Trading Kings!!!

[Goffie]

This has been a good discussion to read:
I feel that when gm's want to make a deal they should have specific targets in mind and try and go after a player either on msn or via pm. I find that I make just as many deals via pm as I do on msn now. Once upon a time 99% of my deals on msn. I find with my time zone and my current job I cant be staying up late looking for deals. I am usually in bed at 11:30 or so which is only 8pm in Calgary so a lot of people don't step online before I am sleeping. That is why I use more pm. I have pm access for 13hrs a day and I would say I am on the site 20-30 times a day.(Yes I am obsessed).

I find as more and more teams get established their trading drops. GM's have the players they want and want to win with that team. I know I will make a lot of deals during the season if I am struggling, but I made my moves early this offseason and have a roster I feel ready to battle with so I am not out looking for many deals. The teams I have a problem with are the ones with no clear goal whether it be rebuilding or winning and who dont respond to trade requests. When teams sit in limbo of neither rebuilding or trying to compete with no effort from the gm to head in a certain direction while not responding to pms then that gm should go. Other then that if gm's are happy with their team and want to head into the season how they are I have no issues with that.

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by Cheese

How does a GM have time to play the game using the PM feature and not on MSN? Why is it ok to rat on a GM who doesn't use the PM feature and yet MSN is off grounds?
Why don't the GMs who use the PM feature PM those who don't?
Conversely why is it up to those GMs who are active to make a non active GM play the game via PM?

Because many people can use PM at work but not MSN.

And no one is ranting on anyone for not using PM. GMs can use PM if they find that easier - or use MSN.

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by Goffie

This has been a good discussion to read:
I feel that when gm's want to make a deal they should have specific targets in mind and try and go after a player either on msn or via pm. I find that I make just as many deals via pm as I do on msn now. Once upon a time 99% of my deals on msn. I find with my time zone and my current job I cant be staying up late looking for deals. I am usually in bed at 11:30 or so which is only 8pm in Calgary so a lot of people don't step online before I am sleeping. That is why I use more pm. I have pm access for 13hrs a day and I would say I am on the site 20-30 times a day.(Yes I am obsessed).

I find as more and more teams get established their trading drops. GM's have the players they want and want to win with that team. I know I will make a lot of deals during the season if I am struggling, but I made my moves early this offseason and have a roster I feel ready to battle with so I am not out looking for many deals. The teams I have a problem with are the ones with no clear goal whether it be rebuilding or winning and who dont respond to trade requests. When teams sit in limbo of neither rebuilding or trying to compete with no effort from the gm to head in a certain direction while not responding to pms then that gm should go. Other then that if gm's are happy with their team and want to head into the season how they are I have no issues with that.

I have no issue with you or the Penguins, don't have issues with anyone for that matter Goffie. The Penguins are a strong contender and if I owned your team I would tred lightly as well...although Ive been known to trade them all and start over again! You also aggressively pursue deals on PM or MSN...played both ways with you.
The diff is with the bottom 20 teams...Im not even sure there is a real top 10 yet...should be a lot of maneuvering right now to make things better...and if it isn't now it surely should have been two months ago.

[Goffie]

Originally Posted by Cheese

The diff is with the bottom 20 teams...Im not even sure there is a real top 10 yet...should be a lot of maneuvering right now to make things better...and if it isn't now it surely should have been two months ago.

I agree here, I am surprised that more teams are not gearing up for a playoff push. There are a few bubble teams who are not a sure shot for the playoffs and not in a youth movement who have been very idle this entire offseason.

I know if I was a bubble team I would trade, trade, and trade some more until I felt like I was a top team. That has been my philosophy since I joined the league!!

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

Because many people can use PM at work but not MSN.

And no one is ranting on anyone for not using PM. GMs can use PM if they find that easier - or use MSN.

I was referring to your comment that "we should let the league know if a GM doesnt get back to us on PM"...and I suggested why is it only for PM?

