Good News for Supporters of the Return of the Winnipeg Jets!

[Rhettzky]

Originally Posted by SeeBass

Now magine the Flames leaving and years later ,and all you have are memories, and you have some BLANK BLANK make horrible insulting comments about the very tradition that you held so dear for a cheap slam on a forum, is lame.

Just so we're all on the same page here... this is the 'horrible, insulting comment' and a 'cheap slam'?

Originally Posted by Locke

That is, until people realize that they werent that good to begin with and they aren't that good right now, in fact, they've really never been any good....

Okaaayyyy....

[SeeBass]

Originally Posted by Locke

What? People got their panties in a bunch because they forget that the reason they lost the Jets in the first place was because the team wasnt very good, people stopped going and the market couldnt afford to keep taking the losses.

Yes, Calgary and Edmonton were in the same boat at one point in time in their own respective Franchises as well, Corporate and Community support stepped in here just like it did in Winnipeg, difference being there was enough support in Calgary and Edmonton and there wasnt in Winnipeg.

Has that changed? I dont see it. Even if it has, all it meant was a stay of execution, if things stay bad enough long enough theres no saving anyone.

And for future reference, dont give me the response of a 12 Year Old: "If mommy werent watching I'd call you a really nasty name!!"

If you have a problem with a statement of mine, then try, using your 'grown-up' voices, to articulate your issue with my contention.

As for Aeneas, yeah man, those empty buildings are brutal. Watching the Flames roadtrip through places like Nashville, Phoenix, Detroit and Anaheim were awful.

Last night I was switching between a replay of the Bayern Munich/Juventus Champions League game and the Vancouver/Nashville game, despite the preposterously poor production value of the Canucks broadcast that building was a ghost town. Sportsnet shouldnt have zoomed out at the end showing a half full lower bowl and a deserted arena.

You lowered the bar

So for future reference start with an adult post

Your post and attitude doesnt warrant a response as an adult as it appeared I wasn't dealing with one from your first post.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by SeeBass

My feelings may sound dramatic to some but if you have been a Jet fan you know where I am coming from.

Are you serious? Locke called the Winnipeg Jets a marginal hockey team and you are willing to throw down the gauntlet for that?!

I understand sentiment, but it is ridiculous to expect anyone—particularly on an internet forum!—to exercise the sort of sensitivity that you seem to require. As much as you loved the Jets, please don't attempt to equate their cultural significance to something that warrants such an indignant response.

Originally Posted by SeeBass

...Now [i]magine the Flames leaving and years later ,and all you have are memories, and you have some BLANK BLANK make horrible insulting comments about the very tradition that you held so dear for a cheap slam on a forum, is lame.

Please show me the said "horribly insulting comments".

Locke said EXACLTY the following:

Originally Posted by Locke

...like all things the memories of the Winnipeg Jets become fonder and fonder...

Did he say something derogatory or untrue? Did he say something vulgar or ignorant? Not at all. In fact, his observation draws attention to a rather universal phenomenon: that it is human nature to romanticize the past. I teach university level courses in religion, and can attest to the nearly global nature of this behaviour. People construct memories in extremes, and this will dramatically affect how they recall the past. Jets fans are no exception: the team was not very good, and their relocation was in large part a result of this.

Originally Posted by Locke

...That is, until people realize that they werent that good to begin with and they aren't that good right now, in fact, they've really never been any good....

It is a far cry from the rhetoric of holocaust deniers. Please exercise some perspective and restraint in your future expressions of umbrage.

[SeeBass]

Originally Posted by Rhettzky

Just so we're all on the same page here... this is the 'horrible, insulting comment' and a 'cheap slam'?



Okaaayyyy....

Like I mentioned you don't get it and you never will.

[Dion]

[VladtheImpaler]

Originally Posted by SeeBass

Like I mentioned you don't get it and you never will.

[skinny01]

I'd like to see the Jets back in Winnipeg, if it's ever possible.

[HOOT]

Originally Posted by SeeBass

You lowered the bar

So for future reference start with an adult post

Your post and attitude doesnt warrant a response as an adult as it appeared I wasn't dealing with one from your first post.

Yet here you are responding to him. Get over yourself!

[SeeBass]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Are you serious? Locke called the Winnipeg Jets a marginal hockey team and you are willing to throw down the gauntlet for that?!

I understand sentiment, but it is ridiculous to expect anyone—particularly on an internet forum!—to exercise the sort of sensitivity that you seem to require. As much as you loved the Jets, please don't attempt to equate their cultural significance to something that warrants such an indignant response.



Please show me the said "horribly insulting comments".

Locke said EXACLTY the following:

Did he say something derogatory or untrue? Did he say something vulgar or ignorant? Not at all. In fact, his observation draws attention to a rather universal phenomenon: that it is human nature to romanticize the past. I teach university level courses in religion, and can attest to the nearly global nature of this behaviour. People construct memories in extremes, and this will dramatically affect how they recall the past. Jets fans are no exception: the team was not very good, and their relocation was in large part a result of this.


It is a far cry from the rhetoric of holocaust deniers. Please exercise some perspective and restraint in your future expressions of umbrage.

Good work it only took a few minutes for somebody to mention Nazis.
What is this Fox News!

You are full of crap if that is how you saw the tones in Locke's post

[SeeBass]

Originally Posted by HOOT

Yet here you are responding to him. Get over yourself!

Look out higher moral values from HOOT!!

Irony warning!

