Top Prospects in the Flames system

[xxdanglerxx]

I would like to know where everyone feels are prospects lay in order. This is my list -

1.Sven Baertschi
2.Sean Monahan
3.John Gaudreau
4.Jon Gillies
5.Mark Jankowski
6.Corban Night
7.Pat Sieloff
8.Tyler Wotherspoon
9.Morgan Klimchuck
10.Markus Granlund
11.Max Reinhart
12.Emile Poirier
13.Kenny Agostino
14.Ben Hanowski
15.Laurent Brossoit
16.Ryan Culkin
17.Joni Ortio
18.Michael Ferland
19.John Ramage
20.Tim Harrison
21.Turner Elson
22.Brett Kulak
23.Matt Deblouw
24.Coda Gordon
25.Rushan Rafikov
26.John Gilmour

[mdubz]

This is all going on here
http://forum.calgarypuck.com/showthread.php?t=129397

[kyuss275]

Even though this has been done to death in other threads, it is nice to see a list with Wotherspoon and Sieloff in the top 10.

I actually would put Wotherspoon in the top 5. I think he is going to be a steady #2 d-man for the flames for many many years. Now the flames need to find his partner.

Also think Culkin should be higher than 16th. He could be Brodie 2.0.

[the-rasta-masta]

I'd have Horak in there somewhere, possibly above Hanowski. Unless you've considered him graduated?

[JiriHrdina]

The Flames have hinted that they think Gillies may be the top prospect in the organization - perhaps before this last draft, but he he's up there.

Top 4 guys probably indeed are Sven, Monahan, Gaudreau and Gillies.

Two late round steals there that could be franchise changing picks if they reach upside.

[the_only_turek_fan]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

The Flames have hinted that they think Gillies may be the top prospect in the organization - perhaps before this last draft, but he he's up there.

Top 4 guys probably indeed are Sven, Monahan, Gaudreau and Gillies.

Two late round steals there that could be franchise changing picks if they reach upside.

You think he is that good?

I have not really seen much of him, but if the Flames are higher on him than they are on Baertschi, then we may have a #1 goaltender.

[Husky]

Gilles is looking like a young J Quick. Where he reaches that potential is unkown.

I think Ramage is under rated around here.

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Husky

Gilles is looking like a young J Quick. Where he reaches that potential is unkown.

I think Ramage is under rated around here.

Ramage should be deserving of being in the top 15 on any Flames prospect list. But I'm not sure many people would agree with you or I.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by the_only_turek_fan

You think he is that good?

I have not really seen much of him, but if the Flames are higher on him than they are on Baertschi, then we may have a #1 goaltender.

I think he is that good.

Hard to call him our best prospect, simply because you never know with goalies.

But he has the potential to be a true #1 and a special player IMO.

[Enoch Root]

Regardless of where you want to rank individuals on the list, it is great to see that, even when you get down into the 15-20 range, you are still talking about decent prospects that have a legitimate shot at making the NHL.

[the_only_turek_fan]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

I think he is that good.

Hard to call him our best prospect, simply because you never know with goalies.

But he has the potential to be a true #1 and a special player IMO.

Then how did he go 75th overall?

[FakenHaken]

Originally Posted by the_only_turek_fan

Then how did he go 75th overall?

In the same way Jonathan Quick went 72nd overall. It is difficult to scout goalies I presume and to get it right.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by the_only_turek_fan

Then how did he go 75th overall?

Quick went 72nd and was playing for the Kings 3 years later. Ask Robitaille how he feels about draft positions.

But yes. A year, even a good one, removed from 75th overall probably shouldn't raise his stock up as highly as some believe he has. On the other hand, as a big goalie even a little bit of development in some of his weaker areas go a long ways. And really only a couple goalies were drafted well ahead of him, 2 in the first round, 2 in the second.

[sketchyt]

I watched the prospect camp very closely. If Jon Gillies isn't the Flames' top prospect, he's certainly one to get very excited about.

Goaltenders are tough to read because you don't know how they'll adapt to tougher shots and situations at higher levels. There's always only one other guy to compare them to (on the other end).

So the prospect camp was illuminating for me. A 26 year old guy like Reto Berra, who has played professional hockey played really well. Didn't get scored on too much... as you should expect from a pro guy playing against 18-22 year olds with little to no pro experience.

I felt like Gillies played almost as well as Berra during the camp. Good mobility, positionally solid, calm, flexible, ok puckhandling skills, etc... as a 19 year old. Pretty impressive.

I see more of a Jimmy Howard type with him.

[Dienasty]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

Quick went 72nd and was playing for the Kings 3 years later. Ask Robitaille how he feels about draft positions.

But yes. A year, even a good one, removed from 75th overall probably shouldn't raise his stock up as highly as some believe he has. On the other hand, as a big goalie even a little bit of development in some of his weaker areas go a long ways. And really only a couple goalies were drafted well ahead of him, 2 in the first round, 2 in the second.

