[News] Flames have not had recent contract talks with Glencross

[darthma]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

In all honesty, if you are hoping to move Glencross, you are hoping we fall completely out of the playoff picture. In short, you are hoping we lose. While Treliving and Burke could move him regardless, I think they realize he is a very important piece of our playoff run.

That's a good point, though stated with a strange logic. If we really think Glencross is a big part of staying in the playoff picture and potentially getting somewhere, we should just keep him. I guess it depends on how much he's worth at the trade deadline. If he's worth a 3rd rounder, then by all means, I am happy to keep him for a push. It would be the equivalent of bringing in someone who could contribute for a 3rd. If he's worth a 1st rounder (and I don't think he is, then sure I'd move him). By keeping him, the worst that could happen is we would get nothing for him. meh.

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

In all honesty, if you are hoping to move Glencross, you are hoping we fall completely out of the playoff picture. In short, you are hoping we lose. While Treliving and Burke could move him regardless, I think they realize he is a very important piece of our playoff run.

Disagree. The team has been just fine without him and I suspect will be just fine in a playoff push without him too. Whether it's Glencross or someone else within the system, the Flames will be just fine. LW is the deepest in terms of capable NHL level players within the organization. Nothing wrong with moving on from Glencross.

[sureLoss]

So another dilemma with Glencross is his full NTC.

Will play it like Iginla? Give a list of teams he is willing to help the Flames drive up the price but only waive to his final say-so team and perhaps not the best return for the Flames.

This may be unlikely (yes he should be a good UFA rental but he may not be at or near the top of every GM's list), but what happens if the teams he is willing to waive for have little to no interest in him. Will he expand his list? Or will the Flames be forced to keep him for the rest of the season?

[Table 5]

Originally Posted by dammage79

Disagree. The team has been just fine without him and I suspect will be just fine in a playoff push without him too. Whether it's Glencross or someone else within the system, the Flames will be just fine. LW is the deepest in terms of capable NHL level players within the organization. Nothing wrong with moving on from Glencross.

Yep, this team has shown they play just fine with a revolving door of players coming and going. We played some of our best hockey this season with key forwards out of the lineup. It's a team that relies on a system, not individual greatness.

Short of Giordano or Brodie, I'm not really sure there's anyone in the lineup who's absence completely craters your chances going forward. We might not have any current superstars, but there's a lot of quality forward depth on this team.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I'm not one of those guys that's always dumping on Glencross but I feel his value to this team isn't nearly as high as some would like to think. I highly doubt that if the Flames trade him their season would immediately head south as if anything this team has shown the ability to overcome players out of the lineup.

In a perfect world the Flames could retain him (and maybe both parties still can find middle ground on a deal) but economically it's not going to be prudent for this franchise to pay $$$ for an aging vet and rather than repeat last year where the Flames didn't recoup any assets for Cammalleri I feel given this stage of their rebuild it would be most beneficial to acquire a solid asset if possible. Obviously if the offers are of the 3rd round pick variety then you hold on to him but they should shop him and if the offers are 2nd round pick or better I feel not trading him would be doing a disservice to the rebuild.

Cammalleri last year is not a valid comparable as we were nowhere near the playoff race. The Flames would be foolish to move picks or prospects for aging players to try and win now, but given how close they are, the team does have an obligation to the people who pay the bills to at least try to stay in the top eight. That means that important pieces should not be moved unless an offer that cannot be refused comes along.

It does present a problem, but a good one for Treliving. Fortunately, the schedule between now and the deadline should largely answer the question of whether it will even matter.

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Table 5

Yep, this team has shown they play just fine with a revolving door of players coming and going. We played some of our best hockey this season with key forwards out of the lineup. It's a team that relies on a system, not individual greatness.

Short of Giordano or Brodie, I'm not really sure there's anyone in the lineup who's absence completely craters your chances going forward. We might not have any current superstars, but there's a lot of quality forward depth on this team.

Losing Monahan or Backlund (right now anyways) would hurt the Flames just as much as losing Gio or Brodie I think. To any extent losing any of the top 4 D-men would really put a stake in the heart of the Flames playoff chances though.

[Table 5]

Originally Posted by dammage79

Losing Monahan or Backlund (right now anyways) would hurt the Flames just as much as losing Gio or Brodie I think. To any extent losing any of the top 4 D-men would really put a stake in the heart of the Flames playoff chances though.

Backlunds absence for the majority of the season showed that this team was competitive without him....not better necessarily, but not terrible by any means. In many ways Monahan was the guy who stepped up to play his role... so if its Monahan that goes down, it will be Backlund that fills the hole in return!

I think if we lose Gio, this team falls off the face of earth.

Glencross? He's had good stretches this year, but I don't think it would be a huge loss by any means. I think we missed Backlund more than we'd miss Glencross.

[neo45]

Trading away top 6 forward when you're trying to sneak into playoffs = insane

[Super-Rye]

Calgary is in such an interesting spot heading to the trade deadline.

I like both Glencross and Ramo, they're both good players and I'm sure the team would love to keep them for a run at a playoff spot.