I also asked why a GM who uses that feature does not pursue deals themselves using that feature. The ones who do use it consistently are the same ones who pop by on MSN as well.

Not trying to get under your skin, just trying to find the balance here. I dont buy the fact that a GM cannot find a few hours where they couldnt put their laptop on their knee and play the game while watching their favorite TV show during the evening, you find the time to do it. Very few of us are that busy where we are going 18 hours a day, and if we are...why play this?

[Caged Great]

This point in time is basically trading limbo. Last year, after UFA, but before the season started, there wasn't much action going on at all.

This year, for the past two-three weeks, there's been nothing much going on. I believe it's because most teams like the make up of their current roster, and are just waiting for the season to start in order to see the chemistry that certain players have with each other before resuming the trading frenzy.

Then especially closer to the trade deadline it picks up, many teams that are on the fringe are looking for prospects, or that last acquisition to make a run of it.

I know personally, I'm hoping to snag a few players towards the deadline to make a playoff push next season, but unfortunately there are 5-6 months between now and then.

I will try to make more of an effort to be online on MSN more often. I just personally find it easier to get back to the other person if I'm not available through PM, but either works. From now on, if I'm "online" but don't respond right away, it usually means that I'm taking care of something around the house reno wise or on the phone with a client/supplier/trade etc.

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by Cheese

I was referring to your comment that "we should let the league know if a GM doesnt get back to us on PM"...and I suggested why is it only for PM?

I still don't get it - if you are sending someone a message on MSN and they aren't on - they wont' get it. But people will always get the PM at some point - and should reply.

Originally Posted by Cheese

Not trying to get under your skin, just trying to find the balance here. I dont buy the fact that a GM cannot find a few hours where they couldnt put their laptop on their knee and play the game while watching their favorite TV show during the evening, you find the time to do it. Very few of us are that busy where we are going 18 hours a day, and if we are...why play this?

I think you underestimate how busy some of our GMs are. And that's OK - again - I'm not interested in a league full of teens with nothing to do but sit on MSN. We are being accommodating to our long term GMs in particular who have demonstrated an ability to stay involved at an appropriate level even if they aren't on MSN.

I've been on MSN a fair chunk lately and there's just not much available out there as teams wait for the season to start.

We can't force teams to trade. If they feel like they have a team that can compete then who are we to tell them they are wrong?

[cphlblackhawks]

I'm one of those guys who gets to be on MSN at work but as some have seen don't always have time to answer until later. But I was a huge trader before and am now very happy with my team, if the right deal comes along I look at it but honestly I haven't been able to talk myself into deals.
As far as lack of activity, it's a fantasy league, not everyone will be on 24/7 or even once a day. As Grant said, there are other ways to contact them than MSN including just sending a trade offer their way or the e-mail function on their page...

[I wanna be like Miikka]

One of the biggest draws to the cphl imo is the long term GMs. Right now we have a lot of guys that have been around for a while and it is a nice feeling to know that if I run into a crazy couple weeks I won't be fired for it. Obviously the activity of a few GMs could be improved but I'd say that number is 5 or so and realistically every league in the world will have a small number of GMs that could use some improvement.

This same thing happened last year, right now everyone spent the last 4-5 months leading to this point in time. Most GMs are content waiting, once the season starts and guys lose 2 straight games then we will see a ton of trades. I know during the season if I lose 5 games I make 2-3 trades at least and get the guys struggling in the sim off my roster. I think it will pick up soon, but I definitely like 85% or more of our GMs and reaaaaaally appreciate the understanding shown by the higher ups when it comes to needing some time.

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by cphlblackhawks

I'm one of those guys who gets to be on MSN at work but as some have seen don't always have time to answer until later. But I was a huge trader before and am now very happy with my team, if the right deal comes along I look at it but honestly I haven't been able to talk myself into deals.
As far as lack of activity, it's a fantasy league, not everyone will be on 24/7 or even once a day. As Grant said, there are other ways to contact them than MSN including just sending a trade offer their way or the e-mail function on their page...

