only saving grace is we play in a really ####ty division with a lot of the league's weak sisters. We may make the post season with the currently configured roster, but it will be another quick and painful first round blowout. On the bright side, we are one injury to a skilled player from being one of the worst teams in the league. That, or another season of sulking from Tkachuk. We're still two players away from having a competitive team and Treliving doesn't appear to have the mojo to get any deal done that makes us better. A long and cold winter is soon to be upon us.

[bax]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

This is going to be a really long season folks. Our only saving grace is we play in a really ####ty division with a lot of the league's weak sisters. We may make the post season with the currently configured roster, but it will be another quick and painful first round blowout. On the bright side, we are one injury to a skilled player from being one of the worst teams in the league. That, or another season of sulking from Tkachuk. We're still two players away from having a competitive team and Treliving doesn't appear to have the mojo to get any deal done that makes us better. A long and cold winter is soon to be upon us.

I love it here

[Macman]

We still don't have a proven back up goalie either.

[Moneyhands23]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

This is going to be a really long season folks. Our only saving grace is we play in a really ####ty division with a lot of the league's weak sisters. We may make the post season with the currently configured roster, but it will be another quick and painful first round blowout. On the bright side, we are one injury to a skilled player from being one of the worst teams in the league. That, or another season of sulking from Tkachuk. We're still two players away from having a competitive team and Treliving doesn't appear to have the mojo to get any deal done that makes us better. A long and cold winter is soon to be upon us.

Ya, I feel there's a good chance a lot of us will be looking at the reverse standings and cheering for a chance for Shane Wright come January

[bax]

There’s about a 0% chance the Flames will be one of the worst teams in the league. A Sutter team will always be competitive. Especially one with a bonafide top goalie.

Also has anyone looked at the rosters of Buffalo, Arizona, Detroit? Columbus, San Jose, Anaheim?

There are still lots of teams actively trying to lose

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Moneyhands23

Ya, I feel there's a good chance a lot of us will be looking at the reverse standings and cheering for a chance for Shane Wright come JanuaryAmerican Thanksgiving

FYP.

I've been giving Treliving all the rope in the world to get his ####ing job done, and all he's done with it is make a noose for himself and this team. His one job was to get this team built to play Sutter hockey, eliminate all distractions possible, and get this team out of the gate quickly. Wins in October are worth as much as ones in April, arguably more, seeing as you're still in the playoff hunt in October and possibly completely out of it come April. Treliving has not got the job done in any way. We still have no contract for Gaudreau. No resolution to the Tkachuk situation. Still "in the mix for Eichel." Still trying to "improve the team." The whole thing is in a state of flux. Yup, that's right, the Flames are all fluxed up under Treliving! I went into this post season with some hope that he would solve the obvious problems by using some basic strategies. So far he's done nothing but stick to his status quo management style that has paralyzed this organization and left them with a mediocre, highly unlikeable lineup. This should have all been done a while ago, but I figured give him until the middle of August. Deadline has passed. So has Treliving's "best before" date.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Macman

We still don't have a proven back up goalie either.

I think they are rolling with Vladar. They didn't trade a third to get him for him not to be the back-up.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

And the problem is that there are a lot of roster filler that simply did not work out

Czarnik. About to pop. Amounted to nothing. Leivo, Nordstrom, Simon, Nesterov, Rinaldo, etc.

Like I said, and you ignored this, I don’t put it all on Czarnik. As Roof mentioned, they pursued and didn’t even play the guy. So there was some sort of mismanagement, whether it was talent identification or player development / handling.

You can’t seriously call me out for pointing out a single roster filler signing that didn’t work out. Because there are several. That’s kind of the bigger problem.

When we are looking back fondly at Czarnik as a good off season signing we are getting in to Oiler territory.

Why does it have to be an organizational failing? The player wasn't that good.

He played four games on Long Island last year and had zero points ... could have been hurt, I haven't looked, but it certainly suggests the Islanders mishandled him too then?

He was a good gamble, and was well sought after. Didn't work out.

Not sure why it has to be on the Flames when a player isn't good enough, especially when they don't give up any assets to get the player.