2017/2018 Trade Speculation and Rumors

[Royle9]

Originally Posted by Nelson

Roof-Daddy just gave me the idea of trying to pick up Nic Petan. He is 23 and hasn't become an NHL regular, which is generally a bad sign, but it might be because the Jets pipeline is so deep.

I think he might be exactly the kind of option we could use in our bottom 6. He is fast and skilled. He scored over a 100 points twice in Portland, 52 points in 52 games last year and 32 points in 47 games in 15-16 in the AHL, and 13 points in 54 games in the NHL in 16-17. The NHL total is not great.

However, Petan was 11th in ice time on the Jets that year. He also had a 3% SH% that year. I think he might be worth a shot.

Bolded my concerns.

I think we need top 6 help more so than bottom 6, we have far too many bottom 6 forwards currently. Not saying we couldn't use a Petan but not a priority move imo.

We had another player who put up 100+ seasons in Portland and we still drove him out of town to some extent. Again not a direct comparable to Petan but I don't think Petan is a long term solution to what the flames are struggles were this seasons.

I'd still flip a current bottom 6 for him if the Jet's would do it, but I don't seem them entertaining that idea.

[Nelson]

Originally Posted by Royle9

Bolded my concerns.

I think we need top 6 help more so than bottom 6, we have far too many bottom 6 forwards currently. Not saying we couldn't use a Petan but not a priority move imo.

We had another player who put up 100+ seasons in Portland and we still drove him out of town to some extent. Again not a direct comparable to Petan but I don't think Petan is a long term solution to what the flames are struggles were this seasons.

I'd still flip a current bottom 6 for him if the Jet's would do it, but I don't seem them entertaining that idea.

True. I guess I'm thinking we need to get a top 6 RW, but also need to revamp our bottom 6. In particular, watching the Jets, Lightning, and Penguins, their bottom sixes are fast and skilled. They don't necessarily emphasize size and hits but concentrate on getting secondary scoring and puck pressure. I think the bottom 6 of the Flames is really bad and needs to become quicker and more skilled.

Although he is LH, I think Petan could fit in very well. He is an RFA at the end of this season. There's a chance the Jets don't bring him back with the quality of their prospects. Alternatively, maybe the Flames could try trading a defenceman in a package for Petan. The problem is the Jets don't really need defencemen. Their blue line is stacked so I don't know if they'd be interested in a guy like Stone. Probably not. It might have to be Brodie and the Flames could get Petan in a package of players, picks and prospects. After all, the Jets left side is weaker than their right side.

With Stajan, Shore, Versteeg, Stewart, Jankowski, Hathaway, Hrivik and Glass all FAs of some sort, I think the Flames do have an opportunity to ice a re-imagined bottom 6 in 2018-2019.

I think they could ice something like this lineup:
Gaudreau - Monahan - Perron
Tkachuk - Backlund - Frolik
Bennett - Jankowski - Petan
Roussel - Shore - Lazar
Hathaway
Brouwer

[bax]

Originally Posted by Nelson

Roof-Daddy just gave me the idea of trying to pick up Nic Petan. He is 23 and hasn't become an NHL regular, which is generally a bad sign, but it might be because the Jets pipeline is so deep.

I think he might be exactly the kind of option we could use in our bottom 6. He is fast and skilled. He scored over a 100 points twice in Portland, 52 points in 52 games last year and 32 points in 47 games in 15-16 in the AHL, and 13 points in 54 games in the NHL in 16-17. The NHL total is not great.

However, Petan was 11th in ice time on the Jets that year. He also had a 3% SH% that year. I think he might be worth a shot.

Sounds a lot like Andrew Mangiapane no?

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

As I said he's a good scorer. Really goal scorer..he was 22nd in the league in total points by a defenceman. Scores 3 goals on a nihht when Florida kicks your ass 6-3. Andy Delmore lead all NHL defenceman in goals with 18 one year..

I'll be happy to be wrong when the flames win their 8th playoff game with Dogue leading the charge. But I think there's a better chance we see 0 Flames playoff wins in the next 3 seasons with him expected to lead the charge than seeing them win 4 in a single season.

Its comments like this were you lose all credibility...Hamilton didn't just have one good lucky offensive year

Hamilton is 24 years old and has 64 goals and 220 points in the NHL as a dman.

A team doesn't win and lose because of one player, this isn't basketball...a balanced team could certainly win with Dougie in their top pairing.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

What if they just pull a swap of good young blue liners?