[Homer_J]

I'm not completely convinced it could work in Winnipeg, but I'm hopeful. Even though I always hated the Jets I would love to see an NHL team back in Manitoba.

There are currently 48 suites in the MTS Centre. I know there were at least 90 on the waiting list as of February 2009. The number of suites can be expanded, and the owners have discussed expansion, even without the NHL.

When talking attendance numbers, it's tough to compare the numbers of the Southern teams. How many of those tickets are given away or sold for $10-$25? In Phoenix's case, the actual gate numbers since the lockout have been anywhere from 2,000-5,000 less than the "paid" attendance. I can't imagine that ever happening in a strong hockey market.

Most importantly, the majority owners of the Moose and MTS Centre are Mark Chipman and David Thomson. The Thomson's happens to be the richest family in Canada. If he comes to the conclusion that Winnipeg can support an NHL team, I'll take his word for it.

______________________________________________

I feel for Jets4Life so I've gathered some info that could help his arguments.

Here's some census numbers I grabbed from another forum and posted in a previous Jets thread:


Corporate presence in Winnipeg compared to other Canadian cities:

Corporate head offices; Top 500 largest publically traded companies (2008):

Winnipeg: 12
Edmonton: 7
Ottawa: 7
Quebec City: 2
Hamilton: 1

Corporate head offices; Companies of all sizes (2005):

Edmonton: 157
Winnipeg: 129
Ottawa: 101

Corporate head offices; total employment (2005):

Winnipeg: 6 890
Ottawa: 4 667
Edmonton: 3 428

Winnipeg’s key economic indicators comparison 1994-2008 (since the jets left):

population:
1994: 676 000
2008: 733 000

population growth:
1994: 1600
2008: 10 000

average house value:
1994: $84 000 (Canadian average $158 000) 53% of the canadian average
2008: $191 000 (Canadian average $275 000) 70% of the canadian average

total value of building permits issued:
1994: $300 million
2008: $ 1 billion

housing starts:
1994: 972
2008: 3400

average household income:
1994: $43 000 (Canadian average $49 000) 87%
2008: $72 000 (Canadian average $70 500) 102%

unemployment rate
1994: 10.4% (Canadian average 9.5%)
2008: 4.3% (Canadian average 6%) (3rd in Canada)

total employment
1994: 318 000
2008: 400 000

retail sales:
1994: $4.3 million
2008: $9.3 million

GDP per capita
1994: $21 100 (Canada $26 700) 79% of the canadian average
2008: $44 500 (Canada $46 400) 96% of the canadian average

2008 economic growth 3.9% (third among Canadian cities)




Canada's 800 largest corporations (according to Financial Post):

Winnipeg: 32 + 3 subsidiaries = 35
Edmonton: 25 + 1 subsidiary = 26
Quebec City: 16 + 2 subsidiaries = 18
Ottawa: 15 + 1 subsidiary = 16

http://www.financialpost.com/magazine/fp500/list.html

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by SeeBass

Good work it only took a few minutes for somebody to mention Nazis.
What is this Fox News!

You are full of crap if that is how you saw the tones in Locke's post

[SeeBass]

Originally Posted by VladtheImpaler

I would consider myself quilty of that

[Dion]

Originally Posted by SeeBass

Good work it only took a few minutes for somebody to mention Nazis.
What is this Fox News!

You are full of crap if that is how you saw the tones in Locke's post

Textcritic was spot on with his remarks towards you. There was nothing insulting in Locke's remarks. Stop being so sensitive.

[HOOT]

Originally Posted by SeeBass

Look out higher moral values from HOOT!!

Irony warning!

Let's be honest here you know nothing about me or irony. Keep up the good work.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by SeeBass

Like I mentioned you don't get it and you never will.

Well, if "getting it" results in the sort of infantile, hyper-emotive and over-dramatic reaction as that in your above tirade, I expect that most of us probably don't "want it".

[SeeBass]

Originally Posted by HOOT

Let's be honest here you know nothing about me or irony. Keep up the good work.

been on this site for years
I know you well

poor work

[SeeBass]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Well, if "getting it" results in the sort of infantile, hyper-emotive and over-dramatic reaction as that in your above tirade, I expect that most of us probably don't "want it".

I wouldn't wish it on anybody.

[HOOT]

Originally Posted by SeeBass

been on this site for years
I know you well

poor work

Again, no you don't. Just because you follow me on a forum doesn't mean you actually know me. But you are right you probably know everything about me. I'm done with you, you aren't worth the text on the screen.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by SeeBass

...You are full of crap if that is how you saw the tones in Locke's post

Well then, I anxiously await an elaboration to help set me straight.

I will repeat my earlier question:

Originally Posted by Textcritic

...Please show me the said "horribly insulting comments":

Locke's entire comment that caused such a stir:

Originally Posted by Locke

Ah, age, its a funny thing no? As time passes things from long ago get better, Cheese tastes better with age, as does fine wine, and like all things the memories of the Winnipeg Jets become fonder and fonder...

That is, until people realize that they werent that good to begin with and they aren't that good right now, in fact, they've really never been any good....

...I'm afraid I don't get it. And judging from the response of several others on this thread, I expect that I am likely not in the minority. You really need to provide some clarification, especially considering how much this rather tedious issue bothers you. In order to avoid any future defamations, I think you owe it to all of us to help us understand. I for one do not want to be guilty of trampling so wantonly and callously on someone's "heritage".