Human Foot sent to Tory Headquarters

[Flash Walken]

I can only echo the statements of others in this thread, but based on public history of the individual, this is, like Cap'n said, the 'real-time' following of a serial killer.

Things that point to this not being his first kill:

The premeditation of it. Generally, to construct a scenario with the necessary tools and situation to carry it out (killing, dismembering a corpse while filming it etc.), a serial murderer has progressed out of the initial stage of his attacks (animals). The first human kill is generally not one of the stalking or prepared type, more of an impulse.

Based on the little public information we have of him, and my (non existent) degree in forensic psychology, I think it's pretty safe to assume this guy has killed previously, is clearly an organized serial killer who is likely motivated by his own hedonistic psychology.

I think more than one open case of human remains has the potential to be solved if the suspect is taken into custody alive.

[OffsideSpecialist]

Originally Posted by leonk19

http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/CanadaAM/2...-party-120530/

This article says he left a note with the foot stating he may kill again. What a nut. Hopefully they catch him quick.

Ottawa Police have denied that report. They said the note he wrote sounded like ramblings from a lunatic, but said that he did not appear to have intentions of killing again.

[CaptainCrunch]

I've read some books on some pretty horrible serial killers over the year, Chikatilo in Russia, Ted Bundy, Ed Gein, Dahlmer.

The one thing that they usually had in common was that there were strong indications that they had actually killed before the trail of bodies officially started. Sometimes when these guys brag that they've killed this wild number of people even though officially they're linked to very few, its usually true to an extent.

Usually serial killers are very organized. At first their kills are usually very impulse based. Like a teenager having sex the first few times. Their kills are pretty random and almost like a fury kill until they figure out what turns them on about the kill and what they want to achieve with their kills.

Its rare to find a disorganized serial killer once you hit that stage. Even Dahlmer who was as wacky as a brain damaged badger was very organized in his methods before during and after the kill.

Bundy was almost lizard like once he got his patterns down as was Chikatilo .

This killing in a lot of ways was very organized, especially with what he did with the body parts.

The other thing that stood out in these books was that there was an argument between serial killers wanting to get caught versus a serial killer hitting a success level and beoming arrogant about it to the point that he becomes sloppy and makes mistakes that get them caught, then like the master manipulater that they are they will state that they did what they did so someone will catch them.

In one book I read on psychopaths they interviewed one guy who basically used his nature to become a fairly proficient mob hitter. He had the typical pshycopathic tendancy of not recognizing his victims as human beings, but more as things in his domain. He was pretty arrogant about it and because of his "condition" showed very little emotion and no remorse. In an experiement they told him that his cat died and he had an emotional response to that. He could relate to his kitten as an object of care and effection, but not human beings.

[Flames_Gimp]

watched the video... so f'd up.

[kirant]

Originally Posted by Flames_Gimp

watched the video... so f'd up.

I don't want to derail this into a gross out thread, but how could you watch it? I just saw a screen cap and it was enough for me to hate myself to looking it up.

[Flames_Gimp]

Originally Posted by kirant

I don't want to derail this into a gross out thread, but how could you watch it? I just saw a screen cap and it was enough for me to hate myself to looking it up.

morbid curiosity I guess...I couldn't look away

[metallicat]

Originally Posted by Flames_Gimp

watched the video... so f'd up.

When I saw you last posted in this thread, I knew it was because you had watched it.

[rabenson000]

Originally Posted by Flames_Gimp

morbid curiosity I guess...I couldn't look away

I seen the video on the 26th before the media and authorities even found out about it. It's a shame internet users knew it was Luka Magnotta even before the police did.

[pylon]

Originally Posted by HPLovecraft

Oh please. Personally, I'm a schizophrenia sufferer sympathizer, not a Vincinet Li sympathizer, and people are perfectly capable of doing bat-#### nasty stuff without being schizophrenic. He is not obviously mentally ill until they catch him and look at him.

If your post wasn't an attempt at a thread derailment, I don't know what is.