Like Hamilton for Ristolainen for example?

Who adds in that scenario, if anyone?

Hamilton for Ristolainen and Nylander?

What is Buffalo's motivation to move Risto?

He's the perfect compliment to Dahlin.

And he's a better all around d-man than Hamilton.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

What is Buffalo's motivation to move Risto?

He's the perfect compliment to Dahlin.

And he's a better all around d-man than Hamilton.

What makes him better? The fewer points or the -25 rating

go home CP, your drunk

[RoughRiderRowdy]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Its comments like this were you lose all credibility...Hamilton didn't just have one good lucky offensive year

Hamilton is 24 years old and has 64 goals and 220 points in the NHL as a dman.

A team doesn't win and lose because of one player, this isn't basketball...a balanced team could certainly win with Dougie in their top pairing.

We get it. Your in love with Hamilton. Yes he is a good offensive defenceman. He also gives up lots of scoring chances. This team will not improve unless we upgrade the top 6 with offensive scoring forwards. How else are we going to acquire a top 6 forward other than a UFA? Every option needs to be explored. If we do trade hamilton then other defencemen will get an opportunity.. look at vegas for example. How many players are flourishing with increased roles/ice time opportunity?

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

What is Buffalo's motivation to move Risto?

He's the perfect compliment to Dahlin.

And he's a better all around d-man than Hamilton.

Nope. I have to believe this is a case of "the grass is always greener" right here. I watched a good number of Sabres games this year thanks to the Flames scouting them so heavily and from everything I saw this is just not true.

Find any way to back this up and make an argument if you want - but I watched a "whopping" 20-25 Sabres games last season, and nothing I saw would lead me to say that Risto is better than Dougie - and neither do any of the stats.

[Nelson]

Originally Posted by bax

Sounds a lot like Andrew Mangiapane no?

This is a fair point. It’s possible the solution is to bring in Mangiapane and Petan. There’s also Foo. Whatever the solution, the Flames must have more Sheary-ness in their bottom 6 next year. I’m sick and tired of these old, slow, overpaid guys. I want cheap, fast and skilled in the bottom 6.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by RoughRiderRowdy

We get it. Your in love with Hamilton. Yes he is a good offensive defenceman. He also gives up lots of scoring chances. This team will not improve unless we upgrade the top 6 with offensive scoring forwards. How else are we going to acquire a top 6 forward other than a UFA? Every option needs to be explored. If we do trade hamilton then other defencemen will get an opportunity.. look at vegas for example. How many players are flourishing with increased roles/ice time opportunity?

Jackass comment as usual from you...

I already said I would trade him for the right player...but it HAS to be a top end forward like 80-90 point potential

To just dismiss Hamilton as only good offensively and to say players with worse stats in ALL categories are better overall is asinine

[Knut]

Its a case of Ristolainen having one beast game against the Flames a few years ago. He scored a hat-trick and made a lot of hits.

In reality he is terrible 5v5 offensively and defensively.

[SuperMatt18]

Montreal couldn't win with PK Subban on their top pairing...remember that.

The more you look at it the more you realize just how great the hockey "Old Boys Club" is at criticizing anybody that doesn't fit in the norm of "Good ole Canadian boy that shows no emotion or personality".

Dougie is a guy who's a kid at heart, appears to like to joke around, and does great charity work in the city. But since he doesn't smash his stick when they lose, and since he shows any sort of personality, he has "Character issues".

Honestly I hope Treliving doesn't feel the same as those on this board. If so we are going to go trade our skilled guys for "Character" players and end up being even worse next year.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by dino7c

What makes him better? The fewer points or the -25 rating

go home CP, your drunk

Over the last two years, they are virtually identical in points per game (Hamilton ay 47 per 82 games, Risto at 46). So, by fewer points , you mean 1 per 82 games?

And Risto plays the tougher minutes.

[Royle9]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Jackass comment as usual from you...

I already said I would trade him for the right player...but it HAS to be a top end forward like 80-90 point potential

To just dismiss Hamilton as only good offensively and to say players with worse stats in ALL categories are better overall is asinine

The ONLY thing that I see that Ristolainen has over Hamilton is that he plays a tougher/meaner game in terms of throwing the body around whereas Dougie likes to shy away from contact if he can.


