Does Sven have a future with the Flames?

[DOOM]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

It's odd that the Flames list him as left, as does hockeydb, etc. but that's good news for me because our right side is way weaker than the left.

He's listed as a RW here.

http://theahl.com/stats/player.php?id=5574

[GioforPM]

Not disputing it - everyone says he is. Good enough for me. Again, that's good.

[Heavy Jack]

Originally Posted by mile

Hartley isn't telling Sven to play like a pest or change his personality, he is simply pointing to Gallagher as an example of a small guy who competes for every inch of ice each shift. Hartley just wants Sven to battle hard and create energy each shift, something that is expected from every young player on this team - and Gallagher is a very good example of that.

Was there confusion back then? Probably. I think today there is a better understanding from Sven on the improvements in his game he needs to make, and I see it from his play and his attitude lately.

All indications about Sven recently have been positive...not sure why there is so much pessimism about him lately.

Exactly right. Really he could use Jooris as a good example now for Sven, he's a couple inches taller than Sven at 6'1, Sven at 5'11, but also weighs about 190 lbs like Sven does while Gallagher is 5'9 and weighs in at 180 lbs.

Jooris doesn't have that POS attitude that Gallagher carries himself with but he skates with just as much determination and is off to a fine rookie season so far. I think he levels out at 15 goals 15 assists this year while Gallagher is holding strong going into his third NHL season and has steadily put up good numbers so far looking to eclipse his previous years' numbers yet again this year. Could you imagine if Sven skated and competed for every inch of the ice like these two guys do?? He has the skill and talent to put up greater numbers than these types of players he just needs the drive and I think we have seen a good progression in Sven's overall game to this point this year. I think a lengthy playoff run with Adirondack would do wonders for his development!

[Heavy Jack]

Gaudreau - Bennett - Poirier

This line has me extremely excited for the future. Cannot wait to see these three light it up!

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Five-hole

Really? It can't be debated whether Ferland or Baertschi is our top LW prospect?

It can be debated, for sure, but I think the organization even considers Ferland the better prospect right now and you saw it with the fact Ferland had more ice time and more opportunities to contribute over more games than Baertschi.

Baertschi would by the top organizational prospect not named Bennett if he had not been regressing.

Baertschi is a legit prospect. And he is a CALGARY FLAME. Why some people are way more intent on pointing out his flaws, bad games, and bad shifts than any other of our prospects blows my mind.

It's pointed out because there seem to be some people who have trouble accepting the reality of the prospect's problems, and then there are heated debates about whether or not it's a problem with Sven or some other reason/excuse that posters provide. Someone else pointed out that due to where he was drafted Baertschi can do no wrong in some fan's eyes, whereas Jankowski can do no right because people thought it was a poor pick. I heartily agree.

If you're asking me between Ferland and Baertschi who did I think had a more positive impact on a game in their recent call ups? Ferland, without a doubt, and it wasn't really close. IMO Ferland is the better of the two prospects at this point because it's more likely Ferland plays for years in the NHL and I am more and more doubtful about Sven's future in the NHL. If you're not likely to have a long NHL career you're not that good of a prospect, no matter how much talent you have.

[GioforPM]

Going back to the Gallagher thing, I think part of the comparison is that he was a big time scorer in junior, and a small player at 5'9". To make the NHL, he had to become a two way player (the pest part is a bonus).

As is, he's still a .5 PPG guy.

[remember2004]

I just hope we stick with him and hopefully he pans out, there's nothing worst than seeing him succeeding on another team after selling low on him.

[Tinordi]

A possible comparable for Sven's ceiling is someone like Jiri Tlusty.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by CsInMyBlood

Except Sven never had the opportunities or ice-time that all three of those players were handed. Sven is the only player out of those 3 that played 4th line minutes EVERY night. Even in his 2 assist night, setting up two Byron goals he only had 10:12 of ice. The next night he had 10:43 with another assist. The next game? 7:10.

Avg Ice:

Baertschi: 8:55 (Most ice 11:02. Least 6:35)
Granlund: 14:51 (Most ice 20:33. Least 11:19)
Jooris: 15:39 (Most ice 20:47. Least 7:00)
Gaudreau: 16:40 (Most ice 22:17. Least 10:31)

Its fine to say that those guys worked their way up the lineup, but watching every game it was obvious they were given the ice time to make something happen where Sven was not. And before people start saying it was because they earned this ice-time go back and look at the amount of ice they got from day one and the linemates they were put with.

None of them got the 4th line time and linemates.

I'm fine that Sven has been sent down and is doing well in Addy, because to keep him here wasting away on the 4th line wasn't doing anything for him or the team. He was never put into a position to succeed.

Do you really think that Jooris was given anything? They had him scheduled to play 1 pre-season game and send him right down to the AHL. He went balls to the wall for the rookie camp and pre-season and was still sent down. Then he came up and earned a shot by producing.

Gaudreau is a special talent so he got ice time and it worked out.

Granlund is a centre and every centre besides Monahan was hurt so he got ice time.

Sven has to do something to move up in the line-up. He hasn't produced in the AHL much in the past two years. He didn't produce in the pre-season and he had 3 points in 14 games with the Flames. He has to earn it if he wants top 6 ice time.

[GioforPM]

"Except Sven never had the opportunities or ice-time that all three of those players were handed. Sven is the only player out of those 3 that played 4th line minutes EVERY night. Even in his 2 assist night, setting up two Byron goals he only had 10:12 of ice. The next night he had 10:43 with another assist. The next game? 7:10.