You are always around...and always answer within minutes.
Im not suggesting everyone be on 24/7, wasnt what I was talking about...I suggested a few hours a week.

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by I wanna be like Miikka

One of the biggest draws to the cphl imo is the long term GMs. Right now we have a lot of guys that have been around for a while and it is a nice feeling to know that if I run into a crazy couple weeks I won't be fired for it. Obviously the activity of a few GMs could be improved but I'd say that number is 5 or so and realistically every league in the world will have a small number of GMs that could use some improvement.

This same thing happened last year, right now everyone spent the last 4-5 months leading to this point in time. Most GMs are content waiting, once the season starts and guys lose 2 straight games then we will see a ton of trades. I know during the season if I lose 5 games I make 2-3 trades at least and get the guys struggling in the sim off my roster. I think it will pick up soon, but I definitely like 85% or more of our GMs and reaaaaaally appreciate the understanding shown by the higher ups when it comes to needing some time.

Agreed with bold part and again, thats why I based this on the last two months not the last two weeks. Why are teams that are poor to ok waiting for the season to start? I could easily pick out 15 teams right now that I know wont win...so why are they waiting for the season to start? I love the fact its a mature league as well...makes things simpler in some ways. It also works to make it complacent.
The fact you can take off for two weeks and not lose your team is admirable and yes that is part of the maturity.

[Flickered Flame]

I am one of the GMs who rarely goes on MSN any more. First of all, my teaching job doesn't allow me to go during "work" hours but I am able to jump on during recess or lunch break to check pms. Secondly, I feel that I am very successful in using pm. I am the one who usually inquires about a certain player or trade that I am interested in. If I am unable to check rosters, I will send a reply letting the other gm know when I will get to it. Third, if I get involved in a heavy trade discussion, I will jump on MSN to chat with the other GM. I did that with the Alfredsson trade just a couple of weeks ago.

I think the game has really evolved. GMs use to make trades just to trade, now GMs are much better and almost all have a long term vision of where he/she is going with the team, that may or may not be a positive but it is a reality. Another I have noticed is that most GMs want the same type of assets when trading, that makes it difficult to get a trade done, it can be done, but it is much harder. I guess going along with that, several GMs I have had discussions with, still have to win the deal in order to make a trade. I'm not always perfect in my offers but I try as much as possible to make the offer more of a win-win for both teams.

[droopydrew19]

Hello my names Drew and I am a CPHL Hermit.

I get what Chesus is laying down. I have been on both ends of the spectrum here.
I trade in bunches. Over the summer there were some factors holding me back. One of which is bad contracts.

Having Nylander and Cheechoo eat salary with no real way of dumping it sucks. Also having Blake and soon to be Lehtenin retire leaves me having to reassess my team.

The NHL allows for teams to hide big contracts in the AHL but it seems like we have to wait them out. The NHL also has reduced buy out periods that we do not have the luxury of.

[Hanna Sniper]

The thread according to the Hurricanes

MSN/PM - When I was on MSN all the time I really never had a problem making the deals when I needed too. I would MSN the Msn members and PM the others. Right now it's just PM for me buts because of visual reasons and is not really what we're talking about here.

Trading: I've always found it difficult because I don't really have the same goals as "trading is good" GM's. For one, I don't want to be a top team, I've said it before but I find the funniest place to sit in this games are the 7-10 spots in the division. The real playoff race is the best position to be in standing wise. So as I Gm may look at my team and wondering why it is that I'm not making that extra deal to get me closer the front runners. The reality is I'm starting to fear that I'm sitting a little too high.

