2019/2020 Trade Speculation and Rumors 2.0

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

We all agree this team needs a #1 centre.
Are we willing to do the thing required to get one?
If not then basically we are expecting to produce one out of thin air or through a very lucky draft selection.

Again - no one should be considered untouchable on a team that hasn't done squat.

I agree with the point I think you’re making, but I wouldn’t call drafting a #1 center the same as plucking one out of thin air. That’s actually the best way to get one.

Of course with the way things stand today, that’s going to be difficult. In the short term.

And I guess let’s not say they haven’t done squat in game 6 of a playoff series.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

Lafreniere maybe, next year Cole Sillinger or Aatu Raty maybe... But frankly none of them are likely to reach Mackinnon level, and they're all #1 or #2 overall picks.

2022 Shane Wright so far is tracking like he could be a mackinnon. Might have said Matt Savoie but he did not show so well in the WHL. Jack Devine also looks fairly strong.

Do we really want the team to be bad about for a whole year to get one of these players though?

Yeah, you hope for an Mackinnon and you end up with an RNH. or a Yak.

[868904]

I really don’t think there’s going to be a lot of value to Gaudreau and Monahan. I highly doubt you are getting a top 10 pick for either Johnny or Mony. You are going to have to trade them for other flawed players.

Maybe Gaudreau and Monahan for Domi and Gallagher. Sign Hall.

Domi doesn’t have a great playoff record either but it’s just his first time. Gallagher had produced in the past, this year, his team is just overmatched.

Why does Montreal do it? Offense is a pretty big issue for them, and Gaudreau really fits into their history of highly skilled “flying Frenchmen”. Similarly, Domi and Gallagher really fit into the historic Flames identity of hard nosed blue collar workers.

Tkachuk-Domi-Gallagher (pos line)
Hall-Lindholm-Dube/Ryan
Mangiapane-Backlund-Gawdin
Lucic-Bennett-Ryan/Dube

Still don’t have an elite number 1 centre but damn that is a highly competitive group and a difficult team to play against.

Imagine dealing with Lucic and Bennett, then having to deal with Tkachuk-Domi-Gallagher.

You probably also get the best out of Lucic in the next couple of years with his rejuvenation adding one of his best buds in Gallagher.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

I’m entirely fine with taking a big step “back” rather than wasting another season.

To Buffalo: Sean Monahan
To Calgary: 2020 1st round pick (8th OA) + other stuff

To New Jersey: Johnny Gaudreau
To Calgary: 2020 1st round pick (7th OA)

Draft two of: Drysdale, Perfetti, Rossi, Lundell

Hope you can snag Lapierre, Holloway or Zary at 19th Overall.

There’s your basis for the 2nd Treliving era.

Next years roster:

Tkachuk - Backlund - Lindholm
Lucic - Bennett - Dube
Mangiapane - Ryan - ?
? - Jankowski (Yep) - ?

Hanifin - Andersson
Giordano - ?
Valimaki - ?

?
Rittich

I still think you chase Lehner, Hall, and Laviolette - but probably unlikely they choose Calgary.

That would be a dream summer.
We essentially have the same team as right now but with 2 passengers turned into top 10 picks. All upside.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

I agree with the point I think you’re making, but I wouldn’t call drafting a #1 center the same as plucking one out of thin air. That’s actually the best way to get one.

Of course with the way things stand today, that’s going to be difficult. In the short term.

And I guess let’s not say they haven’t done squat in game 6 of a playoff series.

Being in game 6 is better than the last 5 years, and the second best of the last 10.

[SportsJunky]

Originally Posted by Manhattanboy

Is there a MacKinnon type out there you build your team around? Other teams have gone back to square one and that’s where we find ourselves.

I think you have to draft an elite #1 C. The question for this team is, how?

There is talk that LA wants Stutzle who really is a W but there is no way of knowing that for sure. If they take Stutzle, that leaves Byfield available at #3. That should be where Calgary focuses as I can't see a realistic scenario where LA trades down from #2.

So, if Byfield is available, what would Melnyk want for #3? Chucky might be the only Flames chip that makes sense. Young, talented, family connection, etc...

Short of that, maybe you look at picks a little later in the draft, 5-10 kind of thing. Nothing wrong with a Perfetti or a Rossi. Not #1 centers but nice building blocks all the same.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

I’m entirely fine with taking a big step “back” rather than wasting another season.