Maybe we're all on the same page and just don't know it?
I would agree with this, I dont want to see Dougie moved but he's far and away the biggest asset we have that would command a player of the 80-90 point caliber:

I could live with something along the lines of:

Dougie for Nylander and 1st
Dougie for Marner and a 1st or 2nd

HAS TO BE A PREMIUM, and I trust Brad to explore those kind of options should they be available. I don't foresee Calgary losing in any trade scenario that involves moving Hamilton.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Nope. I have to believe this is a case of "the grass is always greener" right here. I watched a good number of Sabres games this year thanks to the Flames scouting them so heavily and from everything I saw this is just not true.

Find any way to back this up and make an argument if you want - but I watched a "whopping" 20-25 Sabres games last season, and nothing I saw would lead me to say that Risto is better than Dougie - and neither do any of the stats.

Pretty blanket statement were it close to being true

26:30 game toi

22 ppa (runs the PP rather than the shooting that Mr. Hamilton wins)

208 hits 2.8 / game

111 blocked shots 1.5 / game

2:46 / game PK

all sigificantly better stats for Risto

.54 ppg exactly tied with Hamilton

[Knut]

Ristolainen vs Polak 5v5 Offense

[Sylvanfan]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Its comments like this were you lose all credibility...Hamilton didn't just have one good lucky offensive year

Hamilton is 24 years old and has 64 goals and 220 points in the NHL as a dman.

A team doesn't win and lose because of one player, this isn't basketball...a balanced team could certainly win with Dougie in their top pairing.

It has been stated many times in this thread that you can't trade Hamilton because he lead the league in goals by a defenceman.

I was trying to prove that players who weren't exactly highly valued have managed to accomplish that feat.

It's one thing to trade him for a winger with right now 70-80 point potential, but as Cliff Fletcher mentions, there are no shortage of comments where an established 80 point player, 1st round pick, and good prospect need to come back to make the deal. A return far greater than what Chris Pronger was ever traded for.

If that's what people expect in a trade, they will be disappointed. That's why I suggest that the valuation seems off.

If there is a right winger who's similar in age who can score 30 goals and has some size, I think that would be a really good swap. But who is that player, and is the team who has that player wanting to trade that player for Hamilton, let alone give up two other good assets too?

I'll leave this alone. Cliff Fletcher said what I was wanting to, in a much more eloquent way.

[Bingo]

The need to disparage Hamilton is just insane in my mind.

He's not physical ... won't argue that.
Too many stick infractions ... won't argue that.

But there are 77 NHL defensemen that played more than 1250 minutes last year.

In that group of 77 Hamilton is ....

2nd in CF%
2nd in Shot differential
34th in goal differential
3rd in scoring chance differential
2nd in high danger chance differential

Someone above mentioned he gives up too many scoring chances.

he gave up the 12th least of the 77 in scoring chances against
he gave up the 10th least of the 77 in high danger chances against

he was ranked 56th in on ice shooting percentage and
62nd in on ice save percentage suggesting he was somewhat unlucky last season to be honest.

He's not going to wear the "C", but call him what he is ... a very good top pairing defenseman and at that age he's a unicorn.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

If there is a right winger who's similar in age who can score 30 goals and has some size, I think that would be a really good swap.

Out of curiosity how many goals do you think Dougie Hamilton could score if he were playing RW with, say, Tkachuk opposite? Like a Tkachuk-Backlund-Hamilton line or maybe Bennett or Janko down the middle. If Hamilton can score 17 as a Dman, surely his wrister is even more dangerous up front.

Just a thought.

[Corral]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

It has been stated many times in this thread that you can't trade Hamilton because he lead the league in goals by a defenceman.

I was trying to prove that players who weren't exactly highly valued have managed to accomplish that feat.

It's one thing to trade him for a winger with right now 70-80 point potential, but as Cliff Fletcher mentions, there are no shortage of comments where an established 80 point player, 1st round pick, and good prospect need to come back to make the deal. A return far greater than what Chris Pronger was ever traded for.

If that's what people expect in a trade, they will be disappointed. That's why I suggest that the valuation seems off.

If there is a right winger who's similar in age who can score 30 goals and has some size, I think that would be a really good swap. But who is that player, and is the team who has that player wanting to trade that player for Hamilton, let alone give up two other good assets too?

I'll leave this alone. Cliff Fletcher said what I was wanting to, in a much more eloquent way.

The blind love for Dougie Hamilton is off the charts in some places of this forum. I'm just patiently waiting for the Flames to trade him for much needed help up front, so we don't need to continue with these conversations.