Edit: I also find it funny you take the time to try and criticize the "bleeding hearts" out there when you came in this thread wanting the mods to delete all the puns made at the beginning of it because you felt they were in such bad taste.

Both men killed another human being.

Both men decapitated that human being.

Both men ate pieces of their victims.

No sane human being does these things, and an argument can be made that only an insane person would. And if he was not insane, there is about a thousand other mental disorders you could tag to him. It is completely out of the scope of normal human behaviour for someone to do it, and it could be argued that anyone who does such a thing is mentally ill.

So basically, if you sympathize with Li's disorder, unfortunately, you pretty much have to sympathize with this cat's as well. I can pretty much assure you, that Luka Magnotta has Narcissistic personality disorder just based on his websites and online postings. Is that his fault? It wasn't Li's fault he had Schizophrenia, right?

So I guess what you are saying is, killers with one mental illness, should be given more latitude than others? Schizophrenia is a free pass to murder, but insanity is not? Correct me if I am wrong please.

I can understand where people may sympathize with Li. Unfortunately, I hold the belief that even if the guy didn't mean to do what he did, he still did it. And he should pay the ultimate price for it, at minimum being locked away for life. If it was a family member of mine in Li's place, I would feel the same. He ruined a families life, and the pussified Canadian justice system continues to as well, as they are giving Li more help and support, than the f'n family of the young kid who had his head sawed off by him. The justice minister and the parole board, should just go take a big steaming crap, right on the mothers face, because that is what they are doing her. And he also scarred every single person that sat on that busses life for the rest of their lives. And we have sympathy for that monster?

It is not my fault the guys brain is broken, and society should not have to worry about a total nutcase, that could snap at any minute and saw your head off walking the streets. It is a shame one of the officers didn't walk in the bus, and blow the guys head off, and just claim he lunged at them with the knife.

Lastly, my call to remove the puns, was in consideration of the victims family. As someone who has just recently had to deal with the online identity of a deceased family member, I cannot begin to think what that family must be thinking under such horrific circumstances. Even though the the web is awash with jokes about this case, I figured we, could at least do our small part, and be a little classier than that.

[Yasa]

Schizophrenia and sociopathy are 2 very different things. Neither are passes for murder, but one is treatable and rehabilitation is an option, the other not so much. Their actions, while terrible and similar do not make them identical cases. It's their motive that sets them apart.

[pylon]

I understand that Yasa. But neither is 'the fault' per se, of the individual suffering the symptoms. So how can you feel for one guy, and not the other? That is my question. It seems very hypocritical.

Both of these men crossed a line for which there should be no forgiveness in my eyes. Period.

[CaptainCrunch]

Except I've read a lot of common opinions that schizo is a mental illness and caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain. Psycho's are a mental defect where its not caused by a treatable chemical imbalance as much as a combination of a actual physical difference in the brain and environment.

[flylock shox]

This discussion is giving me deja vu. I'm sure this distinction has been debated on here before.

I see your point Pylon: if you're going to sympathize with a person who is unfortunate enough to have schizophrenia, why not sympathize with a person who has antisocial personality disorder, or even a sexual attraction to children that they can't help?

I think the answer may simply be a matter of choice. A schizophrenic person suffers from delusions and hallucinations, and can't make rational decisions that are grounded in reality as a consequence. The tendencies of a person with APD (or related characteristics however you might define them) may be inherent to the person, but don't rob the person of the ability to make a rational choice, much in the same way a child molester may always be attracted to children, but chooses not to act on it.

It seems to me that the schizophrenic cannot make a moral choice, whereas a psychopath can (they just aren't always inclined to). And that's what it comes down to really.

[Wormius]

Everybody to some degree is like that. What's the difference then between mental illness and just being an ass? Certainly being an ass is rooted in how a person's brain is wired, how they were brought up, etc.

Would any sane person would commit murder?