To Buffalo: Sean Monahan
To Calgary: 2020 1st round pick (8th OA) + other stuff

To New Jersey: Johnny Gaudreau
To Calgary: 2020 1st round pick (7th OA)

Draft two of: Drysdale, Perfetti, Rossi, Lundell

Hope you can snag Lapierre, Holloway or Zary at 19th Overall.

There’s your basis for the 2nd Treliving era.

Next years roster:

Tkachuk - Backlund - Lindholm
Lucic - Bennett - Dube
Mangiapane - Ryan - ?
? - Jankowski (Yep) - ?

Hanifin - Andersson
Giordano - ?
Valimaki - ?

?
Rittich

I still think you chase Lehner, Hall, and Laviolette - but probably unlikely they choose Calgary.

I know people think that's a tank roster, but that might be good enough to pull a 2019 Islanders or 2015 Flames. Do we want that outcome?

[Stanley]

Originally Posted by 868904

I really don’t think there’s going to be a lot of value to Gaudreau and Monahan. I highly doubt you are getting a top 10 pick for either Johnny or Mony. You are going to have to trade them for other flawed players.

Maybe Gaudreau and Monahan for Domi and Gallagher. Sign Hall.

Domi doesn’t have a great playoff record either but it’s just his first time. Gallagher had produced in the past, this year, his team is just overmatched.

Why does Montreal do it? Offense is a pretty big issue for them, and Gaudreau really fits into their history of highly skilled “flying Frenchmen”. Similarly, Domi and Gallagher really fit into the historic Flames identity of hard nosed blue collar workers.

Tkachuk-Domi-Gallagher (pos line)
Hall-Lindholm-Dube/Ryan
Mangiapane-Backlund-Gawdin
Lucic-Bennett-Ryan/Dube

Still don’t have an elite number 1 centre but damn that is a highly competitive group and a difficult team to play against.

Imagine dealing with Lucic and Bennett, then having to deal with Tkachuk-Domi-Gallagher.

You probably also get the best out of Lucic in the next couple of years with his rejuvenation adding one of his best buds in Gallagher.

Domi, Gallagher, Dube, Ryan, Mange...is there anyone over 5'8"?

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

I know people think that's a tank roster, but that might be good enough to pull a 2019 Islanders or 2015 Flames. Do we want that outcome?

You can’t let a losing culture establish itself. It’s important to battle through and fight and scrape for what you can. If that roster can stay in the playoff fight until the end, it’s a good thing.

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Yeah, you hope for an Mackinnon and you end up with an RNH. or a Yak.

Or a Bennett

[868904]

Originally Posted by Stanley

Domi, Gallagher, Dube, Ryan, Mange...is there anyone over 5'8"?

They are all highly competitive players.

You could move Mangiapane and Ryan for bigger players. I don’t think you lose many battles with Tkachuk-Domi-Gallagher.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

I’m entirely fine with taking a big step “back” rather than wasting another season.

To Buffalo: Sean Monahan
To Calgary: 2020 1st round pick (8th OA) + other stuff

To New Jersey: Johnny Gaudreau
To Calgary: 2020 1st round pick (7th OA)

Draft two of: Drysdale, Perfetti, Rossi, Lundell

Hope you can snag Lapierre, Holloway or Zary at 19th Overall.

There’s your basis for the 2nd Treliving era.

Next years roster:

Tkachuk - Backlund - Lindholm
Lucic - Bennett - Dube
Mangiapane - Ryan - ?
? - Jankowski (Yep) - ?

Hanifin - Andersson
Giordano - ?
Valimaki - ?

?
Rittich

I still think you chase Lehner, Hall, and Laviolette - but probably unlikely they choose Calgary.

If you're going there, you may as well burn the whole team to the ground. Throw away all your assets on draft picks and hope that in three to five years they are ready to be NHL players. Until then piss your fans off by icing a team that is out of the playoff race by Halloween.

I've really grown to despise the draft. Every year people fall in love with 17 and 18 year olds, who they claim are certain to be the next great superstars, yet never understand that the road to the NHL is extremely difficult and players are unlikely to achieve their potential. Every year it is trade away the players you invested time, energy, and money into developing, just for more kids that you have to invest more time, energy, and money into developing, only to watch the vast majority of them fail.

