Would you support Rainbow on Hockey Unis for Sochi?

[korzym12]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

Ok please stop posting.

The olympics are about winning. The country with the most medals can attribute that to their economic wealth that enables them to have spare time and additional resources to invest in their athletes. This is merely a competition for prestige.

[Alberta_Beef]

I think 1 thing is being lost here.

Not every culture embraces the same beliefs. If the overwhelming majority of people in a culture believe something is wrong who are we to argue with that?

The biggest problem I have about our North American culture is the sheer intolerance for anyone who shares different beliefs. It's more or less our way or its wrong, then we preach that intolerance is wrong.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by korzym12

Google STD rates.

They're putting their own lives at risk. How come that fact can get ignored in this situation?

Blatant sexism and blatant racism is not allowed on this forum and will get you banned pretty fast. Unfortunately blatant homophobia is still allowed because it's sadly still a debate and accepted in many parts of the world.

You're a disgusting human being, a relic, your old world views with die off with you.

[strombad]

Originally Posted by korzym12

If it's truly a burden on them they're free to leave Russia. I support this law, and I'm not going to apologize to anyone for that. In Canada, we have freedom of speech laws and I'm completely entitled to my opinion. Also, if the vast majority of Russians find this offensive, then it's completely in line with a true democracy (most will probably confuse a democracy with a republic so read up on that if you want to argue that in a democracy minority rights are 100% guaranteed - in a democracy majority rules). At the end of the day everyone has to comply with laws and stay out of trouble. I don't disrespect gays and conversations end if sexuality is brought up - as that's rude. I comply with Canadian laws and even my own religious beliefs by respecting them but disagreeing with them on this issue. Considering this "community" has overwhelmingly large STD rates, that's a great risk to everyone's health. At the same time they could technically still do what they do in Russia, but they have to comply with Russian laws, just like anywhere else. If it means that much to them then they should move.

The olympics - are merely a commercial sporting event that shouldn't even exist or receive taxpayer money. If you want a rainbow patch, why does that take precedent over an anti-NSA patch or an anti-Federal Reserve patch? It's very ignorant for this group to steal attention from issues that are costing people their lives; and if you put a patch on olympic uniforms just for this group, then our national jerseys will end up looking like european hockey jerseys with tens of advert patches.

Nah bro, you should probably apologise.
I mean hey, people who supported Hitler looked awfully bad after it was all said and done. So you're about on the level with a nazi sympathiser. Congrats.

[Mean Mr. Mustard]

Originally Posted by strombad

I get what you're saying, but there is value in the "Facebook profile" kind of activism. It raises awareness. It's not going out and giving money to some charity to so some THING, but you get people talking, and get people looking into what these things are and educating themselves. You have to remember, it's not China, but Russia is VERY closed off to the outside world. There is a lot of propaganda and misinformation being bandied about. Even something as simple as having hundreds of athletes come out in support of gay rights would get the people talking. It's not a direct form of education, but it does LEAD to education.

To use a really really basic example, if you think anyone who wears white shoes is a loser, and suddenly you see a huge amount of admirable people wearing white shoes, you're at very least going to question your judgement.

I don't think that changing people's views is as easy as putting up a picture or putting a patch on a jersey. It is going to take a lot more than that to actually get people to start talking and to change their opinions.

I agree that something needs to be done but I don't know if it is going to be effective. What I see being the worst outcome is that the 'gays' are used as a convenience scapegoat for when things inevitably don't go well and the patches on the jerseys are held as evidence of that.

I know that it sounds melodramatic but this is a situation similar to civil rights in the United States in the 50s/60s. It is going to be a generational change in attitudes that is still slow on the uptake.

[Mean Mr. Mustard]

Originally Posted by korzym12

If it's truly a burden on them they're free to leave Russia. I support this law, and I'm not going to apologize to anyone for that. In Canada, we have freedom of speech laws and I'm completely entitled to my opinion

Thanks for informing me who should be on my ignore list.

Just because a law exists doesn't mean I have to respect it.

[Wolven]

Originally Posted by korzym12

Google STD rates.

They're putting their own lives at risk. How come that fact can get ignored in this situation?

So you are saying your viewpoint on the Olympics is as ignorant and narrow minded as your opinion on human rights and your understanding of STIs.


Before you try to get all smart on people, did you go perform this google yourself? Most of the top results for googling "STD rates" are articles about Chlamydia and Herpes in Canada. Nothing is mentioned about sexual orientation but I am guessing Chlamydia is mostly found in straight people.

Obviously that means "being straight" results in people putting their lives at risk. How can this fact be ignored in a discussion where it is completely meaningless? Don't you understand that God, religion, personal beliefs, and general idiocy trumps logical conversational connections in a debate over the internet?

You should go google "I'm on a horse". It will provide vast insight to go forward on the topic of Russia and the Olympics.

[Young-Sneezy]

lol ok Putin, you dont have to post as korzym12 anymore, you got us. what a rascal.

[Enoch Root]

The problem that I have with a patch (or any other form of team protest) is that the team does not represent, and does not have the right to speak for, the views of the individuals on that team.

Also, if Hockey Canada or the Canadian Olympic Committee is going to stand up and voice an opinion on this, then they should be willing to stand up and voice an opinion on all of the other issues that we, as Canadians, don't agree with.

Is the COC prepared to wear patches representing every issue that Canadians want to demonstrate against?

I am appalled at this law, and Putin and the citizens of Russia should be ashamed of themselves.

