[Trade] Elias Lindholm + Noah Hanifin to Flames for D. Hamilton, Micheal Ferland, & Adam Fox

[wingmaker]

Originally Posted by Harry Lime

Brodie back with Gio, Hanifin a 35 point defenseman and getting better every year, and Lindholm is more skilled offensively than Ferland in every way except hitting people.

Why do people keep insisting that we have given up offense?

If you think that the bottom six was bad in Calgary, look at the bottom nine in Carolina. They were not hard to shut down.

Because they did give up offence:

Dougie and Ferland: 38 goals, 47 assists, 85 points

Lindholm and Hanifin: 26 goals, 50 assists, 76 points

Not to say that those differences won't change in the future, but as of right now the Flames gave up offence in this trade.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by btimbit

Lindholm coming up on 960

Waiting for him to say how much he hates Peters followed by a "Trade me right now" then a storm off.

[868904]

The big benefit is the giveaway/takeaway differential. Hamilton was like -40 while Hanifin was -8.

It's a simple stat that tells me how often said player gives the puck away and takes it away and therefore has possession. I find the advanced possession stats are too muddled.

It's also interesting but all of the Hurricanes defensemen had very low or even positive differentials, which I hope means that Peters' system really limits high risk/low percentage passes and giveaways.

[sureLoss]

Lindholm coming up on 960

[AC]

http://960thefan.radio.net/

Link if needed to listen to Lindholm.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Bongsong

So same player that can get out of his zone and don't take stupid penalties and a bit more tuff and only 21

Well there was another chart

[TheScorpion]

Well, he likes soccer.

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

Well, he likes soccer.

Riveting interview so far

[Bongsong]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

Well there was another chart

The biggest difference is 9% that not much out of a 100% it equals about 7 goals in 82 games the better break outs and passing and zonal entries can create more than 7 goals

[TheScorpion]

Lindholm describes himself as a "two-way player, works hard, helps the team to win." I mean, I like all of those things.

[FlamesFanTrev]

Originally Posted by Bongsong

The biggest difference is 9% that not much out of a 100% it equals about 7 goals in 82 games the better break outs and passing and zonal entries can create more than 7 goals

±47 penalty minutes can cost you 7 goals too. And I dont have to scream at my TV "WTF Hamilton!?!!??" This year. Which is great, because my 2 year old will probably swear less.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

Well there was another chart

It is interesting that he used relative there though and individual stats for the other one - potentially skewed a little since the other d-pairings on Carolina were also really good while the Flames other d-pairings were pretty poor last year.

Hanifin:

CF%: 56.19%
HDCF%: 55.02%
PDO: .969
GF%: 45.28%
Offensive Zone FO%: 62.79%

Hamilton:
CF%: 57.63%
HDCF%: 60.07%
PDO: .987
GF%: 52.03%
Offensive Zone FO%: 53.5%

So Hamilton is still better here (his possession numbers are elite) but closer than one may think. Still think the Flames gave up too much here but do think it's getting overlooked that Hanifin is a pretty good d-man already and is still only 21.

[Enoch Root]

Remember, we're comparing a 24 year old Hamilton in year 6 of his career, and a 21 year old Hanifin in year 3 of his career.

The fact that these numbers are this close is pretty damning to Hamilton IMO.

I expect Hanifin to pass him within a year or two.

Plus, good bye to those lazy, bone-headed penalties.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Stay Golden

Since u asked.

He seemed to take Bradley as an insult when I met him this year at the STH year end and I was introduced by my rep.
He shook my hand and I said so Bradley in what way are you going to meddle with a trade this year?
He pretty much glared at me before answer.
Then I said was going into the draft with no picks until the 4th the plan Bradley.
I was pleased that it irritated him.
I didn't let him reply and said what do you think all the fans are here to be all kissy kissy.
I don't like him and I make no bones about it.

That was super classy. You should be really proud of yourself

[DJones]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

It is interesting that he used relative there though and individual stats for the other one - potentially skewed a little since the other d-pairings on Carolina were also really good while the Flames other d-pairings were pretty poor last year.

Hanifin:

CF%: 56.19%
HDCF%: 55.02%
PDO: .969
GF%: 45.28%
Offensive Zone FO%: 62.79%

Hamilton:
CF%: 57.63%
HDCF%: 60.07%
PDO: .987
GF%: 52.03%
Offensive Zone FO%: 53.5%

So Hamilton is still better here (his possession numbers are elite) but closer than one may think. Still think the Flames gave up too much here but do think it's getting overlooked that Hanifin is a pretty good d-man already and is still only 21.

PDO of .969 is crazy low. Like Hamiltons was low but that's just ridiculous.

[the2bears]

Originally Posted by The Yen Man

I'll miss Dougie's offense for sure. But one thing I won't miss are all his dumb penalties. Lets hope Hanifin isn't a penalty machine like Dougie was.

No need to hope.

[CaptainCrunch]

Isn't PDO an effect of the players who are on the ice instead of individual statistics?

[Flames Draft Watcher]

https://www.sportsnet.ca/960/boomer-...larizing-deal/

Loubardias breaks down the deal on the morning show

[driveway]

Originally Posted by DJones

PDO of .969 is crazy low. Like Hamiltons was low but that's just ridiculous.

Hanifin had the second lowest PDO of any defenseman (95.8) Faulk, his main D partner had the lowest (95.2).

Hamilton had the 20th lowest (98.4) Gio was 14th (97.7).

Edit: these numbers are even strength, from hockey-reference.com

[Vinny01]

One thing to consider Hamilton was 21 just turning 22 when we acquired him he was drafted in 2011 and traded in 2015. Hanifin was 21 and not turning 22 until January and was drafted in 2015 traded in 2018. Technically the Flames traded for Hanifin a year earlier in his development than Dougie. Hamilton went back to junior and Hanifin made the nhl right away so both had 3 years experience in the league.