Avg Ice:

Baertschi: 8:55 (Most ice 11:02. Least 6:35)
Granlund: 14:51 (Most ice 20:33. Least 11:19)
Jooris: 15:39 (Most ice 20:47. Least 7:00)
Gaudreau: 16:40 (Most ice 22:17. Least 10:31)

Its fine to say that those guys worked their way up the lineup, but watching every game it was obvious they were given the ice time to make something happen where Sven was not. And before people start saying it was because they earned this ice-time go back and look at the amount of ice they got from day one and the linemates they were put with."

Jooris started out with limited time, just like Sven, on the bottom line, just like Sven. The reason his ice time increased is because he succeeded in making Hartley trust him. He did this after being benched and seeing his ice time actually drop. He's also been benched more than Sven, so his actual ice time while being up here is less. Also, he brings more to the table than scoring, as do Granlund and Johnny. If Sven learned how to check or forecheck or kill penalties, he'd be much more useful.

[flambers]

With Sven, in my view he is most definitely moving down the depth charts.

I would think the Flames will continue to invest with his development, as there would be very little return for this type of prospect.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

"Except Sven never had the opportunities or ice-time that all three of those players were handed. Sven is the only player out of those 3 that played 4th line minutes EVERY night. Even in his 2 assist night, setting up two Byron goals he only had 10:12 of ice. The next night he had 10:43 with another assist. The next game? 7:10.

Avg Ice:

Baertschi: 8:55 (Most ice 11:02. Least 6:35)
Granlund: 14:51 (Most ice 20:33. Least 11:19)
Jooris: 15:39 (Most ice 20:47. Least 7:00)
Gaudreau: 16:40 (Most ice 22:17. Least 10:31)

Its fine to say that those guys worked their way up the lineup, but watching every game it was obvious they were given the ice time to make something happen where Sven was not. And before people start saying it was because they earned this ice-time go back and look at the amount of ice they got from day one and the linemates they were put with."

Jooris started out with limited time, just like Sven, on the bottom line, just like Sven. The reason his ice time increased is because he succeeded in making Hartley trust him. He did this after being benched and seeing his ice time actually drop. He's also been benched more than Sven, so his actual ice time while being up here is less. Also, he brings more to the table than scoring, as do Granlund and Johnny. If Sven learned how to check or forecheck or kill penalties, he'd be much more useful.

Jooris also proved he could be a centre and given our injuries that opened up a ton of ice time for him.

[Erick Estrada]

Maybe there really is something with Swiss players. Niederreiter also struggled in his development and while he's made the NHL full time he's not exactly setting the league on fire. He has by far the worst +/- on the Wild.

[Poe969]

I'm getting more and more fed up with Sven. He really hasn't done much to prove that he should be given more ice time or a better chance then what he has been given. It's frustrating because I had high hopes for him but I think that's the main reason I'm frustrated with him... When he was drafted and a lot of pressure put on him and that may have got to him or maybe we're still just expecting too much from him. Either way, I think it's best if he's moved for someone in the same situation as him because a change of scenery would probably benefit everyone.

[remember2004]

Originally Posted by Poe969

I'm getting more and more fed up with Sven. He really hasn't done much to prove that he should be given more ice time or a better chance then what he has been given. It's frustrating because I had high hopes for him but I think that's the main reason I'm frustrated with him... When he was drafted and a lot of pressure put on him and that may have got to him or maybe we're still just expecting too much from him. Either way, I think it's best if he's moved for someone in the same situation as him because a change of scenery would probably benefit everyone.

I can't think of anyone right now but I believe if Sven breaks out, he will break out in a way that will make us regret trading him. I could see something around Sven and one of the Penguins surplus of D prospects, maybe Harrington or Dumoulin. There really hasn't been anyone besides Jenner and Saad and Kucherov that was drafted below him and are or have done better.

[Poe969]

I think he'd do well on another team too and part of me hopes he does because of the situation he's been in with the Flames. The way I see it, he can do nothing in the Flames system and we could keep complaining about him and no one ends up happy. Another option is that he's traded to another team and the Flames get a player that will have less pressure on him and maybe we get a good player out of it. I'd just rather Sven do well on another team (and the Flames get a player who does even better) then do nothing at all. I just don't think he'll ever live up to expectations with the Flames.

[Azhouse]

Originally Posted by Poe969

I'm getting more and more fed up with Sven. He really hasn't done much to prove that he should be given more ice time or a better chance then what he has been given. It's frustrating because I had high hopes for him but I think that's the main reason I'm frustrated with him... When he was drafted and a lot of pressure put on him and that may have got to him or maybe we're still just expecting too much from him. Either way, I think it's best if he's moved for someone in the same situation as him because a change of scenery would probably benefit everyone.

I think that the pressure now is firmly off him as a go to guy. Numerous prospects have surpassed him.

[EldrickOnIce]

Originally Posted by Poe969

I'm getting more and more fed up with Sven. He really hasn't done much to prove that he should be given more ice time or a better chance then what he has been given. It's frustrating because I had high hopes for him but I think that's the main reason I'm frustrated with him... When he was drafted and a lot of pressure put on him and that may have got to him or maybe we're still just expecting too much from him. Either way, I think it's best if he's moved for someone in the same situation as him because a change of scenery would probably benefit everyone.

I think Sven was the hope when there was basically none otherwise.... and so too many over invested in needing him to be good. It was sort of no win, in hindsight.

Here's hoping he gets in all together. He's not that guy we desperately need now, and I'd like him to be one of those guys really pushing for a spot.

[Poe969]

I'm not saying there is still as much pressure on him but the fact that there was a lot of pressure on him got to him and he's labeled as the guy who already didn't live up to that but we still have some expectations of him.

I just don't think he has a future here and I think it's in everyone best interests if he's moved but that's just me.

[The Fonz]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

A possible comparable for Sven's ceiling is someone like Jiri Tlusty.

This is just too obvious.