The Flames were in this situation before and ended up holding onto Jokinen. Not moving him hasn't seemed to slow down our rebuild any but adding more to the prospect cupboard is essential, especially if the management team expects to graduate a a few players to the pro's next year.

So what to do? Do you remove 2 vets from the locker room right as the team is in the middle of the playoff race? Or do you hold onto them for the race and lose out on any sort of return?

Me, personally, I'd move Glencross if the price was right. Same as Cammo last year. Wouldn't feel the need to ship him out for just any return, as his presence in the locker room still holds value to this team as long as they are playing meaningful hockey, but if a good deal came along the Flames have more than enough forwards (seriously it's rather ridiculous) that they could probably find some way to distribute Glencross' minutes and not lose a step.

Goaltending is a little bit more interesting. Behind Ortio there isn't really anyone on the farm who could help. So if they moved Ramo and then Hiller went down to injury the Flames would be put in a bad spot and it's not a spot they've been in all year really. So I would probably hold onto Ramo, for depth reasons and the fact he is unlikely to fetch a whole lot on the trade market anyways. However, if someone came along and offered a crazy deal like the Av's did for Berra I imagine management would probably have no issues pulling the trigger on a deal.

[Table 5]

Originally Posted by neo45

Trading away top 6 forward when you're trying to sneak into playoffs = insane

Being impatient and ignoring the long-term master plan, just to see your ass handed to you in the 1st round = more insane

[Huntingwhale]

Hopefully Treliving has had talks about him waiving his NTC. Glencross is going to want a raise and term. Those things could handcuff us going forward, for a guy who isn't getting any better. Strike while the iron is hot and get a decent return for him.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Table 5

Being impatient and ignoring the long-term master plan, just to see your ass handed to you in the 1st round = more insane

Yup. Better to follow the Oilers model. Dump all the vets and be bad forever until suddenly, Stanley Cup champions!

Or, we can stop pretending that the development and growth of an organization is a binary process.

[Goodlad]

Originally Posted by neo45

Trading away top 6 forward when you're trying to sneak into playoffs = insane

At this point in the rebuild playoffs would be awesome, but realistically we're not set to make any noise if we sneak in. If all indications are that Glencross won't re-sign, then you have to move him for an asset.

[Fire]

Originally Posted by Table 5

Being impatient and ignoring the long-term master plan, just to see your ass handed to you in the 1st round = more insane

Depends on the return doesn't it? For s 1st rounder you do it for sure. For a 3rd rounder I wouldn't bother. For a 2nd rounder I would be fine with a trade but I'm not sure if Treliving would be because of the bad optics.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Yup. Better to follow the Oilers model. Dump all the vets and be bad forever until suddenly, Stanley Cup champions!

Or, we can stop pretending that the development and growth of an organization is a binary process.

The goal should always be winning the cup. This organization forced themselves into the rebuild by their belief that just making the playoffs was good enough. Making the playoffs ahead of schedule and thinking you are better than you really are is what got the Senators to regress into the meddling team they are today. This team isn't anywhere near being a cup contender so making moves to improve the organization going forward should be placed ahead of just sneaking in the 8th spot.

[Yoho]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Yup. Better to follow the Oilers model. Dump all the vets and be bad forever until suddenly, Stanley Cup champions!

Or, we can stop pretending that the development and growth of an organization is a binary process.

So we aren't going to re sign him and you want to forsake a possible decent retun for a month or two of veteran presence? And that now makes us the Oil?

I'm sure Gio's got it..

[Sylvanfan]

This is a pretty sad organization. 3 series wins in 25 seasons, and 5 playoff appearances in the past 17. I would say making the playoffs should be sort of important. More important than moving one of your better forwards for the 88th pick in the draft.

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

The goal should always be winning the cup. This organization forced themselves into the rebuild by their belief that just making the playoffs was good enough. Making the playoffs ahead of schedule and thinking you are better than you really are is what got the Senators to regress into the meddling team they are today. This team isn't anywhere near being a cup contender so making moves to improve the organization going forward should be placed ahead of just sneaking in the 8th spot.

Treliving has said as much in recent interviews. It's just a guess on my part but I get the feeling that the Flames are indeed ready to move from Glencross and open up a roster space for someone younger either within the system or from elsewhere.

[neo45]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

This is a pretty sad organization. 3 series wins in 25 seasons, and 5 playoff appearances in the past 17. I would say making the playoffs should be sort of important. More important than moving one of your better forwards for the 88th pick in the draft.

Thank you. This thread is a sad mix of NHL 15 and an Oilers forum right now


Making the playoffs this year would be the biggest accomplishment the organization has had in 10 years. In needs to be a goal. We should not be selling for picks


* also I should point out that NOT trading someone is in no way abandoning a rebuild. Was the rebuild over when they didn't trade Cammy?

[FBI]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Yup. Better to follow the Oilers model. Dump all the vets and be bad forever until suddenly, Stanley Cup champions!

Or, we can stop pretending that the development and growth of an organization is a binary process.

ARGH not every little move like trading glencross for some futures turns us into the oilers!!! <--- this drives me crazy

Our management is not incompetent like the oilers.