Grid contracts, I have nothing against them but it's very doubtful that your going to see the Hurricanes hand out a overpriced contract for someone thats seen much better days. Some teams can't pass on the player and feel the need to save an asset regardless of his cost. Where am I going with this? well try and trade one of those players to me. I've worked hard to be the top two team that has the most cap space available. I don't do it to just hand over that money to other teams or take on your over priced players.... I do it because I target better bang for the buck players. As teams may be looking for cheaper players from my team what would be helpful if they understood was that I was looking to shed some fat from my payroll as well.

Trading an asset to get an asset to trade for an asset.
Now this is an area I'm afraid I'm horrible at and something that, not directly, is something cheese could be touching on when it comes to trading. Let's say I see a hole on my team and need a defensive Defenceman. I put a small list together po the top 5 guys I want to target. Sure enough right off the bat I trade for the ace on my list and get Robyn Regehr. This is where I fail, because I pack up my table and go home. I find it hard to trade Regehr for another asset because I'm just going to have to trade that asset to acquire another Regehr

Now I'm not talking about when I trade Regehr to fill another need that I think is greater, I'm talking about trading Regehr just for the sake of trading and because trading is what a fantasy league is about. I admit that I have a hard time at this. I paid a lot to acquire a checking center in Sutter, it's a little early but I think I have him. To move Sutter, I think it is harder to replace him then it is to acquire whatever asset I'm getting for him.

Doesn't mean guys are untouchable for the Hurricanes, I've traded Ovechkin, Nash, Iggy, Thornton, Zeterberg and Yzerman. I just need thier piece of the puzzle no longer fit, whether that means I was tempted by something else or a different approach then the direction i was going.

[MJK]

The only reason I decided to go with a young team is becuase I wanted to get some trades going in this league. I have taken a lot of downgrades lately but only because everyone else wants to upgrade. If a team is willing to pay up to get the better player in the deal then deal with me!

I am a flipper. I will acquire stuff to flip it over and over again to get the team that I want. I have always done this successfully.

Where is "The Jerk" when you need him to stir the pot??

[SweetDoc]

Since I've been a GM, which began this early off-season, I've noticed as well that it's usually the same GMs online, there are some GMs I've never seen online and I'm on often.

I have no issue with PMs or GMs who are not able to be on MSN for whatever reason.

However, I can honestly say that based on the application I filled out when I wanted to start being a GM and based on the rules, I was expecting more GMs to be more active.

I know things are slow right now because rosters are pretty much set and also that things may have been slow at times during the summer because of holidays, but based on the emphasis put on MSN, PMs, and being active when I first applied, I'm a little surprised.

[Knut]

Let me weigh in a bit here.

Most summers I would be middle of the road for trades. However, my team was old and had a very inflated payroll at the start of the offseason. I had rebuild my team up from scratch in a short period of time. That is the reason for all the deals i have made.

In so far as GM participation. I have never had an issue making a deal over PM. However, there are GM's that have never PM'd or messaged me for a specific player. What I do find is that if i post on the message board the player I want to move and the return i want, I will get many offers.

I understand that some people play the game to collect prospects, and some like to sit on the same team for year, and that some prefer to trade alot. I like this aspect of the league. Everyone plays the game the way they want to play it. Obviously many GM's have not had an issue making deals. It just takes some work.

Finally, I think a good solution would be to bring back Mandatory Trade Block updates. Maybe make a sub-forum on the message board where each team has a Trade Block that they can update with who is on the block and what the team needs are. This will help each team think about the holes in their lineup and make it easier to find a potential trade partner.

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by MJK

The only reason I decided to go with a young team is becuase I wanted to get some trades going in this league. I have taken a lot of downgrades lately but only because everyone else wants to upgrade. If a team is willing to pay up to get the better player in the deal then deal with me!

I am a flipper. I will acquire stuff to flip it over and over again to get the team that I want. I have always done this successfully.

Where is "The Jerk" when you need him to stir the pot??

hmm...Jerk...I love Jerk chick...errr..sorry Im a vegetarian!

We do need the Jerk back!

[Prototype]

I'm pretty sure I'm awesome at trading. It's the actual game that I'm lacking in awesomeness.