When you are a feshman in the NCAA, are your teams MVP, got numerous awards for player of the month, defensive player of the month etc. Carried his young team to the Frozen 4 tournament (knocked out in the round of 8 I think), plus he was the back up for team USA in the WJC. Yeah your stock can jump up after one year.

Remember when he was drafted he was only playing in the USHL...a true freshman starting goalie is huge accomplishment in the NCAA, let alone performing at elite levels.

I am extremely high on this guy, he is huge with insane athletisism and reflexes. Needs to work on positioning, and technique but there is limit to his upside.

[DazzlinDino]

As we are talking about Gillies, I was looking at Reto Berra highlights and was thinking about about his rebound control. It got me thinking the Flames should consider hiring Kipper as a goaltender coach or as a goalie scout. As a scout he can stay close to his home town but he also would be an excellent addition to coach future goaltenders. Considering it's tough to find goalies that are consistently on that "next level". Kipper understands the position as well as anyone.

[Robbob]

Originally Posted by DazzlinDino

As we are talking about Gillies, I was looking at Reto Berra highlights and was thinking about about his rebound control. It got me thinking the Flames should consider hiring Kipper as a goaltender coach or as a goalie scout. As a scout he can stay close to his home town but he also would be an excellent addition to coach future goaltenders. Considering it's tough to find goalies that are consistently on that "next level". Kipper understands the position as well as anyone.

The problem with star players is they just have the ability to do so, not something you can teach easily. I remember Gretzky once talked on being a head coach and had to rethink the way we taught because a lot of players don't have that natural ability. Gretzky said early on he got frustrated because he didn't understand why a player wouldn't just do what he would have done.

Regarding scouting, was Kipper not the one who turned the flames onto Ortio?

[The Yen Man]

Originally Posted by FakenHaken

In the same way Jonathan Quick went 72nd overall. It is difficult to scout goalies I presume and to get it right.

I think out of all the positions, goaltending is the one that is affected the most by mental strength. When scouting, it's easy to gauge physical attributes, but mental strength is harder to flesh out. Sure they do interviews, but it really is hard to determine whether a guy has the mental toughness to excel at the NHL level. A goalie may be mentally strong leading up to his draft year because he dominated in junior, but he may crack later on when he faces NHL competition. On the flip side, another goalie may mature later on, and all of a sudden be lights out when he hits his twenties.

[robbie111]

1.John Gaudreau
2.Jon Gillies
3.Markus Granlund
4.Sven Baertschi
5.Pat Sieloff
6.Corban Night
7.Kenny Agostino
8.Tim Harrison
9.Mark Jankowski
10. John Ramage


These are my top 10 in how I think they will develop and what impact they'll have as NHLer's. I think Johnny Hockey, Jon Gillies and Granlund are going to be superstars. Granlund will turn out to be better than his highly touted brother. Bear will be an excellent top 6 throughout his career, and Sieloff will be a top pairing defenceman.
I don't think Monahan is going to amount to more than a 3rd line center. That's just a guess, we'll see in 4 or 5 years.

Also of our current youngster's I think Brodie is going to become a top 5 defenceman in the league if he can stay healthy. I haven't seen anyone skate like him since Paul Coffey, I don't even think Scott Niedermayer skated as well as Brodie does now.

I'm hoping Backlund can break through this season and also stay healthy and see him as a 60-70 point guy in the near future.

I liked the way Horak was using his strength and size on the boards last year in the games I saw and if he can be encouraged to keep up that style he could become a very good top 6 forward. His hockey sense could use a bit of improving and if that happens he can be very good.

So I guess I'm fairly optimistic when it comes to the future of the flames.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by Dienasty

When you are a feshman in the NCAA, are your teams MVP, got numerous awards for player of the month, defensive player of the month etc. Carried his young team to the Frozen 4 tournament (knocked out in the round of 8 I think), plus he was the back up for team USA in the WJC. Yeah your stock can jump up after one year.

Remember when he was drafted he was only playing in the USHL...a true freshman starting goalie is huge accomplishment in the NCAA, let alone performing at elite levels.

I am extremely high on this guy, he is huge with insane athletisism and reflexes. Needs to work on positioning, and technique but there is limit to his upside.

Absolutely. I didn't mean to suggest that he shouldn't have. I just don't know how high his stock was actually raised. If there was a 2012 draft redo knowing what we know now, when you think he's getting drafted? While I haven't followed him as closely as you and I'm never very high on goalies in the draft anyways, I would be hesitant in labeling him even a late "first rounder." And if I'm not willing to do that, I'm definitely not putting him over the likes of Monahan or Baerstchi as the top prospect or even in the same discussion. Others may feel differently and I'll likely change my tune if he has another good season but until then I feel he's closer to Jankowski than the top.