But why does this particular issue deserve our attention and protests more than the myriad of other, equally - and in some cases, more - significant and disturbing issues?

Our athletes should not be burdened with these issues.

However, any athlete (or anyone else for that matter) that wants to demonstrate on their own, about whatever issue they choose, is (and should be) free to do so.

[Jason14h]

Well I googled and found

http://www.cdc.gov/msmhealth/STD.htm

on the first page.

I don't think you know how to use google properly.

[Mean Mr. Mustard]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

Well I googled and found

http://www.cdc.gov/msmhealth/STD.htm

on the first page.

I don't think you know how to use google properly.

Promote safe sex - good, actually great idea.

Promote draconian laws - bad, actually awful idea.

[korzym12]

Originally Posted by Alberta_Beef

I think 1 thing is being lost here.

Not every culture embraces the same beliefs. If the overwhelming majority of people in a culture believe something is wrong who are we to argue with that?

The biggest problem I have about our North American culture is the sheer intolerance for anyone who shares different beliefs. It's more or less our way or its wrong, then we preach that intolerance is wrong.

You hit it.

As someone who doesn't support gays, yet am still respectful towards them - you get compared to nazis who mercilessly killed millions of innocents.

I think when Russia is accused of not being "democratic", it's just an accusation thrown around when they have different views than us.

And through all this note that Russia is my culture's greatest sworn enemy. But in this situation I think they're right.

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by korzym12

As someone who doesn't support gays, yet am still respectful towards them

You haven't been respectful of them at all with your posts.

[Fozzie_DeBear]

Originally Posted by korzym12

You hit it.

As someone who doesn't support gays, yet am still respectful towards them - you get compared to nazis who mercilessly killed millions of innocents.

I think when Russia is accused of not being "democratic", it's just an accusation thrown around when they have different views than us.

And through all this note that Russia is my culture's greatest sworn enemy. But in this situation I think they're right.

Ok...thought excercise for you. Let's assume 10% people are born Christian (it's not a choice for you...no way to convert). A country decides 'democratically' that if you act overtly Christian or are discovered to be Christian you can go to jail.

You cool with that imaginary scenario? I would assume so...

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Alberta_Beef

I think 1 thing is being lost here.

Not every culture embraces the same beliefs. If the overwhelming majority of people in a culture believe something is wrong who are we to argue with that?

The biggest problem I have about our North American culture is the sheer intolerance for anyone who shares different beliefs. It's more or less our way or its wrong, then we preach that intolerance is wrong.

If I may extrapolate this statement into a real world viewpoint, would you then agree that honour killings are a legitimate response by men to a woman in their household causing dishonour or embarrassment to the family, and that such men should not be convicted of murder for such acts?

[Hanna Sniper]

I can't wait for the NHL to start

[strombad]

Originally Posted by korzym12

You hit it.

As someone who doesn't support gays, yet am still respectful towards them - you get compared to nazis who mercilessly killed millions of innocents.

I think when Russia is accused of not being "democratic", it's just an accusation thrown around when they have different views than us.

And through all this note that Russia is my culture's greatest sworn enemy. But in this situation I think they're right.

Actually, you get compared to nazi sympathisers. This is because the human rights violations that occur which are similar to the two.

Example:
Nazi Party - Outlaws being Jewish (something you are born as), Jewish people are arrested and prosecuted if found out.

Putin - Outlaws being homosexual (something you are born as), homosexual people are arrested and prosecuted if found out.

The nazis made their laws referring to Jewish people as "illegal" in 1933, it wasnt until 1941 that the holocaust began taking shape.

The comparison is exact. You are the same as a nazi sympathiser.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by Hanna Sniper

I can't wait for the NHL to start

I hope to god that human rights issues aren't forgotten because hockey is being played.

[Wolven]

Originally Posted by korzym12

You hit it.

As someone who doesn't support gays, yet am still respectful towards them - you get compared to nazis who mercilessly killed millions of innocents.

I think when Russia is accused of not being "democratic", it's just an accusation thrown around when they have different views than us.

And through all this note that Russia is my culture's greatest sworn enemy. But in this situation I think they're right.

It is one thing to not be supportive of gay rights, it is another thing to say gay marriage is not "official" or "right". It is something else altogether to put people in prison because they either performed some action that could be viewed as gay or to even have a conversation about being gay.

For example, if this message thread were a conversation in Russia, everyone would be going to jail.

That has nothing to do with other people having "different views" and everything to do with a state passing laws that oppresses a people.

You can google "oppresses" too: Keep (someone) in subservience and hardship, esp. by the unjust exercise of authority

There is nothing right about oppression and yet here you are trying to support it.

Originally Posted by Fozzie_DeBear

Ok...thought excercise for you. Let's assume 10% people are born Christian (it's not a choice for you...no way to convert). A country decides 'democratically' that if you act overtly Christian or are discovered to be Christian you can go to jail.

You cool with that imaginary scenario? I would assume so...

Of course he is okay with it. He will happily go to jail because the majority decided that his religion is illegal to demonstrate or perform. But of course in the perfect world he would flee his country first and pray that a more tolerant country will take him in.

[Alberta_Beef]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

If I may extrapolate this statement into a real world viewpoint, would you then agree that honour killings are a legitimate response by men to a woman in their household causing dishonour or embarrassment to the family, and that such men should not be convicted of murder for such acts?

I am not saying anything is right or wrong because I never grew up in that culture to understand why they believe what they do. It's easy to sit on the outside and pass judgement.