Can we please get away from this vicious cycle and instead focus on trading for players that are on the verge of achieving their promise? There is always a team out there willing to make a trade for immediate help and give away those types of players. Do that and save years of development and wasted money. I appreciate it is not as much fun as watching a kid put up some gaudy numbers in the junior ranks for a couple of seasons, building the hype and setting expectations they will never achieve, but it helps with attaining a more even keel in building a team.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

Or a Bennett

Bennett wasn't a number one, but yeah. As good as he has been lately, he's a second rounder in a redraft.

[bigrangy]

I’m on board with moving Tkachuk but only if Monahan, Gaudreau, and Gio all move out as well.

Tkachuk for 3, Gaudreau for 7, Monahan for 8, Gio + for 10 (would think the jets would like a 1d to push while their team is still in winning mode, though would probably need to add a solid piece because Gio is old)

Draft Byfield/Rossi, Drysdale/Sanderson, and whoever’s the best left at 8. Trade up from 19 to draft Askarov, suck through 2022 then go hard in 2023.

[Toonage]

The biggest concern with trading a prime asset for 3OA is that you aren't guaranteed Byfield if thats who you'd want to pick up.

The team might look/feel pretty dumb if they lose Tkachuk and draft Stutzle

[Fan69]

Originally Posted by New Era

If you're going there, you may as well burn the whole team to the ground. Throw away all your assets on draft picks and hope that in three to five years they are ready to be NHL players. Until then piss your fans off by icing a team that is out of the playoff race by Halloween.

I've really grown to despise the draft. Every year people fall in love with 17 and 18 year olds, who they claim are certain to be the next great superstars, yet never understand that the road to the NHL is extremely difficult and players are unlikely to achieve their potential. Every year it is trade away the players you invested time, energy, and money into developing, just for more kids that you have to invest more time, energy, and money into developing, only to watch the vast majority of them fail.

Can we please get away from this vicious cycle and instead focus on trading for players that are on the verge of achieving their promise? There is always a team out there willing to make a trade for immediate help and give away those types of players. Do that and save years of development and wasted money. I appreciate it is not as much fun as watching a kid put up some gaudy numbers in the junior ranks for a couple of seasons, building the hype and setting expectations they will never achieve, but it helps with attaining a more even keel in building a team.

Now I couldn't agree more with this. To my mind this burn it down approach is nonsense.

lets be real here for a moment what are the options to improving on Monahan? I say slim to nill. Now that isnt a knock on Monahan but what it does say is the competition he has to go against is some of the best centers drafted in the last 10 years so if you cant overpower then you have to out depth. Hence managements try at Khadri.

If you trade J.G. and get mystery center X, a Monahan level player at center. the line up looks completely different. Now I will use Horvat as an example only, I dont know who player X would be realistically but he would be the type of player I would be looking for.

Monahan/linds/ hate this but Hall it just seems to out there.
Horvat/tkachuk/mange
backs/bennett/dube
janks, ryan.

disgustingly hard line up to play against in attitude and skill sets. We are at the same point with J.G. that we were with Hamilton. He is not emotionally here, hasnt been for a year and a half and its time to move a prime piece for future prime pieces.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Toonage

The biggest concern with trading a prime asset for 3OA is that you aren't guaranteed Byfield if thats who you'd want to pick up.

The team might look/feel pretty dumb if they lose Tkachuk and draft Stutzle

I would think the process is to start the conversations ahead of time, agree to a basic framework and see if Ottawa is willing to part with 3 if Byfield is there, and then look at pulling the trigger when you know he is.

There's zero reason to make the trade prior to knowing if Byfield is there or not. And if he isn't, you just don't make it.

I think 99% of draft day trades happen when the team knows a player they want is available. They don't spend big assets for the "chance" to grab a particular guy.

[shniper]

We're getting front row seats to witness what happens without Tkachuk and some of you want to trade him? Ridiculous. He's one of the very few absolute untouchables on the team.

[Dan403]

Trading 19 is the stupidest idea I've heard in a long long time.

[Coach]

The faith people have that unknown quantities like 16-18 year olds continues to blow my mind. Even with Bennett added to the conversation, who himself was once touted as a top line center in waiting for which we are still waiting and will likely not be the case.

I’m not against trading Gaudreau Monahan and/or Gio, but there’s no guarantee picks turn into players that are as good. I’m not on board with trading Tkachuk at all though.