My biggest fear is they won't be able to find a solution. Nenshi seems hell bent on not giving any public money to the team with the Flames owners thinking they should get some. Simple solution is for the owners to build an arena with their own money and worry about a new football stadium later.
I dont know if hes against giving public money. The proposal is just so bad he cant consider it. Give him a plan B
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I think Nenshi knows exactly what he's doing. This is like a high caliber prize fight. Battle lines are drawn and Nenshi is going on get the best deal for tax payers much like the Flames owners are going to get the best deal for themselves.
The threat to move is hollow IMO.
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I think Nenshi needs to distance himself from the issue. There is too much at stake for the City in this downturn to risk this project over egos and arrogance. Appoint a special committee to work with King and start to find some common ground.
Last Week Tonight did a story about how the ultimate purpose of pro sports teams is so that owners can extort free stadiums from host cities. Winning is nice, but a free stadium is the far superior return on investment.
Every time I see the old City officials V League officials V Team Owners, it seems to boil down to the same basic issue.
Team wants new arena. Won't pay for all the costs and want the city to not only stump up money to help build said arena, but give them incentives as well. League weighs in with heavy handed comments and veiled threats against the city. City dig heels in, years of standoffs, threats of moves etc etc. This is a complete mess and its hard to see a way forward from here.
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Originally Posted by Manhattanboy
I think Nenshi needs to distance himself from the issue. There is too much at stake for the City in this downturn to risk this project over egos and arrogance. Appoint a special committee to work with King and start to find some common ground.
Ken King needs to go also if you think there is any common ground to be found.
Bettman, and I actually like and respect Bettman, came to town to apply some pressure. It wasnt cute and it certainly wasnt subtle. It was actually kind of insulting not just to the City Council and/or Mayor, but in general.
Thanks Gary. We know they need a new arena. They know they need a new arena. Everyone knows they need a new arena. Thanks tips.
I thought Nenshi's response was perfectly fine. He doesnt need to cowtow to Bettman, the NHL or the Flames. The fact of the matter remains that Nenshi isnt the one being unreasonable and I think pretty much everyone knows it.
All hes basically said is: "Come to us with something real and we'll discuss it."
Thats all hes ever said.
And lets all admit it, the original CalgaryNEXT presentation was pretty pathetic and more or less not worth discussin and they havent used the interim time wisely.
So okay, Nenshi's response was snarkier and more sarcastic than absolutely necessary. So what? I'd have done the same. The implicit message of that sarcasm seems clear to me:
"Stop playing games."
Regarding his refusal to meet with Bettman, that seems totally reasonable. Hell, anyone would, or at least should, say the same thing.
"Do you have anything new to say? No? So maybe we should save each other's time and just skip it then."
And honestly, if the Flames want free money they should just go to Notley. The Flames can promise to Unionize the concession staff and she'll probably cut them a cheque on the spot with no questions asked, I doubt she'll be around long enough to suffer the consequences.
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Doubt it. Pretty sure CFCs is about as big as it ever will be. New stadium isn't going to generate interest long term.
CFL interest in Calgary is dwindling at an alarming rate. In the past 3 years the entire group of season ticket holders around me have left and no one has taken their seats. These were the key demographic they want there as well. Under 40, spending money on concessions and beer, and introducing new people
To the game from time to time. All that is left is the old retired people who bring their snacks to the game with them. New stadium or not, I really don't think the future of the Stamps is looking all that bright.
My firm has premium seats with red and white club access and we couldn't even give them away this year to the staff when every client on our list turned them down.
I've disagreed with him on some things lately, but I'm sure as hell behind him on this. No corporate welfare for sports stadiums. It is never, ever a good investment for the city.
I caught Duha on Fan960, and have to say it was a rare time he left me mystified. The guy is as logical a person as you can get, but sometimes (last being went Sutter final days as GM) he goes off his proven and consistent even keel path.
Basically said that despite the multiple studies out there that show stadiums to be a imprudent use of city dollars you couldn't argue with the results of an area like LA Live. He continued that they took a rubble area of the city and made it amazing. So he continued with why Calgary should really be embracing this thing. Went full science vs. anicdote.
I was thinking, who still says LA Live is of net benefit to LA? Been to Compton or Inglewood. Have you asked the kids if LA Live is of benefit to them seeing as they probably are too poor to ever afford a ticket? Or could the funds have gone to small recreation centres to get the kids off the street?
Anyways, my point is we want a tough dog mayor right now. He's not just keeping the owners honest, but our illogical fan boy selves. I want a stadium too, but I want hard answers. The mayor is drawing a line and saying come see me when you have real answers, you fluff so far isn't worth the cities time. I get that because it is how the real world works.
The part I can live without is the non-meeting Bettman, and he Twitter drama. He has to get past his nerd rage, and put a fake smile on and tell Bettman to his face. I would respect that more. Buck up and tell Bettman people don't work off of napkin proposals and he is welcome back with ownership when they show they are taking the process seriously.
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I've disagreed with him on some things lately, but I'm sure as hell behind him on this. No corporate welfare for sports stadiums. It is never, ever a good investment for the city.
25.9 million revenue for last year with a solid playoff run. If they can save 300 million by going to another team and letting the Stampeders fall apart why would they not relocate. That's over ten years profit.
If you want a professional sports team then the city has to pitch in.
I don't use the bike paths, the new bridge, the library, and I won't use the expansion LRT. I don't even know what the Foothills Athletic Park is but that costs $140 million.
At least I would use the building to watch the Flames, my kids will use the field house, and I will never have to drive to Edmonton or Saskatoon to watch a concert again.
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Bettman, and I actually like and respect Bettman, came to town to apply some pressure. It wasnt cute and it certainly wasnt subtle. It was actually kind of insulting not just to the City Council and/or Mayor, but in general.
Thanks Gary. We know they need a new arena. They know they need a new arena. Everyone knows they need a new arena. Thanks tips.
Bettman was invited by the Chamber of Commerce to speak on that topic. Plus, he visits each city for a state of the union to talk to and then do a Q&A session season ticket holders, every year. This wasn't anything more than that annual event.
Just deplorable delivery of a response from the mayor and his holier than thou attitude.
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My problem with Nenshi is this. He has absolutely zero ability to see an opposing view. If Naheed thinks it's right, you should think it's right. If he doesn't get his way, he has his little passive aggressive twitter fits. He is far too opinionated, and I believe it will eventually be his undoing myself.
I honestly believe the guy would rather have the team move than even budge an iota on this issue. And I don't think I'm wrong.
Absolutely. The guy racked up $100k in lawyer fees just to avoid apologizing for a comment he made. All on principle.
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public funded money isn't the answer here.. be honest guys the owners and the team can do this themselves without asking Calgarians who don't support spending their own money on the arena.
There are so many more things the city can spend $200+ mill on than an arena for billionaire owners to have their team play out of because they don't want to spend their own money on.
Everyone on this board wants the flames to stay in calgary, but are every single one of you willing to pay for it?
The part I can live without is the non-meeting Bettman, and he Twitter drama. He has to get past his nerd rage, and put a fake smile on and tell Bettman to his face.
THAT'S why Nenshi's demeanor is so familiar. I couldn't place it at first, but it's exactly like the nerd rage on Dungeons & Dragons fan boards over which edition of the game is the real D&D. I wonder if Nenshi is a 4E guy, if he made the transition to 5E, or if he switched to Pathfinder.
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