[pylon]

Originally Posted by flylock shox

I think the answer may simply be a matter of choice. A schizophrenic person suffers from delusions and hallucinations, and can't make rational decisions that are grounded in reality as a consequence. The tendencies of a person with APD (or related characteristics however you might define them) may be inherent to the person, but don't rob the person of the ability to make a rational choice, much in the same way a child molester may always be attracted to children, but chooses not to act on it.

I am in agreeance on this issue more than you may think and I do understand the differences. But pedophiles do not choose to be attracted to children, nor did Dahmer choose to kill as a way to satisfy sexual urges. It is a very blurry line. That is all I am pointing out.

Although their frame of mind was vastly different during the commission of the crimes, they are both affected by disorders that were the root cause of their actions that they had no choice in being plagued with.

[Yasa]

Originally Posted by pylon

I understand that Yasa. But neither is 'the fault' per se, of the individual suffering the symptoms. So how can you feel for one guy, and not the other? That is my question. It seems very hypocritical.

Both of these men crossed a line for which there should be no forgiveness in my eyes. Period.

A schizophrenic can and will feel empathy and sympathy. A socio/pyschopath does not. For me, it's easier to be empathetic to a person that can reciprocate vs. one that does not.

In the moment of their attacks, a schizo may not understand or grasp the severity of their actions but afterwards and after treatment they realize what has happened. Depression is common for schizophrenics as a result of this.

A sociopathic murderer doesn't care before, during or after. They can't relate to people because they show no ability to empathize. They can't be rehabilitated with any amount of treatment. They will continue the desire to kill/feel powerful.

[afc wimbledon]

you really cannot view any of these things as absolutes, you can get different degrees of schizophrenia as well as different degrees of pyschopathy,in fact the arsehole that talked your grandmother into a new roof she didn't need or sold you a pyramid scheme is almost always some level of sociopath.

You can get sociopaths that have little or no concern for strangers but are reletively normal with their own immediate circle.

[Yasa]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

you really cannot view any of these things as absolutes, you can get different degrees of schizophrenia as well as different degrees of pyschopathy,in fact the arsehole that talked your grandmother into a new roof she didn't need or sold you a pyramid scheme is almost always some level of sociopath.

You can get sociopaths that have little or no concern for strangers but are reletively normal with their own immediate circle.

Absolutely. I was speaking in simplified terms, but it's how I generally determine who I feel sympathy for and how much.

[Caged Great]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

you really cannot view any of these things as absolutes, you can get different degrees of schizophrenia as well as different degrees of pyschopathy,in fact the arsehole that talked your grandmother into a new roof she didn't need or sold you a pyramid scheme is almost always some level of sociopath.

You can get sociopaths that have little or no concern for strangers but are reletively normal with their own immediate circle.

My brother is one of those, but he's mostly harmless despite being not a good human being.

[OffsideSpecialist]

The psychiatrist that looked after Bernardo thinks that this guy (or gal now apparently) is pretty likely to re-offend.

Bradford said he is worried that the suspect is a sadist, with a serious personality disorder, who is “possibly a psychopath.”
And after killing once, he may be consumed by an urge to attack again. “People who get to the point of committing sexually-motivated homicides have very strong drives to continue.”
And to that end, Bradford said that it’s important to understand whether the killing was sexually motivated.
“The sexual component is assumed but until we know what relationship there was between him and this man, who is now deceased, it’s speculative. Although there is good evidence to support it (being sexually motivated),” he added.
“Was he in a relationship with this male? We don’t have the answer to that. It sounds as though they knew each other. Was this a sadistic homicide against a gay partner?”
Dr. Bradford explained that if a person kills because they are “high on drugs or psychotic,” the “drive to kill again is less strong.”
He also said it’s unlikely that the suspect is mentally ill or psychotic. “Most people with serious mental disorder don’t do these types of things.” He also says their thoughts are too disordered to carry out such a deliberate publicity campaign


Read more: http://www.ottawacitizen.com/health/...#ixzz1wXicYcKs

It seems to me like he thinks a sexually oriented criminal would be more likely to re-offend, more so that somebody psychotic. I really think this guy is much more dangerous and much more likely to reoffend than Vincent Li is.